Proper Colors on Membership Ribbon?

Thom · February 05, 2011, 04:50:37 PM

I searched but didn't find anything addressing this particular question.

What are the proper colors for the Membership Award Ribbon?

The CAPR 39-3 currently shows it as Black, White, and Red, the same as the ribbons currently sold by Vanguard. I've also seen both graphics and pictures that depict it as BLUE, White, and Red.

Did the colors change at some point? Or, was there some manufacturing tolerance issue?

I've seen a few pictures of the old 'slanted' version and they appear to be Black, White, and Red, but the pics weren't really good enough for me to be sure.

The impetus here is I'm trying to make sure that I host only the proper color of images for CAP objects, and while perusing the Wing's collection of images in preparation for updating our website repository, I found multiple images for this award, with the aforementioned varying colors.

I'd appreciate any clarification anyone could offer.

A secondary question, if anyone knows: Are the colors depicted in the ribbon graphic images in CAPR 39-3 supposed to be the caconical guide to absolute coloring, or is there a list of Pantone, CMYK, etc. true registered colors somewhere? The same for the various Logos, Seals, Emblems, etc. if you happen to know that as well.

Thanks!

Thom

ol'fido · February 05, 2011, 08:39:21 PM

The shades often change depending on the manufacturer. Thius is true with patches as well as ribbons. The current colors of the MR are as you say black, white , and red. At times in the distant past I have seen them as purple, white, and maroon. Go with the Scamguard( I can't say the "V" word) colors as they are probably as right as anything.

Pylon · February 05, 2011, 08:55:36 PM

Unfortunately, Civil Air Patrol has never been sophisticated enough to specify specific thread colors or Pantone matching colors for anything -- logos, uniforms, ribbons and awards, or even our seal. While our parent services do this routinely, we apparently never caught on.

There are at least two very visually different Hap Arnold Ribbons out there (so different they look like different awards). There are membership ribbons that have Black/White/Red and ones with Blue/White/Red. There are Unit Citation ribbons which range from dark forest green to minty light green. We have several different graphical interpretations of the CAP seal, some with white backgrounds and some with gray.

Sadly, there is no standard whatsoever. And as far as I can tell, there is no plan to make a standard, either. Whatever the next manufacturer's subcontractor overseas happens to make is what our awards will look like.

Thom · February 05, 2011, 09:49:22 PM

Quote from: Pylon on February 05, 2011, 08:55:36 PM
Unfortunately, Civil Air Patrol has never been sophisticated enough to specify specific thread colors or Pantone matching colors for anything -- logos, uniforms, ribbons and awards, or even our seal. While our parent services do this routinely, we apparently never caught on.

<snip>

Sadly, there is no standard whatsoever. And as far as I can tell, there is no plan to make a standard, either. Whatever the next manufacturer's subcontractor overseas happens to make is what our awards will look like.

That is much as I feared. I've been in CAP for almost two years at this point, so I thought I would have found some specifications in all that time, if they were out there to be had.

But, I figured I might as well ask directly, just to be sure I hadn't completely overlooked something obvious.

I'll soldier on then with the best information I can get.

Thanks!

Thom

SarDragon · February 06, 2011, 02:22:17 AM

Quote from: ol'fido on February 05, 2011, 08:39:21 PM
The shades often change depending on the manufacturer. Thius is true with patches as well as ribbons. The current colors of the MR are as you say black, white , and red. At times in the distant past I have seen them as purple, white, and maroon. Go with the Scamguard( I can't say the "V" word) colors as they are probably as right as anything.

The colors listed in the historical documents I have, are black, white, and red. This applies to both the olde and new versions.

ol'fido · February 06, 2011, 04:59:57 PM

I'm not saying that purple, white, and maroon were the colors they were supposed to be, but by the time they had been rendered into an actual ribbon, stored in the Bookstore or a squadron supply, been worn a few times many of the ones I have seen took on those shades.

Thom · February 06, 2011, 06:05:49 PM

Quote from: ol'fido on February 06, 2011, 04:59:57 PM
I'm not saying that purple, white, and maroon were the colors they were supposed to be, but by the time they had been rendered into an actual ribbon, stored in the Bookstore or a squadron supply, been worn a few times many of the ones I have seen took on those shades.

That raises another small problem: Without a defined color standard (or at least a repeatable color on newly purchased ribbons) how does one know when older ribbons are too discolored to continue wearing?

I take pretty good care of my ribbons, as do most of the members I've seen. That means that they don't get frayed and physically worn, but I've seen a few long-time members who have some ribbons that I'm pretty sure are nowhere near the color of a newly purchased ribbon.

But, does that mean those ribbons have faded? Or, did the color just change from one batch of supplies to another?

Does anyone know how the USAF (and USA, USN, USMC, etc.) specify the colors for their ribbons? They must have some sort of color guide, whether Pantone, CMYK, Federal Standard 595 numbers, or something...

Thom

The CyBorg is destroyed · February 07, 2011, 09:24:05 AM

It's black-white-red.

The black stripe is on the inside, pointing toward your heart...I call it my "blackheart" ribbon.

starshippe · February 07, 2011, 07:38:12 PM

. . the red service ribbon should have red and blue stripes. it is currently being sold with red and black stripes. national is checking....

bill wallace, maj., cap
ribbon nit picker extraordinaire

davidsinn · February 07, 2011, 08:47:19 PM

Quote from: starshippe on February 07, 2011, 07:38:12 PM

bill wallace, maj., cap
ribbon nit picker extraordinaire

Please use as much care with your punctuation and capitalization. It's annoying to read and makes you look uneducated.

baronet68 · February 08, 2011, 12:19:52 AM

Quote from: Thom on February 05, 2011, 04:50:37 PM

A secondary question, if anyone knows: Are the colors depicted in the ribbon graphic images in CAPR 39-3 supposed to be the caconical guide to absolute coloring, or is there a list of Pantone, CMYK, etc. true registered colors somewhere? The same for the various Logos, Seals, Emblems, etc. if you happen to know that as well.

While not Pantone or CMYK, the illustrations in the 1988 version of CAPR 39-3 (http://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/u_082203104145.pdf) were printed in black & white and have a color key, which shows the Membership Ribbon colors as black/white/red.

The colors specified for all awards appear to be very generic without any specific 'shades' indicated other than 'blue' and 'light blue'.

SarDragon · February 08, 2011, 12:38:31 AM

Quote from: starshippe on February 07, 2011, 07:38:12 PM
. . the red service ribbon should have red and blue stripes. it is currently being sold with red and black stripes. national is checking....

bill wallace, maj., cap
ribbon nit picker extraordinaire

How did we get onto the Red Service ribbon? The discussion is about the Membership Award.

As noted above, the colors specified in the reg for the Membership Award are red, white, and black. This information goes back as far as the 31 May 1984 version of CAPR 39-3.

Thom · February 08, 2011, 01:08:42 PM

Quote from: SarDragon on February 08, 2011, 12:38:31 AM
Quote from: starshippe on February 07, 2011, 07:38:12 PM
. . the red service ribbon should have red and blue stripes. it is currently being sold with red and black stripes. national is checking....

bill wallace, maj., cap
ribbon nit picker extraordinaire

How did we get onto the Red Service ribbon? The discussion is about the Membership Award.

As noted above, the colors specified in the reg for the Membership Award are red, white, and black. This information goes back as far as the 31 May 1984 version of CAPR 39-3.

Actually, as the OP, I asked a number of related questions, prompted by the common confusion of blue versus black on the Membership Award, but also asking for general information about proper colors for all awards and insignia.

I appreciate anyone's efforts to make sure we are providing and wearing the proper colors as approved in the regs.

If anyone knows of any other instances where what is available doesn't really meet the specs please let us know.

Thom

starshippe · February 08, 2011, 01:26:51 PM

. . ur quite welcome.

bill

a2capt · February 08, 2011, 05:30:00 PM

"but i type all day for work when i get home im tired of it"

So, does a truck driver run stop signs and flatten old ladies in the crosswalk on the way home because he too, 'drives all day'?

Spaceman3750 · February 08, 2011, 06:15:16 PM

Quote from: a2capt on February 08, 2011, 05:30:00 PM
"but i type all day for work when i get home im tired of it"

So, does a truck driver run stop signs and flatten old ladies in the crosswalk on the way home because he too, 'drives all day'?

Cabbies do that even before they go home!

manfredvonrichthofen · February 08, 2011, 09:28:04 PM

There are a few issues with items that VG sells, not just CAP items. I have ordered a CIB from them that had a wreath of olive leaves, when they are supposed to be oak leaves. VG doesn't even carry some items that they are supposed to, like the barf scarf, and the blues service jacket. VG just doesn't have the quality assurance that they are supposed to.