Beret confusion

[C/MSgt Lunsford]

I'd like to give my 2 cents...

If anyone has seen my facebook, I am already looking forward to going to Blue Beret 2011. One reason I am going is to advance my GTM training. Another reason is to earn the Blue Beret. There is nothing wrong with wanting to earn a beret, which shows the elite training that you endured.

I also think that National HQ should keep their decision to allow the Blue Beret. NBB, is a elite training for GES, and that beret shows that the said person that wears it, endured that training.

I'd also like to point out a quote from blueberet.org...

The person makes the beret...The beret does not make the person.

That mean that the beret does not mean anything special just because you put it on, but when you earn the beret, it symbolizes the extensive training that you went through.

'nuff said.

[Eclipse]

...the elite training that you endured.

Please, enlighten us as to what makes NBB training "elite"...

[JayT]

If anyone has seen my facebook, I am already looking forward to going to Blue Beret 2011. One reason I am going is to advance my GTM training. Another reason is to earn the Blue Beret. There is nothing wrong with wanting to earn a beret, which shows the elite training that you endured.

I also think that National HQ should keep their decision to allow the Blue Beret. NBB, is a elite training for GES, and that beret shows that the said person that wears it, endured that training.

I'd also like to point out a quote from blueberet.org...

The person makes the beret...The beret does not make the person.

That mean that the beret does not mean anything special just because you put it on, but when you earn the beret, it symbolizes the extensive training that you went through.

'nuff said.

Sergeant, a week of training doesn't make you 'elite.' It does not. Months of training, years of training and experience make you 'elite.' Your apparent opinions and and views of NBB is why many people have such a problem with the beret.

[Short Field]

One reason I am going is to advance my GTM training. Another reason is to earn the Blue Beret. There is nothing wrong with wanting to earn a beret, which shows the elite training that you endured.

Go to NESA and get the GTM training that sets the standard for CAP.

[wuzafuzz]

Pictures are worth thousands of words.  Here is the entirety of the problem.

Most members (especially younger cadets) wearing a beret think they look like this:


When in fact most look like this gentleman:


And the only "beret-cred" they have comes from this:

He shoots, he SCORES!   :clap: :clap: :clap:

[C/MSgt Lunsford]

If anyone has seen my facebook, I am already looking forward to going to Blue Beret 2011. One reason I am going is to advance my GTM training. Another reason is to earn the Blue Beret. There is nothing wrong with wanting to earn a beret, which shows the elite training that you endured.

I also think that National HQ should keep their decision to allow the Blue Beret. NBB, is a elite training for GES, and that beret shows that the said person that wears it, endured that training.

I'd also like to point out a quote from blueberet.org...

The person makes the beret...The beret does not make the person.

That mean that the beret does not mean anything special just because you put it on, but when you earn the beret, it symbolizes the extensive training that you went through.

'nuff said.

Sergeant, a week of training doesn't make you 'elite.' It does not. Months of training, years of training and experience make you 'elite.' Your apparent opinions and and views of NBB is why many people have such a problem with the beret.

2 weeks.

Presently blue beret and the Pennsylvania Wing Ranger School at Hawk Mountain are the only two specialized ranger-type schools left in Civil Air Patrol.

Ranger based schools are more challenging than most other GES schools, maybe with the exception of NESA, correct me if I am wrong.

Can you enlighten me to how my opinions are bad or ignorant...
...just because you do not agree with my opinions on something does mean you have to turn them into something incorrect and unjustified.

Also, let me remind you that I said the training was elite, or in better words, advanced. I never said it made the person elite. That is twisting my words.

[JayT]

If anyone has seen my facebook, I am already looking forward to going to Blue Beret 2011. One reason I am going is to advance my GTM training. Another reason is to earn the Blue Beret. There is nothing wrong with wanting to earn a beret, which shows the elite training that you endured.

I also think that National HQ should keep their decision to allow the Blue Beret. NBB, is a elite training for GES, and that beret shows that the said person that wears it, endured that training.

I'd also like to point out a quote from blueberet.org...

The person makes the beret...The beret does not make the person.

That mean that the beret does not mean anything special just because you put it on, but when you earn the beret, it symbolizes the extensive training that you went through.

'nuff said.

Sergeant, a week of training doesn't make you 'elite.' It does not. Months of training, years of training and experience make you 'elite.' Your apparent opinions and and views of NBB is why many people have such a problem with the beret.

2 weeks.

Presently blue beret and the Pennsylvania Wing Ranger School at Hawk Mountain are the only two specialized ranger-type schools left in Civil Air Patrol.

Ranger based schools are more challenging than most other GES schools, maybe with the exception of NESA, correct me if I am wrong.

Can you enlighten me to how my opinions are bad or ignorant...
...just because you do not agree with my opinions on something does mean you have to turn them into something incorrect and unjustified.

Also, let me remind you that I said the training was elite, or in better words, advanced. I never said it made the person elite. That is twisting my words.

From wiki

In sociology as in general usage, the elite is a hypothetical group of relatively small size, that is dominant within a large society, having a privileged status perceived as being envied by others of a lower line of order.

NBB, as mentioned previously in this thread, is a week of training and a week of operational mode.

What is, in the CAP context, a 'Ranger based school?' Also, what is 'GES School?'

Your opinions are not bad, or ignorant, but a little misinformed. As I mentioned before, there's really no such thing as 'elite' training. And, also as was mentioned before, there's other devices that are standard across every NCSA. Patch on the BDU's, ribbon on the service dress, and badges on every uniform.

[Майор Хаткевич]

If anyone has seen my facebook, I am already looking forward to going to Blue Beret 2011. One reason I am going is to advance my GTM training.

Great! But this isn't the activity for that, NESA is.

Another reason is to earn the Blue Beret.

I thought the point of the activity was to participate in Air Venture?

There is nothing wrong with wanting to earn a beret, which shows the elite training that you endured.

Personal reaction: LOL. As others stated, there is nothing elite about the training, and if that's your opinion, then you already are on course to be laughed at and considered to be "one of those" cadets.

I also think that National HQ should keep their decision to allow the Blue Beret. NBB, is a elite training for GES, and that beret shows that the said person that wears it, endured that training.

You get the ribbon and the patch - just like all other activities. I went to Honor Guard Academy, which gives people a cord to wear. I didn't go for a stupid silver cord, I went to learn how to twirl rifles and HG on a bigger scale. Anyone who goes for a cord I'd laugh at.

That mean that the beret does not mean anything special just because you put it on, but when you earn the beret, it symbolizes the extensive training that you went through.

What extensive training? 1 week? Most GTM3s put in more by the time they are qualified.

'nuff said.

Yes, please.

[DakRadz]

If you want elite, go to NFA- the wings look better, and the small group of pilots are generally fairly powerful over the rest of us here on the BDB (Big Dirt Ball).

I also think that National HQ should keep their decision to allow the Blue Beret. NBB, is a elite training for GES, and that beret shows that the said person that wears it, endured that training.

~snippet~

That mean that the beret does not mean anything special just because you put it on, but when you earn the beret, it symbolizes the extensive training that you went through.

'nuff said.

Sergeant, a week of training doesn't make you 'elite.' It does not. Months of training, years of training and experience make you 'elite.' Your apparent opinions and and views of NBB is why many people have such a problem with the beret.

Really, I'm not sure that a GES school (if that exists, cause I'm not sure that correctly describes NBB) is any good for cadets... We go to a specialized school to learn General ES??? Hmmm... No thanks.

Extensive training? Okay, so where is the special recognition for all encampment staff? They have at least what adds up to a week's time in RST (between reading emails, phone conferences, and actual face-time meetings), then a week of encampment. So when do their swagger sticks arrive from Vanguard?

Months of intensive training, the likes of which are not truly found in a cadet program, are what make you elite.

One NCSA does not elite make (or in our case, even resemble). If you've noticed, for flying you have to go twice to solo. For COS, you must go twice at certain ranks to be Falcon Flight. The list goes on... But saying that by directing airplanes correctly and (according to a previous poster) not even completing all requirements/tasks for claimed GTM training is elite? Go tell the AD RM that.

[emphasis]
You want to be an elite cadet? Study hard, promote on time, and hone your leadership abilities- for cadet officers are the true small and in power group in the Cadet Program.
[/emphasis]
(Not demeaning SMs in any way)

[Cadet 1stLt]

I'd also like to throw in my two cents, and I know a bunch of people are gonna argue and complain with me.

I just came home from NBB 2010 and to me, The Beret is more than just a piece of "Bling". I couldn't care less how cool I looked with the Blue Beret on. To me, The blue beret is a nothing more than a hat, however the St. Alban's Cross that is on the Flash of the Beret is what drives me to help others. Its a symbol of self-sacrifice and and A Blue Beret will do for his or her cadet next to them.

I dont consider in any way NBB training to be "elite" nor are Blue Berets "Elite" among the CAP community. For those who complain that the Beret is a stupid reward for just two weeks of training, You will never understand what the Blue Beret means to us that have gone.

I personally never had attitude problems before Blue Beret, and I honestly dont think a hat will ever change it. It's unfortunate that a few bad apples spoiled the entire bushel. Personally, Ive never met a blue Beret that had a Cocky or "rambo" attitude because they have a Beret.

At the end of the day, you can have whatever opinion you wish about the Beret, But I am proud to have earned my Beret, and It will always remind me of the Family that I gained at National Blue Beret.

[C/MSgt Lunsford]

I was basically trying to defend the NBB in the first place. For those who think it is a bad program, then they don't know what they are talking about.

Don't compare me with those "bad apples" that try to be "Rambo" like because they have a beret. I am a Sergeant, I am more mature than that. I was just simply stating that the beret is a nice edition, I think it is pretty cool. Nothing wrong with that, is there? Or should you bash me for saying that statement?

The training, in a sense is not elite, that was a bad word to use, because even after a corrected myself, SM's continue to complain about that word I used.

Never would find myself saying this to Senior Member's, but some need to grow up.

[Daniel]

I was basically trying to defend the NBB in the first place. For those who think it is a bad program, then they don't know what they are talking about.

Don't compare me with those "bad apples" that try to be "Rambo" like because they have a beret. I am a Sergeant, I am more mature than that. I was just simply stating that the beret is a nice edition, I think it is pretty cool. Nothing wrong with that, is there? Or should you bash me for saying that statement?

The training, in a sense is not elite, that was a bad word to use, because even after a corrected myself, SM's continue to complain about that word I used.

Never would find myself saying this to Senior Member's, but some need to grow up.

1) stating that you have maturity does not mean you do
2) Never reprimand a SM, I dont care if thier oakleaf is upside-down its still an oakleaf.

[C/MSgt Lunsford]

I was basically trying to defend the NBB in the first place. For those who think it is a bad program, then they don't know what they are talking about.

Don't compare me with those "bad apples" that try to be "Rambo" like because they have a beret. I am a Sergeant, I am more mature than that. I was just simply stating that the beret is a nice edition, I think it is pretty cool. Nothing wrong with that, is there? Or should you bash me for saying that statement?

The training, in a sense is not elite, that was a bad word to use, because even after a corrected myself, SM's continue to complain about that word I used.

Never would find myself saying this to Senior Member's, but some need to grow up.

1) stating that you have maturity does not mean you do
2) Never reprimand a SM, I dont care if thier oakleaf is upside-down its still an oakleaf.

1) Not trying to be above and over myself, but I am more mature to think I am elite for have a beret. Just letting people know that, so they don't confuse me for a Cadet who is just in CAP to be a complete retard.

2) Not reprimanding a SM, just telling them to back off in a sense.

[Cadet 1stLt]

I never was trying to compare anyone to anything. I know that those who have not attended Blue Beret will never understand that symbolism of the Blue Beret.

I'd like to quote something that one of the Tac Officer's from this year's NBB just said to me, that should be the message that all people must understand.

" I have seen the cadets that believe that the beret makes the person, when in fact the person makes the beret. That little blue felt hat is a ...badge just like every other uniform item. Nothing more, nothing less. It is the spirit inside the one wearing it that should shine bright. Your cross represents everything you were taught. Remember that always and you will be fine. Hold all with respect and get the job done. That is your mission, but you must choose how you complete it. Which path will you choose?"

I believe that this is the ideals that Every Blue Beret should have. It's not just another activity. It's something a lot more, but people dont recognize that

[JayT]

I was basically trying to defend the NBB in the first place. For those who think it is a bad program, then they don't know what they are talking about.

Don't compare me with those "bad apples" that try to be "Rambo" like because they have a beret. I am a Sergeant, I am more mature than that. I was just simply stating that the beret is a nice edition, I think it is pretty cool. Nothing wrong with that, is there? Or should you bash me for saying that statement?

The training, in a sense is not elite, that was a bad word to use, because even after a corrected myself, SM's continue to complain about that word I used.

Never would find myself saying this to Senior Member's, but some need to grow up.

No one was trying to bash  you.

Why do you feel you must defend a program you haven't attended? You're sig file says that you're a GTM3 Trainee. Perhaps you should complete your training first before you start to judge who and who doesn't know what they're talking about?

Lighten up Sergeant, no one is attacking you, or NBB. We're discussing the possible negative implications and issues around allowing cadets to wear the beret outside of NBB, as well as the regulatory issues around it.

You may be more mature then thinking a beret makes you elite, but people will form opinions on you based on other ways you present yourself.

Also, 'retard' is a powerful and offensive word to a lot of people....lets say people who have a mentally retarded aunt or something.

[C/MSgt Lunsford]

I never was trying to compare anyone to anything. I know that those who have not attended Blue Beret will never understand that symbolism of the Blue Beret.

I'd like to quote something that one of the Tac Officer's from this year's NBB just said to me, that should be the message that all people must understand.

" I have seen the cadets that believe that the beret makes the person, when in fact the person makes the beret. That little blue felt hat is a ...badge just like every other uniform item. Nothing more, nothing less. It is the spirit inside the one wearing it that should shine bright. Your cross represents everything you were taught. Remember that always and you will be fine. Hold all with respect and get the job done. That is your mission, but you must choose how you complete it. Which path will you choose?"

I believe that this is the ideals that Every Blue Beret should have. It's not just another activity. It's something a lot more, but people dont recognize that

Sorry, wasn't referring to you, just the SMs that were "ganging up". Over one mistake, the word, elite.

[C/MSgt Lunsford]

I was basically trying to defend the NBB in the first place. For those who think it is a bad program, then they don't know what they are talking about.

Don't compare me with those "bad apples" that try to be "Rambo" like because they have a beret. I am a Sergeant, I am more mature than that. I was just simply stating that the beret is a nice edition, I think it is pretty cool. Nothing wrong with that, is there? Or should you bash me for saying that statement?

The training, in a sense is not elite, that was a bad word to use, because even after a corrected myself, SM's continue to complain about that word I used.

Never would find myself saying this to Senior Member's, but some need to grow up.

No one was trying to bash  you.

Why do you feel you must defend a program you haven't attended? You're sig file says that you're a GTM3 Trainee. Perhaps you should complete your training first before you start to judge who and who doesn't know what they're talking about?

Lighten up Sergeant, no one is attacking you, or NBB. We're discussing the possible negative implications and issues around allowing cadets to wear the beret outside of NBB, as well as the regulatory issues around it.

You may be more mature then thinking a beret makes you elite, but people will form opinions on you based on other ways you present yourself.

Also, 'retard' is a powerful and offensive word to a lot of people....lets say people who have a mentally retarded aunt or something.

I'm defending it because I feel that is a vital program for CAP, and that is my opinion. I am a GTM3 Trainee, and will have my qualification for GTM3 later this month.

I was not presenting the word, retard, as a mentally incapable person. I was presenting it as, a Cadet who is just there to goof around and take up space. No offense implied.

[Cadet 1stLt]

Don't worry about it. That is how many people choose to view it. People believe the Beret is for "elites", But I earned mine and I do not believe I am elite in anyway. I'm just another CAP cadet with a blue felt hat. People have their opinions, and I respect their opinions, but like I said, people that has never been to National Blue Beret Will Never understand why myself and my fellow berets wear ours.

[C/MSgt Lunsford]

Don't worry about it. That is how many people choose to view it. People believe the Beret is for "elites", But I earned mine and I do not believe I am elite in anyway. I'm just another CAP cadet with a blue felt hat. People have their opinions, and I respect their opinions, but like I said, people that has never been to National Blue Beret Will Never understand why myself and my fellow berets wear ours.

I completely agree. The beret does not make you special or elite... I don't know why, but people here have been taking my words out of context. It is very frustrating.

[Cadet 1stLt]

Sorry, Dude.  Didn't mean to take your words. It's just that the Beret to me, Its more than "bling" and it infuriates me sometimes to hear people refer to it as that. To me, its a symbol of a commitment to help anyone, anywhere, anytime, under any condition