Corporate Gray Uniform

[Major Carrales]

I transferred (due to a move) from a very squared-away composite squadron to a senior squadron that was probably about 3/4 pilots and had its own airplane.

I showed up at my first meeting in blues, with everything worn as correctly as I could make it, and I was the only one in the room in blues...and one of the only ones in a complete uniform.

Others were in various permutations of:

Flight suits, sometimes without any insignia except leather nameplate
Polo shirts of various kinds (this was about 10 years ago), usually worn with blue jeans
"Civil Air Patrol" tee shirts
Civilian clothes, but with a CAP baseball cap, which they believed covered (no pun intended) the requirement that they be in a CAP uniform when flying

However, the squadron commander usually wore grey/whites and wore them well (former Marine).  I saw him in blues once and he said he was reluctant to do that because "it's an Air Force uniform, and I'm not in the Air Force."

After he left, it was mostly uniforms-optional, and it wasn't because so many were out of H/W or grooming requirements...they just didn't want to wear uniforms.

I was asked at least once why I bothered to wear the blue uniform.

First of all, I don't believe for a second they believed what you say in the case of "Civilian clothes, but with a CAP baseball cap, which they believed covered (no pun intended) the requirement that they be in a CAP uniform when flying."

No doubt they were pulling your leg.  They picked up real fast that you were out of place.

And second of all, who was the one who was out of step?  Perhaps excusable, since you say it was your first meeting.

But your subsequent whining is not.

I'm not a pilot, but I have served in CAP since 1998, risen to the grade of Major and the rank of Squadron Commander without a pilot's rating.

What I am going to write I hope will only have to be written once en re this nonsense about "pilot worth." What I have read above is moot and specious on both party's part.  It is obvious to me that all CAP officers who participate have an inherent worth to the program.  If you are a pilot then your main modus operandi is to fly, if you choose to or are able to.  Your job cannot be performed without the flight crew and, unless you can address an ELT from the pilot's seat you need ground team and COMM personnel to accomplish the mission.  Plus, if your Squadron Commander is not "on the ball" you could loose your aircraft or your quals will never get approved.  If Finances are not running correctly you are in a world of hurt to fly.

COMM and Ground Team folks are not off the hook either, they need Air Support...after all there is that little caveat about not trespassing into farmer's fields and the like.  Or that impassable terrain that an aircraft can scale in seconds while your average ground team would require hours to mitigate.  Try operating a CAP mission like hurricane relief without and Airborne repeater.

My point, illustrated above, is that we operate as a well oiled machine to accomplish the mission.  No part is greater than any other and they work like a puzzle to complete the necessary picture.

I will add this, however, "flying clubs" and "elite ground teams" that never deploy are not part of the picture.  If all you do is show up to "fly for cheap" and the idea of having to listen to Air Branch is an affront to you or really want to dress "like Rambo" and hate the idea of having to train in GES and ICS because you consider that "BS," then you are not a team player and then we have a problem.

[AlphaSigOU]

Well said, Maj. C!

Unfortunately there is a subculture, perpetuated in some squadrons that's rubbed off from Ma Blue - if you don't sport the 'universal management badge' (pilot's wings) you only exist to support them. Observer? Scanner? You're just self-loading cargo put there to keep Big Bad Pilot from getting lost! The attitude sometimes extends to squadrons with ground teams - if you ain't got a GT badge, you ain't [fill in the rest]!

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

First of all, I don't believe for a second they believed what you say in the case of "Civilian clothes, but with a CAP baseball cap, which they believed covered (no pun intended) the requirement that they be in a CAP uniform when flying."

No doubt they were pulling your leg.  They picked up real fast that you were out of place.

And second of all, who was the one who was out of step?  Perhaps excusable, since you say it was your first meeting.

But your subsequent whining is not.

Whether they, or you, believe it or not does not affect the truth factor of the statement.

And there is no need to label an opinion differing with your own as "whining," nor are you one to stand in judgement of my "excuseability" or lack thereof.

And, actually, I did learn that I was "out of step"...as AlphaSigOU said about the pilot subculture, which is why I subsequently left the unit and resolved to not join another senior squadron if I could help it.

If I were a pilot, I really doubt if the members of this former unit would have cared whether or not I wore a blue uniform or not; even if I had shown up in a track suit and CAP baseball cap, as long as I would have held a pilot's rating, I would have been "one of them."  I didn't, so I wasn't.

Major C. is also correct with what he says about the whole needing the coherent parts.

This will be my last statement to you on the subject.

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

Actually, I think your original point was that all of the attendees at an SLS wore polos, but not all were pilots. I believe that the implied point was that not everyone who wears a polo is a pilot. Am I right?

My point is that pilots are no more or less indispensable to CAP than non-pilots in terms of making the whole bit run.  Major C. said it better than I can.

A subheading would be that if you're going to be part of CAP, part of that is wearing an approved uniform, whatever form that may take.

[DG]

And, actually, I did learn that I was "out of step"...as AlphaSigOU said about the pilot subculture, which is why I subsequently left the unit and resolved to not join another senior squadron if I could help it.

Good for you.  At least it was a learning experience for you.

And I am sure the members of the unit are equally relieved that you left.  Particularly the pilots.

[Gunner C]

And I am sure the members of the unit are equally relieved that you left.  Particularly the pilots.

Yeah, the nerve of those non-pilots!  Who do they think they are?  [/sarcasm]

[Mustang]

Uniforms are part of Civil Air Patrol. 
They have been from the beginning.  

Uh, got proof of that?  I think you'll find that not to be the actual case.  I don't think uniforms came into the picture until mid-1942, if I'm not mistaken.

CAP is not solely a pilot's organisation.

Air Ops is not the only thing that CAP does.

Some CAP members spend their entire CAP career without ever setting foot in an airplane, yet serve with distinction (our National Commander does not hold any aeronautical rating).

True enough, but like it or not, Air Ops is CAP's primary mission. Has been from the beginning. (Even before we had uniforms!) It is is CAP's raison d'être. The organization wasn't created to run a cadet program or educate the populace about aviation; those missions came later.  First and foremost, CAP is an aviation organization. Always will be. Kill off CP and AE, and we'd still be the Civil Air Patrol, just as when we began. But without airplanes and pilots, that wouldn't be the case.

Honestly, I don't understand why people knowingly join an aviation organization, only to make every effort to knock its aviation-oriented culture at every opportunity. 

[BillB]

Mustang
Hate to bust ya bubble but uniforms were worn from the beginning. Not USAAC uniforms but the authorized Civil Defense uniform. What do you think the CAP emblem was for?  The USAAC did authorize CAP to wear the military uniform in 1942. Unofficially, CAP started wearing the military uniform in very early 1942.

[JoeTomasone]

Incidentally, the best way I have seen the UOD categorized is:

"Dress Uniform": Blues/Greys/CSU, Blazer

"Field/Utility Uniform": BDUs, BBDUs, Utility Uniform

"Flight Suit": Green or Blue

"Casual": Polo shirt

So, for example: "The UOD for this activity will be any authorized CAP Dress Uniform" or "...will be any authorized Field/Utility or Casual Uniform".

[Eclipse]

True enough, but like it or not, Air Ops is CAP's primary mission.

No, its not.  Its currently a portion of 1/3rd of our "mission".

[RogueLeader]

True enough, but like it or not, Air Ops is CAP's primary mission.

No, its not.  Its currently a portion of 1/3rd of our "mission".

opps didn't fully read coment.  sorry.

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

Honestly, I don't understand why people knowingly join an aviation organization, only to make every effort to knock its aviation-oriented culture at every opportunity.

First of all, I joined CAP in 1993 knowing full well what it was.  I also joined a composite squadron whose commander was a rated Senior Pilot (later Command Pilot) who then became Wingco.

One later-joined member was a graduate of Embry-Riddle...and a rated pilot.

I am a rated Observer, and whether you like that or not, that is an aircrew position.

I joined CAP because of its aviation-orientated culture, not despite it.

I am a pilot's son.

What I did have a problem with was the flying club senior squadron where, mixed in with a bit of operational flying, the pilots thought the squadron, airplane, and CAP as a whole were there just for them to build up their hours on the Air Force's nickel and to sign up their significant others so they could fly in CAP aircraft...but never take part in any other CAP activities, including coming to meetings, professional development, etc.

I don't even call that "Air Ops" or "aviation culture."  I call that a bunch of dilettantes.

[Thrashed]

I wouldn't call flying CAP planes for "building hours/flying club" cheap.  The CAP Maules and C182's cost more than the Cherokees and C172's at the FBO's.  But the CAP prices are about 1/2 the price of a FBO equivelant aircraft.  About 7 of my 13,000 hours are in CAP planes. 

[Short Field]

Only 7 hours on CAP's dime out of 13,000 hours?  I have seen MPs who have logged more than that in one day!

[ZigZag911]

Mustang: CAP's primary missions are Cadet Programs, Aerospace Education, and Emergency Services. While air operations are pivotal to all three missions, flying in and of itself is not the only thing --- often not even the main thing -- CAP does.

[PHall]

Honestly, I don't understand why people knowingly join an aviation organization, only to make every effort to knock its aviation-oriented culture at every opportunity.

Did you ever rejoin or are you still a "former" member?

[Mustang]

I'm paid up now.

[flyguy06]

Well said, Maj. C!

Unfortunately there is a subculture, perpetuated in some squadrons that's rubbed off from Ma Blue - if you don't sport the 'universal management badge' (pilot's wings) you only exist to support them. Observer? Scanner? You're just self-loading cargo put there to keep Big Bad Pilot from getting lost! The attitude sometimes extends to squadrons with ground teams - if you ain't got a GT badge, you ain't [fill in the rest]!

I dont know if I agree with that or not. If you lok at the majority of Wing and region CC's how many are rated as opposed to not beig rated?

[flyguy06]

btw, how did a thread titled Corporate Grey Uniform turn into a discussion about the worth of CAP pilots?

[RiverAux]

Mustang
Hate to bust ya bubble but uniforms were worn from the beginning. Not USAAC uniforms but the authorized Civil Defense uniform. What do you think the CAP emblem was for?  The USAAC did authorize CAP to wear the military uniform in 1942. Unofficially, CAP started wearing the military uniform in very early 1942.

Well, pretty close to the beginning...it did take a few months to figure things out as you might expect (Its not like someone dropped off a shipment of uniforms on 12/2/41).  But, essentially you're right that as soon as CAP was really functional, we were wearing military uniforms....