See: http://www.kpvi.com/Global/story.asp?S=12176595
She's alive due to being spotted from the air by a CAP aircraft. Fortunately she had bright orange on and the aircraft spotted her. It did not appear that she was able to wave at the plane.
Excellent work by ID wing!!! :clap: :clap: :clap:
RM
Maybe we should wear orange.
Are we lost???
As much as everyoe hates to hear it (me included to a certain extent) this is one of the prime arguments that HMRS has used for the orange hats and orange t-shirts. They even did some pictures via aircraft that showed the advantages over orange vests....
mk
Quote from: sarmed1 on March 22, 2010, 01:21:26 AM
As much as everyoe hates to hear it (me included to a certain extent) this is one of the prime arguments that HMRS has used for the orange hats and orange t-shirts. They even did some pictures via aircraft that showed the advantages over orange vests....
mk
And when it is authorized for wear in CAPM 39-1, we'll wear it, until then it's just a PAWG thing.
That was the third time she got lost?
Quote from: PHall on March 22, 2010, 01:29:57 AM
Quote from: sarmed1 on March 22, 2010, 01:21:26 AM
As much as everyoe hates to hear it (me included to a certain extent) this is one of the prime arguments that HMRS has used for the orange hats and orange t-shirts. They even did some pictures via aircraft that showed the advantages over orange vests....
mk
And when it is authorized for wear in CAPM 39-1, we'll wear it, until then it's just a PAWG thing.
Lucky us in Illinois we have a wing supplement authorizing orange ballcaps while performing GT missions :). Maybe you could get it approved in yours?
Quote from: PHall on March 22, 2010, 01:29:57 AM
Quote from: sarmed1 on March 22, 2010, 01:21:26 AM
As much as everyoe hates to hear it (me included to a certain extent) this is one of the prime arguments that HMRS has used for the orange hats and orange t-shirts. They even did some pictures via aircraft that showed the advantages over orange vests....
mk
And when it is authorized for wear in CAPM 39-1, we'll wear it, until then it's just a PAWG thing.
It
shouldn't be a PAWG thing until it's approved by the Air Force. The uniform manual is subject to their oversight and requires their approval. It is very clear on t-shirt color.
Baseball cap color is up to the commander as allowed by 39-1, so that's all well and good, but t-shirts are another story. This is why we have orange vests.
In just 4 short posts, even a thread about a great Idaho Wing save becomes a uniform thread..... ;D
This is an excellent point on why we wear orange vest whilst on ground teams. Visibility in the air. Also some food for thought, how many people have an orange vest in their flight kit? I'm not just talking about while flying CAP aircraft, but when flying anytime.
There is/was a powerpoint geared toward training new Mission Scanners that had different photo's of the same person at 1000' AGL wearing different colored outer garments. Orange BY FAR was the most visible.
now before this devolves into a uniform thread:
We already wear orange vests on GT's
Another organization already lays claim on the Orange Uniform.... The Federal Penn
And before my post derails the topic further: Good on the aircrew and people involved with the search. Missing person searches don't always have happy endings.
According to the blurb in News of the Force, she's a "frequent flyer". She's gotten lost and had to be found in 2005 and 2007.
She got some nasty frost bite on her feet this time, so her hiking days may be over.
..I should clarify my previous statement....the pictures I saw showed the advantages of orange hats over orange vests. (and I imagine BDU hats) Think about how much of the vest is visable from the air if you are standing upright...likely a 2"x3" area over each shoulder, (and thats assuming no backpack or LBE trype straps covering over it) the bulk of the vest is only visable from the ground......
mk
I've always thought 39-1 should authorize hard hats in International Orange for ES rather than the stupid white helmet liners currently mentioned on page 13 of 39-1. At that time, the dog patch decal should be deleted as well. Has anyone who contributed to the uniform manual ever looked for white from the air? It sucks.
My mother-in-law lives in the area off that road (Mink Creek). That country gets rough pretty quick. Fortunately, there's not a lot of tree cover in that area. A brown shirt and khaki pants would have been the end of her.
Quote from: Spaceman3750 on March 22, 2010, 03:53:46 AMLucky us in Illinois we have a wing supplement authorizing orange ballcaps while performing GT missions :). Maybe you could get it approved in yours?
Don't need a supplement for that. Hat color is approved at the squadron level.....it's the T-shirt most people have heartburn over.
Not I......of all the HMRS stuff....the orange T-shirt is lowest on my list of pet peeves.
Quote from: lordmonar on March 23, 2010, 10:50:04 PM
Don't need a supplement for that. Hat color is approved at the squadron level.....it's the T-shirt most people have heartburn over.
Interesting that wing commanders are very limited in what they can authorize but unit commanders can authorize any type of baseball cap they want.
Quote from: RiverAux on March 23, 2010, 11:42:39 PM
Quote from: lordmonar on March 23, 2010, 10:50:04 PM
Don't need a supplement for that. Hat color is approved at the squadron level.....it's the T-shirt most people have heartburn over.
Interesting that wing commanders are very limited in what they can authorize but unit commanders can authorize any type of baseball cap they want.
Check page 41.
Quote from: CAPM 39-1, Fig 2-26, note 44. CAP Baseball Cap: May be worn with the utility uniforms if authorized by the unit commander. The color, material, unit designation, or silk screen organizational emblem or badge will be prescribed by the unit commander. Emblem or badge, if authorized, will be centered 1/2 inch above visor.
Out of curiosity, who holds that authority on an ES mission, because you are typically operating outside the squadron structure in that case. IC? Generally, uniform stuff the SQ/CC approves is only good within the squadron, IIRC.
You got remember that until the ABU....USAF squadron CC's got to pick their hat colors too.
Never saw any Hunter Orange....but there used to be just about every color under the sun.
And IMHO the restrictions of the Wing CC was attempt to bring some of the wilder things under control....but it failed because if there is no one willing to weild the hammer it does not really matter what the regulations say.
In any event....for the most part CAP does a pretty good job of controling this sort of thing. Most of what CAP does that is "outside" the regulations is about on par what I saw on AD with individual squadrons and wings.
At the last air show....the new "bling" for the air show was T-shirts with a squadron logo of some sort right in the middle of the chest of their T-shifts where it would be visible when the flight suit was zipped down about 8 inches.
Completely outside the AFIs.....but no one cared. Same story for the continued use of morale patches on the velcro tab where the pencile flap is supposed to attach.
Bottom line....is that the USAF has had years to tell CAP that they don't like the orange T-shirts......AFAIK nothing official or simi offical has come down with enough weight to force national to do anything about it. So I don't really worry about it.
I'll police my guys....and let them have some fun...but beyond that....I don't really care.
Quote from: Spaceman3750 on March 23, 2010, 11:56:19 PM
Out of curiosity, who holds that authority on an ES mission, because you are typically operating outside the squadron structure in that case. IC? Generally, uniform stuff the SQ/CC approves is only good within the squadron, IIRC.
The IC is the all seeing GOD at the mission base. Beyond that it would follow the IC chain of command. That is....one of the duties of GBD is to ensure that his ground crews present a professional appearance before he allows them to sortie. But as a GBD I don't carry it too far (I don't make them all wear BDU covers, or loose their berets if they have them.) I do have some Go/No Go for things like knives on belts, road flares and the such...but not hats and T-shirts.
Quote from: SarDragon on March 23, 2010, 11:53:02 PM
Quote from: RiverAux on March 23, 2010, 11:42:39 PM
Quote from: lordmonar on March 23, 2010, 10:50:04 PM
Don't need a supplement for that. Hat color is approved at the squadron level.....it's the T-shirt most people have heartburn over.
Interesting that wing commanders are very limited in what they can authorize but unit commanders can authorize any type of baseball cap they want.
Check page 41.
Quote from: CAPM 39-1, Fig 2-26, note 44. CAP Baseball Cap: May be worn with the utility uniforms if authorized by the unit commander. The color, material, unit designation, or silk screen organizational emblem or badge will be prescribed by the unit commander. Emblem or badge, if authorized, will be centered 1/2 inch above visor.
That was what I wasa referring to.
Somehow, I read your post differently when I made that post. Oh, well.