Level 3 for Seniors

[captrncap]

In 50-17, it states that for Level 3 a senior member must attend 2 wing, national or regional conference plus other requirements. Does the 2 wing conferences be from your wing or from any wing?

[Pylon]

It doesn't specify.  It simply states two conferences and that would mean any wing or region conference would be acceptable, not just your own. 

Of course, you might feel more comfortable at your own wing's conference just because of the propensity to know more people and have common geography amongst you.  But there's nothing from stopping you from hitting the next two closest wing conferences in neighboring wings and knocking that requirement off.

I'm guessing that the idea behind this requirement was to ensure that CAP members at the local units don't stay isolated and to make sure they realize that there is a whole CAP organization outside of their world at the squadron.  Some units can get fairly isolated from the rest of CAP over time, so it's a good requirement in my opinion.  Plus, it's nice to have lots of people at the conferences. 

[MIKE]

Do you have to attend the two conferences during level III, or does previous conference attendance count?

[Pylon]

Do you have to attend the two conferences during level III, or does previous conference attendance count?

Well, you need it before you can complete Level III, so you'd have to do it in your orientation, Level I, or II phases.  However, since again it doesn't specify when it can be done, it's like all of the other professional development requirements:  if you get them done really early, you can still apply them. 

For example, if you complete SLS and CLC while you're still in Level I, you can still apply them towards the appropriate level requirements when you get there, several years down the road.  No reason why this requirement would be any different.  I've known people to apply conferences they attended as a cadet towards this requirement, much like those who take ECI-13 as a cadet apply it towards their SM PD when they cross-over.

If you've done it once, you should be good to go, no matter when you attedned the conferences. 

[mikeylikey]

You can apply confrences you attended as a Cadet towards the Senior Program?  I tried that and had everyone up to the Wing Commander say No.  Guess it's time to call National.

[TankerT]

You can apply confrences you attended as a Cadet towards the Senior Program?  I tried that and had everyone up to the Wing Commander say No.  Guess it's time to call National.

Riiiight.  So, ignore your chain of command.  That's the type of individual we want to give an award too. 

(BTW - I have had this conversation with NHQ before... on an official basis... the only Senior Training you get credit for is the CAP Officer Course.  AKA ECI-13/AFDAIL-13.  Although, that conversation was at least two years ago... but I don't think the policy has changed.)

[shorning]

You can apply confrences you attended as a Cadet towards the Senior Program?  I tried that and had everyone up to the Wing Commander say No.  Guess it's time to call National.

I'm surprised a military officer would be so willing to jump the chain of command just becasue they didn't like the answer they got.  How do (or would) you feel when one of your soldiers does that to you?

[mikeylikey]

First out, as noted in multiple discussions previous, CAP is not the Military, Don't relate the two.  Second, based on PYLON, "I've known people to apply conferences they attended as a cadet towards this requirement, much like those who take ECI-13 as a cadet apply it towards their SM PD when they cross-over", I am apparently getting the INCORRECT ANSWER", not one I do not like.  I did not ignore my chain of command; I used it, and am still at the same place as when I started, with some people telling me one thing and others telling me another.  Third, TANKERT bashed me, but at least he gave me some type of answer, unlike you Shorning.  Finally to answer your question, if one of my soldiers jumped the chain of command, I would probably have to answer to my "higher-ups" on why he did it, and why I could not help him or her at my level.  BTW, they publish a NHQ Directory so that members can reach someone who can provide assistance when they seem to not be able to get the help they need at the local and wing levels. 
  In all honesty, I have my conferences in, but it would be nice to know for future reference what the exact policy is.  TankerT was able to call national and get the info, maybe I would like to as well.  I have seen many CAP awards go to people ethically and morally worse than a person who would "jump the chain of command", but that is for another discussion in the future.

[Pylon]

First out, as noted in multiple discussions previous, CAP is not the Military, Don't relate the two.  Second, based on PYLON, "I've known people to apply conferences they attended as a cadet towards this requirement, much like those who take ECI-13 as a cadet apply it towards their SM PD when they cross-over", I am apparently getting the INCORRECT ANSWER", not one I do not like.  I did not ignore my chain of command; I used it, and am still at the same place as when I started, with some people telling me one thing and others telling me another.  Third, TANKERT bashed me, but at least he gave me some type of answer, unlike you Shorning.  Finally to answer your question, if one of my soldiers jumped the chain of command, I would probably have to answer to my "higher-ups" on why he did it, and why I could not help him or her at my level.  BTW, they publish a NHQ Directory so that members can reach someone who can provide assistance when they seem to not be able to get the help they need at the local and wing levels. 
  In all honesty, I have my conferences in, but it would be nice to know for future reference what the exact policy is.  TankerT was able to call national and get the info, maybe I would like to as well.  I have seen many CAP awards go to people ethically and morally worse than a person who would "jump the chain of command", but that is for another discussion in the future.

The National CAP Knowledgebase sometimes has answers for these types of questions, allowing members an easy way to get the view of the NHQ staffers on certain issues, from the appropriate personnel, but without the inference of "skipping the chain" to get that answer.

I'd say this makes a good question to pose to the knowledgebase and see what NHQ says about it.

Just because I said I've known people who attended conferences as a cadet apply them to their senior member PD, doesn't mean that I'm saying it's right or wrong.  I was merely saying it's been done.

This conversation seems to be at a 11 right now, and it could easily be down at a casual 2, if everyone catches my drift. 

[shorning]

First out, as noted in multiple discussions previous, CAP is not the Military, Don't relate the two. 

Just because it's not the military, doesn't mean you can't apply the leadership lessons from one to the other.  Just because they are different doesn't mean they are mutually exclusive.

Regardless, you haven't received conflicting information.  What I've seen has been consistent.  I don't think you've looked at what they are telling you.  Common problem.    Too many people want all the pieces laid out before them instead of applying a little critical thinking to solve the problem.

Finally, this is the umpteenth post where you seem to have some personal issue with me.  So I'll leave you to your own devices.  You've made it clear you don't need my input.  Regards....

[mikeylikey]

Sorry if I offended you in anyway shorning.  I did not realize my differing points of view and criticism of your ideas and comments would make you think I have some issue with you.  I have never met you, and I only know of you from this forum.   I do have the highest respect for you because of your long service to the AF and CAP.  If I am not mistaken I think I did agree with you on one topic a few posts ago.  Anyway,  can't we just forget this thread and go after the people who don't use the Spell Check button.