The Uniform Team

[Larry Mangum]

Col Merle Starr, is the head of the uniform committee. It has concluded its work and has presented its work for approval.

If that's the same Merle Starr that I knew back in Georgia Wing in the 80s, he's a good man.  A darned good man.  He'll do a great job heading the uniform committee.

Jack

It's the same man. Since Georgia, he has been the washington Wing Commander, Pacific Region Vice Commander, and the Pacific Region Commander.  If you knew Merle, you might not know that Pat, passed on last November.

[Eclipse]

I can envision a CAP Uniform STAN/EVAL Team being born to do just that, enforce uniform standards at Encampments, NCSA's, etc.

haha! NY Encampment already beat you to the gun  ! We has a full cadet SET team WITH Senior Member supervision to do that! And enforce D&C, sleeping area alignments, C&C, knowledge, etc.

Most encampments already have such a thing, I was a member of one several years ago.

I'm talking one purely for Uniforms, and one put together at perhaps a Regional level to enforce uniform standards.

Good luck with that, considering encampments are some of the worst violators with funny colored t-shirts, grade on hats, etc., etc.  Some NCSA's are even worse with custom non-uniforms.

An encampment should be the standard by which members can judge their own uniforms, sadly that's not the case.

[Major Carrales]

The Texas Wing Commander is said to ground CAP personnel who are not in uniform.

[BrandonKea]

The Texas Wing Commander is said to ground CAP personnel who are not in uniform.

Kudos to him then. I think more of our Senior Leadership could follow this example. :-)

[dogden]

But I sure didnt see him out on my flightline checking crews prior to launch during the sar eval!

[AlphaSigOU]

But I sure didnt see him out on my flightline checking crews prior to launch during the sar eval!

No, but the perceived threat of the 'Wing King' cracking down (and I believe he has already done so) is enough to keep the members in line. 

[ColonelJack]

It's the same man. Since Georgia, he has been the washington Wing Commander, Pacific Region Vice Commander, and the Pacific Region Commander.  If you knew Merle, you might not know that Pat, passed on last November.

No, I did not know that.  I am very, very sorry to hear this; I remember Pat as a very nice person!  If you speak to Merle any time soon (and if he somehow remembers me), please pass along my deepest condolences.

Jack

[Major Carrales]

But I sure didnt see him out on my flightline checking crews prior to launch during the sar eval!

From what I've heard, he has been grounding lots of folks for violation of regulations or policy.  I saw him at Stinson at the last DSAR we had a few months ago and he was on top of things.

[BuckeyeDEJ]

It's just a crying shame that people who are already active in CAP are being "grounded," and that there are specially appointed people to enforce policy that is elemental to CAP membership. This stuff should be handled early in a member's CAP career, before he/she even gets a chance to wear a uniform.

Blame squadron commanders for not enforcing policy and not standing up for it. Blame deputy commanders for not helping their commanders enforce standards (squadron commanders have so much going on that they can't get to everything in a two-hour meeting). Blame ourselves for not reinforcing standards with each other -- and for allowing a "uniform police" to manifest itself.

[Spike]

No, but the perceived threat of the 'Wing King' cracking down (and I believe he has already done so) is enough to keep the members in line. 

That's right........tell a volunteer to go home because they do not have the correct patch on and you will soon find yourself short of volunteers.  Lets remember.....Volunteer.  This is not the Air Force.  Enforcing standards in CAP is important......but do it the right way.  Telling the member to correct something is different than telling them to go home.

If I was in the wrong and the Wing King told me to go home over something trivial, that may have been an honest mistake......I would go home, but may not return.  Now if the Wing King told me to "fix it in the future".....I would heed his or her advice.  To turn people away is not a good practice.

[arajca]

No, but the perceived threat of the 'Wing King' cracking down (and I believe he has already done so) is enough to keep the members in line. 

That's right........tell a volunteer to go home because they do not have the correct patch on and you will soon find yourself short of volunteers.  Lets remember.....Volunteer.  This is not the Air Force.  Enforcing standards in CAP is important......but do it the right way.  Telling the member to correct something is different than telling them to go home.

If I was in the wrong and the Wing King told me to go home over something trivial, that may have been an honest mistake......I would go home, but may not return.  Now if the Wing King told me to "fix it in the future".....I would heed his or her advice.  To turn people away is not a good practice.

The few times I have seen members sent home were not over something trivial like a patch.  They were over significant violations, like wearing an CA GT uniform in CO. Was Ok at one time, but hasn't been for years. Or wearing an orange flight suit. Or wearing a green flight suit when the member weighed over 300lbs.

[Gunner C]

It only works, IMO, if you tell people in advance that violators will be sent home.  If you just spring it on them, you'll have nothing but crickets (and a few very skinny CAP officers left).  Be smart and courteous - don't embarrass folks.

[arajca]

The announcements for these specify uniforms must be worn IAW CAPR 39-1.

[Gunner C]

Does it specify that they'll be sent home?  I'm not disagreeing with it, just don't waste someone's time and effort if uniform violations have been winked at in the past.  If the penalty is known beforehand, then they'll have no argument.

When I ran my group's aircrew course, I told everyone that the uniform was flight suits and nothing else would be allowed (no smurf suits).  There were no problems.  The PGA commandos either stayed home or got their training elsewhere. 

[PHall]

Does it specify that they'll be sent home?  I'm not disagreeing with it, just don't waste someone's time and effort if uniform violations have been winked at in the past.  If the penalty is known beforehand, then they'll have no argument.

When I ran my group's aircrew course, I told everyone that the uniform was flight suits and nothing else would be allowed (no smurf suits).  There were no problems.  The PGA commandos either stayed home or got their training elsewhere.

You shouldn't have to tell an ADULT that they will be sent home if they are not in a proper uniform.
A 13 year old Cadet Basic, maybe, but a 40 year old adult, I don't think so...

If you can't do something as simple as wear the proper uniform, then why should we trust you with our very expensive airplane?

It's all about attitudes...

[N Harmon]

When I ran my group's aircrew course, I told everyone that the uniform was flight suits and nothing else would be allowed (no smurf suits).  There were no problems.  The PGA commandos either stayed home or got their training elsewhere.

Because anybody who wants to train to be on an aircrew should have to buy a flightsuit. 

[Spike]

When I ran my group's aircrew course, I told everyone that the uniform was flight suits and nothing else would be allowed (no smurf suits).  There were no problems.  The PGA commandos either stayed home or got their training elsewhere.

Because anybody who wants to train to be on an aircrew should have to buy a flightsuit. 

Good Question.  I guess in Gunners world that is the case!

[JohnKachenmeister]

I think it is all a matter of judgement.

No, we usually do not take drastic action for a trivial violation of 39-1.

But drastic violations call for drastic actions.

[Hawk200]

I think it is all a matter of judgement.

No, we usually do not take drastic action for a trivial violation of 39-1.

But drastic violations call for drastic actions.

I'll second that one. There are too many blind eyes turned on severe violations. The most common ones I see are outdated uniforms (and configurations), uniforms mixed, and the all too common "I'm only a few pounds overweight".

Why is it acceptable for people to discard what they wish, and only follow what they desire? Is our culture so egocentric nowadays that it's acceptable?

I agree that CAP is not the military, but the volunteerism is the same. You make a choice to be part of something. Even with everyone in the same uniform, there is still individualism. Many don't seem to see that. We're all different types of people working together with common goals. Too bad many aren't working with common ethics.

[Rotorhead]

I think it is all a matter of judgement.

No, we usually do not take drastic action for a trivial violation of 39-1.

But drastic violations call for drastic actions.

I'll second that one. There are too many blind eyes turned on severe violations. The most common ones I see are outdated uniforms (and configurations), uniforms mixed, and the all too common "I'm only a few pounds overweight".

Why is it acceptable for people to discard what they wish, and only follow what they desire? Is our culture so egocentric nowadays that it's acceptable?

Because people are so wrapped up in the "but they might quit" mindset that it hasn't occurred to them that the people we really want to keep  either (a) wouldn't quit, or (b) wouldn't be a problem in the first place.