Every Comm Question You Never Got Answered

Started by ♠SARKID♠, October 29, 2014, 01:00:53 AM

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

♠SARKID♠

So, I have taken on the burden of overhauling our wing's communications academy. Things were shaky enough as it was with BCUT/ACUT and when ICUT came along it completely negated the purpose of holding the kindergarden-comm course we had been. What I'm putting together is going to be far more technical and geeky (ACUT and then some). Ideally, I'd like the students to be as technically competent as an amateur tech with a splash of general class for taste.

What I am asking for are the things you've always wondered or wanted to know about communications, radio, antennae, etc. that aren't covered by CAP's training program. I want to know what you don't' know, and what you think the ideal comm training would cover. I'll also take ideas for hands on activities and demos.

Fubar

Would we serve our communications program better if we manage to crank out proficient radio operators before we worry about the techie types?

We can't seem to train folks on how to use the release-to-listen button as it is.

Eclipse

+1 Sorry man, push-pause-speak-release-listen-repeat is all the average member needs.

The techie stuff just gets in the way for most people.

"That Others May Zoom"

LSThiker

Perhaps a bit of an understanding of who exactly is your audience.  Are you targeting this information to people that want to become CULs and master rated in Communications?  Or are you targeting this to simply people looking to be a "radio operator"?

THRAWN

Radio? What sort of witchcraft is this?

I do agree with the previous posters. Make operators, and then from there make tech types. The problem is that if you make it too "nerdy", you're going to lose your audience, and by default, the troops that you're training.

Amateur techs are really just mike to mouth types. Very little technical knowledge or requirement. General gets more into the tech stuff.

I see where you're going and it's a good concept, but keep in mind that not everyone wants to be/should be required to be skilled at the general/extra levels.
Strup-"Belligerent....at times...."
AFRCC SMC 10-97
NSS ISC 05-00
USAF SOS 2000
USAF ACSC 2011
US NWC 2016
USMC CSCDEP 2023

♠SARKID♠

#5
This is designed for those that want to go beyond push to talk. I've heard a call for it from the other members in my wing. There is a desire for people that have the know how to setup a comm room, install antennae, ground equipment, etc. Personally? I'm sick and tired of the wing Communicator of the Year award going to whoever taught the most BCUT classes.

The tech stuff is what gets people interested. Why should anyone give a flip about comm if everything is PTT practice? "Okay everybody, lets pull out the ISRs and whisper made up sweet nothings to eachother over the airwaves!" *BARF*
When I taught BCUT at the squadron, I had to lay the comedy and schtick on pretty thick just to keep them awake. But pull out the MFJ, a hacksaw, and a copper J-pole and they're sneaking out of drill practice to hear an impromptu lesson on SWR and antenna tuning.

Theres already a course for people that want to be just operators. It's an excercise in mediocraty called ICUT.

johnnyb47

There's already a course for people who want more techie radio information.
It's called the Amateur Radio Technician class.

I'm serious.

You get a lot more practice operating and building confidence behind the MIC on the amateur airwaves too.
Get licensed, run a weekend class for the tech rating, invite all of your friends and CAP-mates who are interested in radio operations/techie stuff, find some local VE's (Volunteer Examiners), have them all test, buy Baofeng handheld radios off ebay for $35 each and have fun talking to each other on local repeaters or, under the right circumstances simplex, to your hearts content!

73
kc8zzp
Capt
Information Technology Officer
Communications Officer


Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Eclipse

Quote from: ♠SARKID♠ on October 29, 2014, 12:50:59 PMTheres already a course for people that want to be just operators. It's an exercise in mediocrity called ICUT.

CAP is not a HAM club.  ICUT came about because it's what is needed - once you have that, all that is necessary is proficiency.

For those so inclined, CUL would be the next step, which doesn't have to be all that technical, either.

CAP's comm deficiencies are in the lack of skilled operators, something which comes up during nearly every
mission - receiving a message without a filter, the ability to record and pass it properly, etc., etc. 

The "boring stuff" that many people seemingly can't do.

"That Others May Zoom"

arajca

If you want to get into the techie stuff, look up COM-T (ICS Communications Technician) information. They're the folks who get called into incidents to develop and build the communications systems. That'd be useful not just for CAP.

sardak

On the NHQ website this morning:
NHQ National Staff Vacancies
MANAGER, COMMUNICATIONS EDUCATION AND TRAINING
http://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/Comm_Education_and_Training_Divisio_328FE6644226F.pdf

Knowledge of radios and communications not listed under "Desired Requirements for the Position," although "Prior service as Wing DC and Region DCS-Comm is beneficial"

Mike

Eclipse

That's because it's a management job, primarily concerned with program coordination and assets,
not a technical one.  The technical should be well below the director level.

This is a move in the right direction - for years the Comm program has been staffed mostly by HAM people
who view comms as a mission instead of a tool, and many of those people became impediments as they
added untold hoops to simple situations like radio programming and operator certification and training.

Yes, like every other corner we absolutely need people who can turn wrenches and solder loose connections,
but the average GTM or Aircrew member doesn't need to know or understand anything about SWR or channel plans,
they need big-button devices that work when you turn them on.






"That Others May Zoom"

Storm Chaser


arajca

Quote from: Eclipse on October 29, 2014, 02:25:53 PM
Yes, like every other corner we absolutely need people who can turn wrenches and solder loose connections,
but the average GTM or Aircrew member doesn't need to know or understand anything about SWR or channel plans,
they need big-button devices that work when you turn them on.
I'll disagree about the channel plans. They do need to know how to read one and how to change the channel on their radio. They also need to know BASIC radio troubleshooting - Power on, volume up, correct channel. Those cover 90% of the radio issues I've seen.

Eclipse


"That Others May Zoom"

♠SARKID♠

Quote from: Eclipse on October 29, 2014, 02:25:53 PM
Yes, like every other corner we absolutely need people who can turn wrenches and solder loose connections
And we don't have enough of them. The number of people in the wing who have that know how are few, and some of them are busy with other projects or are  hitting the age where we might start to lose them. We need to raise the next generation.

Quotebut the average GTM or Aircrew member doesn't need to know or understand anything about SWR or channel plans, they need big-button devices that work when you turn them on.
Strawman; this isn't for them. I'm not forcing this onto every Tom, Dick, and Harry with a CAPID. If I was suggesting this as a course for everyone this thread would have been called "I want to make changes to ICUT".

Quote from: arajca on October 29, 2014, 01:52:37 PM
If you want to get into the techie stuff, look up COM-T (ICS Communications Technician) information. They're the folks who get called into incidents to develop and build the communications systems. That'd be useful not just for CAP.
I have. Some of the guys in my squadron are/were working on that and other ratings. I was invited to go to the training as well but, unlike CAP, the gov't has no problems scheduling training during the workweek so it didn't happen.

Eclipse

Quote from: ♠SARKID♠ on October 29, 2014, 06:14:27 PM
Quote from: Eclipse on October 29, 2014, 02:25:53 PM
Yes, like every other corner we absolutely need people who can turn wrenches and solder loose connections
And we don't have enough of them. The number of people in the wing who have that know how are few, and some of them are busy with other projects or are  hitting the age where we might start to lose them. We need to raise the next generation.

CAP doesn't need to raise the next generation, just recruit it.

The time spent trying to build Comm techs internally would be better spent training operators and recruiting techs.

"That Others May Zoom"

♠SARKID♠

#16
Recruit it? We've come to odds on some ideas before, but seriously?

Find someone out in the world and convince them to give up hundreds of dollars a year, commit their lives to hundreds of volunteer manhours, come to meetings every week, and deal with everything else on the never ending list of CAP pains in the butt for the express purpose of having them be a comm geek? Or just take someone who's already in CAP, wants to do the job, and teach it to them over the course of a weekend?

I don't know about you, but when I'm thirsty for a cola I go to the convenience store. I don't walk past the convenience store and start construction on a Coca-Cola bottling plant.


Майор Хаткевич

A weekend won't make anyone useful in a "com geek" role.

Eclipse

You can't swing a dead cat (though if you dig far enough in some of those containers you'll probably find one) at a hamfest without hitting
19 guys who would love to become Comm go-to guys.

The problem is they are focused on radios as the mission instead of the tools.  If you can work with them in that role,
it's a lot easier then trying to teach that stuff to members with divided attention.

"That Others May Zoom"

jeders

Quote from: Eclipse on October 31, 2014, 02:52:38 PM
You can't swing a dead cat (though if you dig far enough in some of those containers you'll probably find one) at a hamfest without hitting
19 guys who would love to become Comm go-to guys.

The problem is they are focused on radios as the mission instead of the tools.  If you can work with them in that role,
it's a lot easier then trying to teach that stuff to members with divided attention.

Well I think that's kind of the point. You take someone who has an interest in radios on a technical level and is already involved in the total spectrum of CAP rather than just comm, and then you train them up to be of real value to CAP. In fact, haven't you yourself said, regarding PD and outside education, if CAP wants you to have it, then they need to provide it? I see this as implementing exactly that philosophy (see, people do listen to you, kinda).

I think that this is a good idea and would gladly offer ideas for what it should contain, except I don't know enough about radios to know what I don't know. However, I do agree that one weekend probably isn't anywhere near enough time to turn someone from novice geek to techie geek.
If you are confident in you abilities and experience, whether someone else is impressed is irrelevant. - Eclipse