TIG Problem

[lordmonar]

Once here Level one is completed....the unit commander can put in a 2a for her and promote her based on her qualificaitons.  So...once she gets here CFI she can apply for Capt...no TIG required.

[DNall]

IIRC you can submit a subsequent promotion request based on qualification. That's not waivers. In other words, make her a 1Lt now & then resubmit it again for Captain exactly like the first time. That happens with mil officers that get promoted too. That's a very different process. I don't believe you should have any trouble with that.

[Monty]

Once here Level one is completed....the unit commander can put in a 2a for her and promote her based on her qualificaitons.  So...once she gets here CFI she can apply for Capt...no TIG required.

.....or the 2A can be relegated to the 90s and in its stead, the personnel officer and/or commander can use the "membership" and subsequent "promotions" utilities in e-services and promote them that way, paperless*.  (Not only does it work like an insta-charm, we just passed our big inspection and we were told point blank that if the member is promoted in e-services, no 2A copies are needed.  We had been double-documenting with paper and e-services...the point of the module, as we were told by TPTB, was "to lighten the burden, not double the load.")

Good 'ole Harris is dead-on about applying for Capt w/o TIG under unique circumstances like CFI...but never forget that CFI isn't a mandate for a Capt promotion (not implying that's what he meant, just throwing a casual reminder out there for us all.)



* - watch out; your wing might let some, none, or all promotions happen the old way or the new.  As it stands, CAWG allows e-services promotions for company grade officers but refuses to accept e-services versions for field grade.  No comment from me on the practicality or mindset of this "half new, half old" method.

[DNall]

That's interesting. Way our case seems to work is you can submit the official request & approval process via eServices, but you have to email the 2a (or whatever) to provide documentation. That's more an issue for ES awards, but basically the process for most everything.

If I had to guess why they're doing the split version there, I'd say they're putting field grade to teh Wg promotion boards & just letting Company grade fly thru on CC discreression. That makes pretty good sense, but I can see where a policy letter explaining it would be helpful.

[Monty]

That's interesting. Way our case seems to work is you can submit the official request & approval process via eServices, but you have to email the 2a (or whatever) to provide documentation. That's more an issue for ES awards, but basically the process for most everything.

If I had to guess why they're doing the split version there, I'd say they're putting field grade to teh Wg promotion boards & just letting Company grade fly thru on CC discreression. That makes pretty good sense, but I can see where a policy letter explaining it would be helpful.

Yup!  Everybody's home is different...which is why I tried to avoid a tangent by saying:

No comment from me on the practicality or mindset of this "half new, half old" method.

[RogueLeader]

Thank you, I just didn't want her to think that she could get !st Lt soon and get Capt. not too soon afterward when she couldn't because of the 18 month TIG.  Thank you all.

[Major Carrales]

I have never seen TIG as a "problem."  I consider it experience.

For example, I could have been advanced to 1st Lt for my credentials as a teacher.  But, I would have known very little about CAP and have been the living embodiment of all the problems people see with our LEVEL I and RANK system.

I chose the time...better to be experienced, and patient, at a lower grade than an immature CAP Officer at a high one.  That was my thinking.

[Camas]

.....or the 2A can be relegated to the 90s and in its stead, the personnel officer and/or commander can use the "membership" and subsequent "promotions" utilities in e-services and promote them that way, paperless*.

I believe this is for duty promotions only.  If you're promoting due to mission related skills or professional appointments, then the CAPF 2 needs to be submitted. It wouldn't hurt to submit other documentation such as FAA certification and so forth.

[Monty]

.....or the 2A can be relegated to the 90s and in its stead, the personnel officer and/or commander can use the "membership" and subsequent "promotions" utilities in e-services and promote them that way, paperless*.

I believe this is for duty promotions only.  If you're promoting due to mission related skills or professional appointments, then the CAPF 2 needs to be submitted. It wouldn't hurt to submit other documentation such as FAA certification and so forth.

Not so sure.  Had a Spaatz recipient go up for Capt; I initiated the process in e-services, scanned and e-mailed the certificate by way of e-mail and voila!  24 hours from start to group to finish.  Betcha it'd work as easy for any other special circumstance!

Ne'er a 2A changed hands! 

[DNall]

Yeah the standard company grade duty performance ones are done on eServices. Anything that requires formal documentation you have to fill out a 2a electronically & submit with the docs in order to get the eServices request approved. Hell, we've had one turned back cause it was in word format instead of pdf, how stupid is that. I'm sure it's different in other places, and I know what we're doing isn't the intent of the move to paperless, but the eServices program isn't up to par yet so long as it doesn't allow inclusion of scanned documentation right there with the electronic request. I think they're doing the best they can with what they got to work with, which unfortunately for now is harder than it used to be on paper alone.

[James Shaw]

I havent seen on the thread about Squadron Commander promotions. So I will tell ya just in case. You are eligible for a "special promotion" to Captain if you are a current 1st Lt. after 1 continous year as a Squadron Commander. This has to be an assigned year...not filling in or additional duty and the kicker is that it does not count against the "1 Waiver Policy". However it does decrease your chances of the waiver promotion some. So the decision is up to you. This has to be approved through the Group Commander and all those above.

I know of an individual who was a 1st Lt as a Squadron Commander and a Captain after 14 Months, and then requested a 1/2 time waiver on promotion to Major. Took 5 Months to get but got it. They had 3 pages of backup data for the waiver. I inquired though NHQ what type of criteria would be necessary to do that and I was told "tell us why you walk on water and we will tell you yes or no". Sounds crazy but after reading some of the info I could see the "justification".

If you have a PhD you go in as a Captain and after 1 year you are eligible for Major. (I have been told this but have not verified myself)

[Al Sayre]

The PhD thing is true for Educators, Doctors etc..  I promoted one of mine to Major about 6 months ago under that reg.  That also doesn't count as a waiver.

[DNall]

Right, but not true just because you have a PhD. The degree doesn't mean anything to them. It's the univeristy professor (doctor, lawyer, etc) gig that makes it.

[LtCol Hooligan]

CAPF 2a is for Approval of Personnel Action.  CAPF 2 is a Request for Promotion Action.  You would use a CAPF 2 for a special appointment or an appointment to a FO rank and use eServices for a TIG appointment.  If a commander has a special appointment to process, they scan the CAPF 2, with signatues, along with required documents and e-mail it to lmmeforms@cap.gov.  They will take care of you.  In all reality, the signatures are actually not required and the commander could just e-mail a copy of the CAPF 2 to NHQ and type in the message of the e-mail- I approve this action.  Remember, SQ/CC can only approve 2d LT and 1st LT promotions.  All others must be done at higher echelons.  Oh and one other thing I also noticed is in the past, NHQ didn't really care about FO promotions, but keep the CAPF 2s on file so the member can get a special appointment upon turning 21. 

[DNall]

That's not a special appointment at 21 for FOs, it's duty performance. Explains it right there on the form.

Doesn't matter which form we're talking about, all are treated the same way in this eServices versus email process. That is to say each wing treats the dif forms the same, but Wings may have slightly dif processes, which is screwed up, but that's transition & worthless eServices system for ya.

[SAR-EMT1]

Ive never really understood why HQ didnt track FO status.

[RogueLeader]

I can understand not tracking cadets, because they can move relatively quickly.  But the FO grades aren't that different from officer grades, as far as Duty Requirements go- it's just age and TIG.  3months for FO- 6 2d Lt etc.

[DNall]

Having come up thru the FO grades, I think they should track those grades since they eventually bear on duty performance promotion at 21. It needs some tweaking too, but that's another conversation. Far as cadets, we do have to send in the 52s & they should track milestones on eServices. It'd be real nice if we could submit scans of the 52s via eServices & have it approved there.

[lordmonar]

Having come up thru the FO grades, I think they should track those grades since they eventually bear on duty performance promotion at 21. It needs some tweaking too, but that's another conversation. Far as cadets, we do have to send in the 52s & they should track milestones on eServices. It'd be real nice if we could submit scans of the 52s via eServices & have it approved there.

You can just E-mail the 52 and then they enter it into E-services for you.

[DNall]

really? My personnel officer checks my dates & faxes them for me. Do they record them in eSErvices? I don't believe I've noticed that.