Flight Suit Badges

[ColonelJack]

Somehow I imagine an overweight white haired Senior member getting naked painting himself blue and charging headlong into Maxwell wielding a battleaxe.
     

You mean he's not wearing a great kilt and screaming, "FREEEEEEDOMMMMM!!!!!"?

Jack

[JC004]

Somehow I imagine an overweight white haired Senior member getting naked painting himself blue and charging headlong into Maxwell wielding a battleaxe.
     

Someone has to let them know how we feel about things...

[LtCol White]

Somehow I imagine an overweight white haired Senior member getting naked painting himself blue and charging headlong into Maxwell wielding a battleaxe.
     

Someone has to let them know how we feel about things...

Shouldnt he be wearing a safety orange color thong??? 

[JC004]

Somehow I imagine an overweight white haired Senior member getting naked painting himself blue and charging headlong into Maxwell wielding a battleaxe.
     

Someone has to let them know how we feel about things...

Shouldnt he be wearing a safety orange color thong??? 

...and orange hat...oh!...and orange shirt.

[JarakMaldon]

Personally I feel the best solution is a subdued tape reading either USAF Aux or even Civil Air Patrol, as long as its subdued."

Very doubtful this will ever happen.  Perhaps if (and that is a very big if) the CAP adopts the ABU, you will see nametapes that are not white-on-ultramarine.  The AF wants to ensure the difference betwen a CAP person and an AF person is painfully clear. 

USAF Aux? Sorry, no. "Civil Air Patrol" is the name of the organization, "USAF Aux" comes after the comma.  Besdies, CAP isn't always operating under the umbrella of Mother AF.  "CAP" or "USCAP" belongs on a uniform, that is what you are all the time, "USAF Aux" does not.

[LtCol White]

Personally I feel the best solution is a subdued tape reading either USAF Aux or even Civil Air Patrol, as long as its subdued."

Very doubtful this will ever happen.  Perhaps if (and that is a very big if) the CAP adopts the ABU, you will see nametapes that are not white-on-ultramarine.  The AF wants to ensure the difference betwen a CAP person and an AF person is painfully clear. 

USAF Aux? Sorry, no. "Civil Air Patrol" is the name of the organization, "USAF Aux" comes after the comma.  Besdies, CAP isn't always operating under the umbrella of Mother AF.  "CAP" or "USCAP" belongs on a uniform, that is what you are all the time, "USAF Aux" does not.

There is no doubt the ABU's will come. It will be after USAF has had some phase in time. USAF has already said so but tabled the issue until a more appropriate time once USAF was ready with their own troops in them.

[Hawk200]

There is no doubt the ABU's will come. It will be after USAF has had some phase in time. USAF has already said so but tabled the issue until a more appropriate time once USAF was ready with their own troops in them.

There is a place or two on the web that will be selling ABU's in a few months. Debating on getting a set. You can get complete uniform, from hat to boots. Just hope nobody gets stupid, and tries to wear their own ABU uniform for CAP. That will get us into hot water.

[SKYKING607]

Vanguard flight suit/jacket badge is brown in color..... due to this fact, I did not order it.

[LtCol White]

There is no doubt the ABU's will come. It will be after USAF has had some phase in time. USAF has already said so but tabled the issue until a more appropriate time once USAF was ready with their own troops in them.

There is a place or two on the web that will be selling ABU's in a few months. Debating on getting a set. You can get complete uniform, from hat to boots. Just hope nobody gets stupid, and tries to wear their own ABU uniform for CAP. That will get us into hot water.

I'd wait and not order them online. They will be in AAFES in the fall.

[LtCol White]

Vanguard flight suit/jacket badge is brown in color..... due to this fact, I did not order it.

The brown is the one for the black leather jacket for the corporate uniform. The one for flight suits is the black one.

[JarakMaldon]

There is no doubt the ABU's will come.

I would not hold my breath on that.  Already the AF is having distribution problems.  I doubt at this point that you will see ABUs in the MCSS this fall.

For CAP, while there have been words given that the organization will adopt this uniform, words can be forgotten.  With the current trend in CAP uniform policy, I would not put it past AF leadership, once the ABU and New Service Dress distribution to the force is well on its way, to tell CAP "you seem to have created your own uniforms for your senior membership (BBDU, TPU), so why do you need ours?"

IMO, CAP has gone Navy with its uniform selection.  Really, there needs to be one service uniform, one utility/field uniform, and one flight uniform that everyone, no matter how they look, can wear.

Cadets: AF Blues / ABU / AF-style Flight Suit
Senior Members: TPU (Fix it first) / BBDU / CAP-style Flight Suit

But again, just my opinion.

[ColonelJack]

Senior Members: TPU (Fix it first) / BBDU / CAP-style Flight Suit

Fix it how?  What would you suggest? 

As a corporate-style uniform that resembles but does not mimic the Air Force uniform -- in other words, has enough noticeable differences that the average person won't think a CAP officer is an AF officer -- the corporate uniform is just fine.

Jack

[Hawk200]

I'd wait and not order them online. They will be in AAFES in the fall.

It would simply be the novelty of having a set hanging in my closet before anyone else. It's currently a personal debate. I may wait until I'm Air Force again before getting a set. That will be a few years.

There is no doubt the ABU's will come.

I would not hold my breath on that.  Already the AF is having distribution problems.  I doubt at this point that you will see ABUs in the MCSS this fall.

There are always distribution problems when anything new is fielded. That's a fact of military life. If you always want the latest and greatest, you're rarely going to get it.

Cadets: AF Blues / ABU / AF-style Flight Suit
Senior Members: TPU (Fix it first) / BBDU / CAP-style Flight Suit

So you would advocate non-uniformity within CAP? That's what your idea would be doing. If seniors aren't wearing the same uniforms as cadets, then there would be identity issues. There are people that don't like the TPU for various reasons. Would you sacrifice a group of seniors for a new batch that just has to have metal grade?

And how would you teach a cadet to wear a uniform that you aren't wearing yourself?

Additionally, you remove the Air Force variants (which is what they are), then the Air Force would have further control issues. The reasoning from the CAP side would be "You don't want us wearing your uniforms, why should you have any control over us?" And that is where CAP as an entity goes extinct.

Besides, the general membership of Civil Air Patrol didn't design and advocate the TPU. I think that there are a number of cooler heads on the AF side that realize this.

[SarDragon]

Senior Members: TPU (Fix it first) / BBDU / CAP-style Flight Suit

Fix it how?  What would you suggest? 

As a corporate-style uniform that resembles but does not mimic the Air Force uniform -- in other words, has enough noticeable differences that the average person won't think a CAP officer is an AF officer -- the corporate uniform is just fine.

Well, then, the rules need to be fixed so all members will be allowed to wear it. Currently, I am not.

[LtCol White]

There is no doubt the ABU's will come.

I would not hold my breath on that.  Already the AF is having distribution problems.  I doubt at this point that you will see ABUs in the MCSS this fall.

For CAP, while there have been words given that the organization will adopt this uniform, words can be forgotten.  With the current trend in CAP uniform policy, I would not put it past AF leadership, once the ABU and New Service Dress distribution to the force is well on its way, to tell CAP "you seem to have created your own uniforms for your senior membership (BBDU, TPU), so why do you need ours?"

IMO, CAP has gone Navy with its uniform selection.  Really, there needs to be one service uniform, one utility/field uniform, and one flight uniform that everyone, no matter how they look, can wear.

Cadets: AF Blues / ABU / AF-style Flight Suit
Senior Members: TPU (Fix it first) / BBDU / CAP-style Flight Suit

But again, just my opinion.

Got news for ya bud. They are already in some MCCS just not DOD wide yet.  And yes, they will come to CAP as will the new service coat.

You're new on here so you might wanna go look at some of the other uniform posts and you'll see lots of ideas about the uniform changes etc. Its pretty much been beat to death. LOL...

[JarakMaldon]

Fix it how?  What would you suggest? 

As a corporate-style uniform that resembles but does not mimic the Air Force uniform -- in other words, has enough noticeable differences that the average person won't think a CAP officer is an AF officer -- the corporate uniform is just fine.

Respectfully non-concur.  While the full-on TPU ensamble represents a distinct enough uniform, the jacket-less versions, IMO, do not.  The only differences then become a white shirt and a 2-line blue nametag.  Really, the AF light blue shirt and a white shirt look awfully similar in a lot of situations, like when you're outside and more then fifteen feet from someone.  Then, the white shirt and 2-line nametag are not so distinct.  Your average person isn't going to know different.

The easy fix: distinctive rank insignia.  Why the blue AF officer rank?  Our commander says it was readily available.  Stab a CAP cutout though the middle, problem solved until you can bring back the blue rank with the embroidered CAP on it (or would it be USCAP now?).

So you would advocate non-uniformity within CAP? That's what your idea would be doing. If seniors aren't wearing the same uniforms as cadets, then there would be identity issues. There are people that don't like the TPU for various reasons. Would you sacrifice a group of seniors for a new batch that just has to have metal grade?

And how would you teach a cadet to wear a uniform that you aren't wearing yourself?

Additionally, you remove the Air Force variants (which is what they are), then the Air Force would have further control issues. The reasoning from the CAP side would be "You don't want us wearing your uniforms, why should you have any control over us?" And that is where CAP as an entity goes extinct.

Besides, the general membership of Civil Air Patrol didn't design and advocate the TPU. I think that there are a number of cooler heads on the AF side that realize this.

My suggestion was just that: a suggestion.  Be it the TPU, which seems to be the flavor of the month, or someone else, the adult membership of the CAP needs one uniform.  Going to the TXWG Conf this spring, you'd swear that four different organizations were meeting up. 

As far as non-uniformity goes, that is what we have now.  If we had all cadets in AF-styles and ALL seniors in ONE style, then it would be tenfold more uniformity then we have now. 

If a uniform could be implemented that would be universal across cadet and senior member ranks, no matter what the appearance of the person, then I'm all for it.  However, it is clear that no AF uniform, unless it is heavily modified, is going to work for the entire bunch of CAP seniors.  It then goes the way of a distinct uniform, which won't go over well with the cadets.

Then again, you take AF styles away from seniors, there is more bellyaching. Honestly, I know it is never going to happen, but I just would like to see the day when CAP has one uniform.

[LtCol White]

Fix it how?  What would you suggest? 

As a corporate-style uniform that resembles but does not mimic the Air Force uniform -- in other words, has enough noticeable differences that the average person won't think a CAP officer is an AF officer -- the corporate uniform is just fine.

Respectfully non-concur.  While the full-on TPU ensamble represents a distinct enough uniform, the jacket-less versions, IMO, do not.  The only differences then become a white shirt and a 2-line blue nametag.  Really, the AF light blue shirt and a white shirt look awfully similar in a lot of situations, like when you're outside and more then fifteen feet from someone.  Then, the white shirt and 2-line nametag are not so distinct.  Your average person isn't going to know different.

The easy fix: distinctive rank insignia.  Why the blue AF officer rank?  Our commander says it was readily available.  Stab a CAP cutout though the middle, problem solved until you can bring back the blue rank with the embroidered CAP on it (or would it be USCAP now?).

So you would advocate non-uniformity within CAP? That's what your idea would be doing. If seniors aren't wearing the same uniforms as cadets, then there would be identity issues. There are people that don't like the TPU for various reasons. Would you sacrifice a group of seniors for a new batch that just has to have metal grade?

And how would you teach a cadet to wear a uniform that you aren't wearing yourself?

Additionally, you remove the Air Force variants (which is what they are), then the Air Force would have further control issues. The reasoning from the CAP side would be "You don't want us wearing your uniforms, why should you have any control over us?" And that is where CAP as an entity goes extinct.

Besides, the general membership of Civil Air Patrol didn't design and advocate the TPU. I think that there are a number of cooler heads on the AF side that realize this.

My suggestion was just that: a suggestion.  Be it the TPU, which seems to be the flavor of the month, or someone else, the adult membership of the CAP needs one uniform.  Going to the TXWG Conf this spring, you'd swear that four different organizations were meeting up. 

As far as non-uniformity goes, that is what we have now.  If we had all cadets in AF-styles and ALL seniors in ONE style, then it would be tenfold more uniformity then we have now. 

If a uniform could be implemented that would be universal across cadet and senior member ranks, no matter what the appearance of the person, then I'm all for it.  However, it is clear that no AF uniform, unless it is heavily modified, is going to work for the entire bunch of CAP seniors.  It then goes the way of a distinct uniform, which won't go over well with the cadets.

Then again, you take AF styles away from seniors, there is more bellyaching. Honestly, I know it is never going to happen, but I just would like to see the day when CAP has one uniform.

As I said, you might wanna read through some of the uniform stuff on here. ALL of this has been discussed at GREAAATTTT length.

[JarakMaldon]

You're absolutely right.  Sorry, this isn't my usual CAP forum hang-out.

[Jolt]

Sorry to interrupt and stray a little bit from the topic, but I heard a couple of months ago about a proposal to allow cadet officers to wear their grade insignia on their shoulders.  I don't really care either way, but I'm curious as to whether the proposal was shot down.

[MIKE]

Holy topic drift Batman!

And put the 'tudes on SAFE please.

Sorry to interrupt and stray a little bit from the topic, but I heard a couple of months ago about a proposal to allow cadet officers to wear their grade insignia on their shoulders.  I don't really care either way, but I'm curious as to whether the proposal was shot down.

Hadn't heard of it.  I would not be in favor of such a change.  I would keep the grade on the flight cap and have only CADET on the ASNP.