Patches back on Air Force ABUs

[Stonewall]

As most of you know, when the Air Force transitioned to the ABU from BDUs, they excluded command and wing patches.  It looks like there is an interest in bring them back.  What do you think?

Flight suits, ABUs, patches: What do you think?
Staff report
Posted : Monday May 3, 2010 16:17:19 EDT
   
The Air Force lets airmen wear patches on flight suits, but not on ABUs.

Is the ban on ABU patches fair? Should wearers of the flight suit have to get rid of their patches, too? Or should the Air Force simply give the OK for patches, regardless of the uniform?

If the Air Force lifted the ban on ABU patches, which ones should be allowed? The Ranger tab? Unit morale patches?

Maybe you like the patch-less look because you don't have to change patches each time you change assignments.

Whatever you think about patches and wear rules, we want to hear from you.

Send your comments to brolfsen@airforcetimes.com. Please include your name, rank, career field and base. We might include your remarks in an upcoming story.

Reference:  http://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2010/05/airforce_uniform_callout_043010/

TSgt Stonewall
Security Forces
Air Naitonal Guard

The best thing to come from the transition to ABUs is the exclusion of patches.  Cost, care, maintenance and the physical appearance of clutter are out of the equation now.  If Airmen are concerned about uniform bling they need to reevaluate their priorities and probably consider transferring to the Army where patches, badges, insignia and tabs are all the rave.  Simply give me a functional battlefield uniform and the tools to do my job and I'm confident most Airmen would be happy.  Save the money tax payers would spend on patches to outfit the entire Air Force, at 4 patches per Airman, and issue me a practical tactical vest, durable flashlight or radios that work and you certainly won't hear any complaints from me.

[RiverAux]

For those who think CAP people spend too much time worrying about uniforms, just wanted to note that the AF Times article soliciting views on what people would do if they were in charge of the AF had  "uniforms" as the 2nd thing on the list.  And that story was right next to one about the one that is the topic of this thread...

[Stonewall]

The topic of uniforms in the Air Force and CAP is utterly pathetic.  What ever happened to MISSION FIRST?  Obviously it has fallen by the wayside due to a highly critical topic that bears importance on National Security and the Global War on Terror.

Peoples' priorities are so far out of whack that I am almost embarassed to claim affiliation with the Air Force and CAP.

Patches are so irrelevant yet so costly, it should be a crime to consider this a #20 priority let alone #2.

So pathetic and embarassing.

[Eclipse]

Its not just the USAF - last week's front page headline in the Navy times was "Uniform Changes - Enough Already" (or something to that effect).

[mynetdude]

man why do they need more or less patches on every uniform? The ABUs are designed for use in combat, what about flight suits? Do they have to remove their patches before being deployed to a mission?

[MIKE]

Death to patches!

[MSgt Van]

That's why they're held on by velcro...
Dump all patches. All you need is a name tape, CAP tape, and rank (unless we can ditch the AF rank stuff too).

[mynetdude]

That's why they're held on by velcro...
Dump all patches. All you need is a name tape, CAP tape, and rank (unless we can ditch the AF rank stuff too).

Velcro is the way to go IMHO for every patch which will make changing out rank easier FWIW if we dump rank then the whole PDO goes out the window so it would be hard to do that.  I kinda like the rank, its the closest thing to being in the RM for me but I would not cry if we lost rank either as I am not noticeably progressing in my PD regularly anyway.

[lordmonar]

The topic of uniforms in the Air Force and CAP is utterly pathetic.  What ever happened to MISSION FIRST?  Obviously it has fallen by the wayside due to a highly critical topic that bears importance on National Security and the Global War on Terror.

Peoples' priorities are so far out of whack that I am almost embarassed to claim affiliation with the Air Force and CAP.

Patches are so irrelevant yet so costly, it should be a crime to consider this a #20 priority let alone #2.

So pathetic and embarassing.

Well in my neck of the woods we have the mission down pat.....so afterwards we kick back, have  few cold ones and talk about uniforms. 

Let's be happy that all we have to talk about is uniform issues.  Anyone out there not getting the mission done?  Anyone out there dreadfully in need of some training, or new equipment that is preventing you from sortieing ground teams or air craft?

If you don't want to talk about uniforms...don't....but don't be throwing around dispersions that we are not mission focused.

[mynetdude]

The topic of uniforms in the Air Force and CAP is utterly pathetic.  What ever happened to MISSION FIRST?  Obviously it has fallen by the wayside due to a highly critical topic that bears importance on National Security and the Global War on Terror.

Peoples' priorities are so far out of whack that I am almost embarassed to claim affiliation with the Air Force and CAP.

Patches are so irrelevant yet so costly, it should be a crime to consider this a #20 priority let alone #2.

So pathetic and embarassing.

Well in my neck of the woods we have the mission down pat.....so afterwards we kick back, have  few cold ones and talk about uniforms. 

Let's be happy that all we have to talk about is uniform issues.  Anyone out there not getting the mission done?  Anyone out there dreadfully in need of some training, or new equipment that is preventing you from sortieing ground teams or air craft?

If you don't want to talk about uniforms...don't....but don't be throwing around dispersions that we are not mission focused.

Uniforms may be an old topic, its still entertaining to see you all (and I) talk about it. We're getting our mission done regardless if we still have issues getting things done (I won't mention what happened today, it wasn't serious) I don't know how close to dreadfully in need of training we are in but I wouldn't say its severe enough that we can't do missions because we can.

[raivo]

False dichotomy.

Considering uniform changes doesn't preclude anybody from doing anything more important at the same time.

[JC004]

Kill patches. 

And kill patches when we go to the ABU, preferably sooner.

[JoeTomasone]

I personally don't care about more or less patches...  But I would fully stand behind putting everything on with Velcro.   

[mynetdude]

I personally don't care about more or less patches...  But I would fully stand behind putting everything on with Velcro.

would make my sew job a lot easier

[Stonewall]

No. It would require more sewing. Sewing velcro to uniform and every patch you end up wearing.

[SarDragon]

Sewing hook Velcro to patches, and getting it to look decent, is no picnic.

The feeder doesn't work well on the hook, and if you turn it over, then you take a chance on screwing up the patch.

[notaNCO forever]

I say no patches on abus it's a waste of money. I thought it was alot just to get my rank sown onto never mind how much all the patches would cost. In CAP it's one thing you only usually have a couple pairs of bdus but I have four pairs of abus I'd have to put patches on.

[lordmonar]

Sewing hook Velcro to patches, and getting it to look decent, is no picnic.

The feeder doesn't work well on the hook, and if you turn it over, then you take a chance on screwing up the patch.

That's why I use glue all! 

yes it does sometimes come off...but you can always glue it back.

[Rodriguez]

I think its funny how many different opinions the Air Force presents on the ABUs.
I dont understand what they were going for in the first place. They knew that airman complained about being hot in BDUs (I personaly love my BDUs) and yet they used the same material on the ABUs. They knew airman like velcro pockets, and they kept the buttons, they didnt even slant the pockets. They esentialy took a BDU, and changed the pattern to a tigerstripe version of the Army's ACUPAT. When the ABU came out the Air Force knew that the Army found that the ACUPAT dosnt work and yet they kept it. Now they want to put patches back on it. All they are doing is making a BDU with a color and pattern that "looks cool" and dosnt work. Whats the point? At least the BDUs camoflauge works. As for the patches i think the Army and The Marine Corps got it right. They either have them on velcro (you can change units all you want and never change the uniform) or they simply dont wear unit patches, as is the case with the Marine Corps.

[Hawk200]

I think its funny how many different opinions the Air Force presents on the ABUs.
I dont understand what they were going for in the first place. They knew that airman complained about being hot in BDUs (I personaly love my BDUs) and yet they used the same material on the ABUs. They knew airman like velcro pockets, and they kept the buttons, they didnt even slant the pockets. They esentialy took a BDU, and changed the pattern to a tigerstripe version of the Army's ACUPAT. When the ABU came out the Air Force knew that the Army found that the ACUPAT dosnt work and yet they kept it. Now they want to put patches back on it. All they are doing is making a BDU with a color and pattern that "looks cool" and dosnt work. Whats the point? At least the BDUs camoflauge works. As for the patches i think the Army and The Marine Corps got it right. They either have them on velcro (you can change units all you want and never change the uniform) or they simply dont wear unit patches, as is the case with the Marine Corps.

The Air Force actually used the same material in the ABU as what the Marine Corps used in their utilities pants. The Marines used a thicker material in their pants, because pants usually wear out faster. They used a lighter material in the shirts so that it would be a little cooler, and the shirt wasn't subjected to the same abuse that pants were. In an effort to field the uniform faster, the AF just used the pants material. There were plenty of complaints on how hot the uniform got because of it.

The ABU is essentially the BDU pattern with a few more pockets, and sized numerically instead of small, medium and large.

Correct on the camo colors. The Army is now fielding MultiCam to troops going to Afghanistan. It's hoped that once Congress mandates a common uniform again (or has it already been done? Haven't followed much on that lately) that it will be MultiCam. It's an effective pattern.

Velcro is not really an answer to it all. It snags on things, wears out, and generally isn't as promising as many think. I have a couple ACUs that the Velcro went south on during the deployment; it peeled away, or got so thin in spots that it won't hold a patch. Sticking to your buddy, or stripping his patch isn't funny. Both happened to me a number of times.