We're no different

[RiverAux]

It has finally occurred to me that CAPTalk members are really no different than our official leaders when it comes to uniform issues. 

Everyone has got their own opinion on CAP uniforms and about the "right" mix of uniform combinations.  Every single one of us wouldn't hesitate to ram our opinions through the NB if we only had the power to do so.  And there are little subgroups out there that have elected themselves to solve the uniform "issue". 

So, are we really surprised that these things keep changing all the time and often change from one thing right back to the original way of doing it?  If we can't reach any sort of consensus here, what makes us think that any is likely to be formed on the NB that will last more than a year or two (as new Wing commanders come on board)? 

Short of a elimination of the CAP corporation and a re-assumption of total control of the organization by the AF, I don't see this ever changing. 


So, we're really no better than the Wing Kings and the National Commander in this regard, so maybe we should cut them a little bit of slack.   

[lordmonar]

You are right.

Hence one of my suggestions to do away with the NB and NEC as they are today.

This also spills over into just about every aspect of CAP.  Getting anything done through the NB requires a lot of strong arm tactics.....and also leads to the politics and empire building that leads to the HWSRN's that are out there.

My suggestion is to let the BoG's do the governing and allowing the National Commander and his/her staff come up with the regulations to get the mission done.

This does not mean that input from the wings is not needed but we eliminate the politics involved.

[ZigZag911]

Eliminate winter board meeting. Replace it with a meeting of NEC, which should be its only yearly meeting.

In between in person meetings, perhaps if more of the NB voting were conducted by email, there'd be less opportunity for canvassing and lining up factions.

An easier change than one to CAP constitution.

[Eclipse]

Yes, by all means let's make a comparison between an experienced body of corporate officers who have specific authority and limitations with an internet forum where 1/2 the people are anonymous.

[Hawk200]

Yes, by all means let's make a comparison between an experienced body of corporate officers who have specific authority and limitations with an internet forum where 1/2 the people are anonymous.

What does an Internet forum have to do with it?

[NCRblues]

Yes, by all means let's make a comparison between an experienced body of corporate officers who have specific authority and limitations with an internet forum where 1/2 the people are anonymous.

Eclipse, are you feeling ok? Your latest posts have been even more cynical than normal.

[JC004]

Yes, by all means let's make a comparison between an experienced body of corporate officers who have specific authority and limitations with an internet forum where 1/2 the people are anonymous.

I agree.  It's their job to run the organization.  This is just an online outlet for venting and a resource for CAP members.  It isn't our job to go about the business of running our units here.  If you spend the time at your meeting discussing a random new uniform idea instead of running your unit, that's different.

[Hawk200]

Yes, by all means let's make a comparison between an experienced body of corporate officers who have specific authority and limitations with an internet forum where 1/2 the people are anonymous.

I agree.  It's their job to run the organization.  This is just an online outlet for venting and a resource for CAP members.  It isn't our job to go about the business of running our units here.  If you spend the time at your meeting discussing a random new uniform idea instead of running your unit, that's different.

How many people actually read and, in turn, allowed what Zig said to register? Because from the looks of it, at least two people haven't.

[SamFranklin]

It has finally occurred to me that CAPTalk members are really no different than our official leaders when it comes to uniform issues. 

This is a refreshing post. I would like to see more CT members make similar reflections, be open to different views, and not be afraid of admitting that they've changed their minds.

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

Short of a elimination of the CAP corporation and a re-assumption of total control of the organization by the AF, I don't see this ever changing. 

I have been saying since the late '90s that this is what should happen.

The Coast Guard has a lot more control over its Auxiliary than the Air Force does over CAP...and their relationship is closer.

Some will disagree, but I believe that if we didn't have the cadet side providing warm bodies through Lackland AFB, the Air Force would have much less interest in us.

[Gunner C]

The AF has the interest that the congress tells it to have.  No more, no less.

[Cecil DP]

Eliminate winter board meeting. Replace it with a meeting of NEC, which should be its only yearly meeting.

In between in person meetings, perhaps if more of the NB voting were conducted by email, there'd be less opportunity for canvassing and lining up factions.

An easier change than one to CAP constitution.

The factions are caused not by the NEC and NB meeting,s, but the incestious relationships involved in the selection and continuation in office of the NB members. IE. National Commander selects Region Commanders, who select the Wing Commanders. Disagree with the Region Commander and you are a former Wing Commander, Have a dispute with the National Commander and you're a former Region Commander. Just look at the number of Corporate Officers who leave office early  soon after the National Board. I've had several Wing Commanders tell me that they voted for national candidates , because the Region Commander wanted that person-or else.

[Seabee219]

Yes everyone has there own opinion, but thats the good part of it. You all get your ideas out and come to a good choice for everyone. Asking the members what they want and what they are looking for.  To me asking everyone what they want makes your choice better for everyone.  different ideas are what make things interesting. 


JC

[Gunner C]

Eliminate winter board meeting. Replace it with a meeting of NEC, which should be its only yearly meeting.

In between in person meetings, perhaps if more of the NB voting were conducted by email, there'd be less opportunity for canvassing and lining up factions.

An easier change than one to CAP constitution.

The factions are caused not by the NEC and NB meeting,s, but the incestious relationships involved in the selection and continuation in office of the NB members. IE. National Commander selects Region Commanders, who select the Wing Commanders. Disagree with the Region Commander and you are a former Wing Commander, Have a dispute with the National Commander and you're a former Region Commander. Just look at the number of Corporate Officers who leave office early  soon after the National Board. I've had several Wing Commanders tell me that they voted for national candidates , because the Region Commander wanted that person-or else.

Over the past few years, there's been a secret ballot for CAP/CC, CV, etc (backlash from HWNBN).  I don't see how a region commander could tell.  However, many of the other votes are made by raised paddle. 

That system is ridiculous. We need to go back to an AF general officer as national commander who actually knows how to make an organization work.

[BillB]

I think a look at the early history of CAP is needed. For the first years CAP operated under the total control of the Army Air Force (after the first year under the Office of Civilian Defense) When CAP became a Public Corporation, the National Board was basically an advisor to the Commander of CAP-USAF who was a General garde officer. HQ CAP-USAF provided the guidance to the Wings through the Wing CAP-USAF Liaison Officers who advised the Wing Commanders. There was no term limits on Wing Commanders so many served for long periods. Regions were not operational, but in place to provide guidence to Wing staff's.
The National Commander of CAP had powers given by the Commander CAP-USAF in the running of the CAP Corporation. Somehow that has reversed and the National Commander CAP has almost all control and CAP USAF just says yeas or nay to changes in the Corporation.
Politics is rife under the current corporate structure. The multiple votes for Vice Commander provs that. But the politics in CAP runs down the chain of command and is strong in many Wings. Cliques have developed that control various aspects of the Wing organization. As many members of CAP with long service (I mean over thirty years) will tell you, CAP "ain't what it used to be". With the confusion on the mission(s) of CAP at all levels, a command structure that is like a three headed monsterand no clear line of a command strucrure as found in the Coast Guard Auxiliary, CAP will continue along the current rocky path. More control is needed from either USAF or the BoG, and for that matter Congress.

[FW]

The Air Force no longer has the money nor will to engage in the affairs of CAP as it was until 1994-1997; the time NHQ became "corporate" instead of blue and, Wing LO's became civilians. 

Civil Air Patrol is governed by a Board of Governors who, for better or worse, don't wish to delve into the politics of CAP nor consider it their problem.

The volunteer "commanders" in the respective wings are too busy dealing with day to day affairs in managing the needs of the membership; figuring out how to keep their radios, computers and stuff from disappearing and, leaving the other matters to the region commanders and the national officers. 

This could be the reason why we have so much to discuss here on CT.   We are like the NB and NEC.... to busy talking and caring about our own corner of the universe and, not taking a real stand on affairs which affect all of us.

Sure, it's great to argue inadfinitum over the color of a new corporate uniform; it's just not OK to translate it into action by demanding that a disparaged membership  needs to be reconnected with an organization with a tremendous past and, hopefully, a great future.

[High Speed Low Drag]

BG Brookfield was commander the last time I started CAP, but my hey-days as a cadet were under BG Cass and then Maj Gen Harwell.  I can't remember the USAF Col that was the main AF commander (Massingale??) but I can remember the bald gentleman that would always have the “I’m a nice guy but I can be not-so-nice: smile that I would see in the pictures of every publication.  There was not doubt in anyone minds that the National Commander may be in charge, but the good colonel held the trump card.  And we were not a part-time auxiliary, we had the active-duty Wing Liaison Officers & NCOs for support.  Seniors and cadets all wore the same uniform, (although there were the infamous Smurf Suits).  What happened?  How did we end up like this, adrift?

Some will disagree, but I believe that if we didn't have the cadet side providing warm bodies through Lackland AFB, the Air Force would have much less interest in us.

I agree with the above quote.   Ever since I have "come back" to CAP, I have seen the effects of a lack of top-down cohesive leadership.  Our wing commander does his best, but without a clear vision from National, it's hard to give a "big-picture" vision lower down.  I have no doubt that the cadet program is 90 % of why the AF doesn't the plug and cut CAP loose.  The other 10% is the former AF senior NCOs & officers (now CAP) that help keep a good word in the minds of AD AF.

Could it be a lack of mission or adversity?  CAP was formed in the face of WWII, transitioned and operated in the face of the Cold War, and now what?  Although terrorism is a threat, is it really a threat we can internalize – the way the threat of Hitler and later the USSR with their nukes did?  No – the very nature of terrorism is subversive.  In the absence of an outside threat (conflict), all groups turn inward for conflict – and strife breaks out because there is not a common rallying “mission.”  I am sure that if Congress said “OK CAP – effective in 2012, we are going to disband you, revoke your federal charter.  You no longer serve a purpose for the U.S.,” the issues of “I can fly the Archer and your can’t” and the “I’ll support your pet project if you support mine” days would disappear – we would all be fighting as one to save CAP from the chopping block.

We have demonstrated that we are not effective at governing ourselves.  How do we fix this?

[High Speed Low Drag]

This could be the reason why we have so much to discuss here on CT.   We are like the NB and NEC.... to busy talking and caring about our own corner of the universe and, not taking a real stand on affairs which affect all of us.

Sure, it's great to argue inadfinitum over the color of a new corporate uniform; it's just not OK to translate it into action by demanding that a disparaged membership  needs to be reconnected with an organization with a tremendous past and, hopefully, a great future.

FW - could you please explain?  I am confused at what you are saying - and what are the real affairs you are referring to?

[LTC Don]

Interesting thread, and content.  Our organization does have a unique structure, that is for sure.

In actualilty, we don't really have 'three' levels of governorship.  The NEC/NB relationship is essentially the same as it always has been.  The NEC and the BOG are the governing bodies.  The NEC ceases to exist when the National Board is in session.

I am in agreement, that the current command/political structure is a real problem.  Common sense should dictate the obvious conflict of interest in a National Commander appointing those at Region level who then vote for/against that same National Commander. Huh?  Whut?

But anyway, after reading through the Constitution and Bylaws, it is clear to me another Article needs to be insituted that clearly establishes basic uniform platforms (field (utility), dress, and flying) with regards to style, color, and fabric type and specify all bling to be managed by the regulatory process (CAPR 39-1?).  Seriously, adding or removing or changing a specialty badge is one thing, but just 'dropping' a whole uniform on a whim, or instituting a whole uniform the same way.....very stupid.

Someone mentioned in another thread about the USMC uniform, and the fact it has been virtually unchanged for many, many years.  I think we need that level of stability as an organization.

I believe the majority of the membership crave a long-term, stable uniform slate so they can feel confident in making purchases that will not be trashed at someone's whim.

The question becomes, in regards to this, is wording of the new Article.

Link to current CAP Constitution and Bylaws: http://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/CAP_Constitution_Bylaws_CAFAAE96BCA1C.pdf


Cheers,

[FW]

FW - could you please explain?  I am confused at what you are saying - and what are the real affairs you are referring to?

I've mentioned and explained my opinion on this in quite a number of recent posts.  As a former NB/NEC member, I've already made all the "difference" I could in CAP.  Now is the time for others to get involved and move to the top.  For members to make change in CAP, they must open up to more than just what is going on in their unit or, just talk about the state of things on CT.  I'm no longer interested in hearing excuses about why things can't be.  I'm no longer intereseted in hearing excuses about lack of time to be more involved in the "greater good". 
You either like the staus quo or, your not really interested in making positive change.  Either way, nothing will happen unless qualified and motivated members take the extra time, become more involved and move into positions of influence and authority. We need leaders more interested in the betterment of CAP than self.  You interested?

[lordmonar]

Here's an intresting idea.

What if we HIRED our National, regional and wing commanders?

That is the corporation (the BoG) were to find and hire full time commanders?  They would be free to look anywhere for these employees.

I can think of several different ways that would solve a lot of our problems.  Enformcment of regulations would be a lot better when a wing commander's job were on the line if he failed to keep his unit commanders following the regulations.

We would solve a lot of problems of issues not getting take care of because the Wing Commander did not have time to take care of it.

We would solve 90% of the national politics....and a big chunck of the wing level politics.

We would develope some long term leadership because we don't have to worry about people terming out. 

If we hire from outside of CAP we fill the gap by making sure he has a stong volunteer staff to support him.

It could be paid for by eliminating the wing admistrators and/or the State Directors (yes I know that the SD's are USAF employees but we can "contract" that function to the corporation.

A direct employer/contractor relationship would improve the USAF/CAP relationship.

[FW]

It is an interesting idea however, with decreased funding from congress and no certain funding stream from donors, I don't think it is feasible at this time.  I think it better to hold our leadership to what we advertise..... a strong ethical foundation and a true belief in our core values.

[Spike]

FW - could you please explain?  I am confused at what you are saying - and what are the real affairs you are referring to?

I've mentioned and explained my opinion on this in quite a number of recent posts.  As a former NB/NEC member, I've already made all the "difference" I could in CAP.  Now is the time for others to get involved and move to the top.  For members to make change in CAP, they must open up to more than just what is going on in their unit or, just talk about the state of things on CT.  I'm no longer interested in hearing excuses about why things can't be.  I'm no longer intereseted in hearing excuses about lack of time to be more involved in the "greater good". 
You either like the staus quo or, your not really interested in making positive change.  Either way, nothing will happen unless qualified and motivated members take the extra time, become more involved and move into positions of influence and authority. We need leaders more interested in the betterment of CAP than self.  You interested?

FW.  It is all political appointment.  You were one, as is every other member of the governing bodies.  So, if we are not in the "club" so to speak, we have less than a tiny chance to ever see anything higher than a Squadron Staff Position.  May I ask what items you brought to the board to improve CAP?  Don't say Wing Banker.  Many people take credit for that one. 

[BillB]

What would happen if the appoinment/election process was reversed? MeaningSquadron Commanders elected a Wing Commander. Wing Commanders elected the Region Commander and the Region Commanders acting as the NEC elected the National Commander? Alond the same line, the National Commander would appoint the Vice Commander, someone they could work with.

[FW]

FW.  It is all political appointment.  You were one, as is every other member of the governing bodies.  So, if we are not in the "club" so to speak, we have less than a tiny chance to ever see anything higher than a Squadron Staff Position.  May I ask what items you brought to the board to improve CAP?  Don't say Wing Banker.  Many people take credit for that one. 

When I became a SM, I was pretty much a "stranger in a strange land".  Other members in my squadron, for some reason, respected my work and opinions on things and soon ended up the squadron/cc. Unfortunatly, by then, I was one of only 2 active seniors in the squadron with 6 active cadets. By the end of my term, the squadron had over 60 cadets and 20 seniors performing great activities and a joy to be a part of.  After a few years, I asked the new wing/cc if I could be of assistance on his staff.  I was appointed the assistant finance officer.  In that capacity, I computerized the financial records for the first time and developed a way to keep track of aircraft expenses; which became known as "tail number accounting".  I got an award from the Air Force for that bit of change.  Anyway, after a while I became the wing/cs, then; well the rest of my CV is pretty much an open book.

When I was a wing/cc, I created an environment where membership rose 20% and our budget was cemented in by the Governor of our state for 3 straight years. 

When I was region/cs, I planned 3 region conferences which brought more members to it than the last 2 NB conferences.

As NFO, I won't say wing banker however, I will say the rewrite of the new Finance Reg and, insuring a 52% raise in our investments from 2004. Feel free to look over the minutes of the National Finance Committee for the last 4 years.  BTW, I was the one who made the decision to bring the WBP to the NEC for implimentation.  The WBP was developed by the current NFO.  He also, moved up through the ranks, and is the best individual for the job at this time.

Yes, Spike, politics plays a large part of what goes on in CAP.  However, there is plenty of room for new blood.  You just need to learn what it takes and move on it.  Just complaining about it does nothing.  Only proper and constructive action will work.

[necigrad]

So I'm probably breaking some informal unwritten internet forum rule by making my first post on a seriuos topic, but here goes anyway..

Some will disagree, but I believe that if we didn't have the cadet side providing warm bodies through Lackland AFB, the Air Force would have much less interest in us.

When I joined three years ago I would have agreed.  No longer however.  Since I have joined I have seen more and more use of CAP by the Air Force and the various Governments, Federal and State.  Look at how much we have been used for natural disasters.  And I know the Surrogate Predator Program is only for a small cross section of members, but CAP hasn't provided as much training assistance to Active Duty Personnel since WWII.  The AF has spent a few million dollars on that program, and our budget from Congress and the AF is something like $40 million.  That's a tremendous vote of support for our contributions IMO.

This could be the reason why we have so much to discuss here on CT.   We are like the NB and NEC.... to busy talking and caring about our own corner of the universe and, not taking a real stand on affairs which affect all of us.

There's a Cadet Advisory Council.  Maybe we need the same for the Membership as a whole.  Each Squadron sends a representative (maybe up to three reps per Squadron), then to Group, Wing, and Region.  The results of that goes to National.  You are then presented with the opinions of the Membership in a metered fashion, yet it comes from the Members, not the Officers of the Corporation (i.e. Wing Commanders).

I'm no longer intereseted in hearing excuses about lack of time to be more involved in the "greater good".  You either like the staus quo or, your not really interested in making positive change.

I actually take offense to this.  I'm all for contribution, that's why I'm here.  That's a horrendous statement however.  It's not nice to know that the time I carve out of my life, including full time work, half time student, volunteering with the local Police Department, AND volunteering in CAP isn't enough.  There's definatly something to be said about the "I'm just a volunteer" phrase being used as a crutch, but it's situational.  Youy can NOT use it as a blanket statement as it only fits one group of people, and a group that is really not representative of us as a whole at that.

[FW]

^Well, Daniel, thank you for placing things in proper perspective for me.  However, the comment is directed towards those who only want to complain about the leadership at the top and not actually do anything about it.  Yes, it's good to be "just a volunteer".  In fact, I think it is the best thing to be.  But, If you want to make significant changes, you gotta work towards a definable goal and have specific objectives to meet.  Anything else, IMO, is hot air.  If I want that, I can move to Arizona.

[ZigZag911]

Just to clarify my earlier post, I meant the NB vote on line, not CT members!

I feel reduced face to face contact may just hinder some of the political infighting.

It will certainly save travel expenses to CAP!

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

There was not doubt in anyone minds that the National Commander may be in charge, but the good colonel held the trump card.  And we were not a part-time auxiliary, we had the active-duty Wing Liaison Officers & NCOs for support.  Seniors and cadets all wore the same uniform, (although there were the infamous Smurf Suits).  What happened?  How did we end up like this, adrift?

We have demonstrated that we are not effective at governing ourselves.  How do we fix this?

These are questions I would also pose.

BG Anderson was in charge when I came into CAP, and it was just after the berry boards were adopted, which, for whatever reason, the AF saw fit to impose on us.  I've heard stories that it was to give us a slap in the face after a self-promoted MG and CAP personnel trying to dress down AF NCO's for not saluting us, I've heard it was for "distinctiveness"...but this all happened just prior to my joining, so I don't know the truth.

It might be oversimplifying it to say that the berry boards were the turning point in our relationship with the AF, but it seems that way to me, and, since this is a uniform thread, I'll go ahead and say so.  I heard more than one person, from a former Wing CC down to two former Squadron CC's, say it was so.

I remember the days of LO's and LNCO's.  They were better, I think, because it provided us a tangible point of contact with our parent service.  We had an excellent LO when I first signed up, and he was interested in ALL the membership, not just cadets.

I think the statement that "we are not effective at governing ourselves" holds a lot of truth.  We've wanted it our own way: to do what we want without AF "interference," but yet to look like the AF.

Personally, I would have us change to an AFRC General as our national CC, with a CAP General as deputy CC.  I would say ANG, except that there might be state/federal jurisdiction issues involved.  I would have AFRC Colonels as Region CC's, with CAP Colonels as Wing CC's.

ALL uniform changes that have ANYTHING to do with AF uniform parts, even if it were to wear the blue flight cap with the grey/whites, would have to be approved by the AF in advance.

But how likely is that to happen?

[Hawk200]

Just to clarify my earlier post, I meant the NB vote on line, not CT members!

That's how I read it. Still not sure why some people didn't.

[RiverAux]

I remember the days of LO's and LNCO's.  They were better, I think, because it provided us a tangible point of contact with our parent service.  We had an excellent LO when I first signed up, and he was interested in ALL the membership, not just cadets.

In our case they are/were the same thing.  The LO became the SD.  I see no difference between an LO, who had no command authority, and a civilian AF employee who has no command authority. 

[billford1]

If an AF Leader asked me why I think the AF would benefit from going back to the days prior to the 90's I would suggest that there are benefits to being able to run CAP the way they used to. 1. The AF benefits from recruiting Cadets for Military Service. Presently we have a lot of Cadets leave the program after a year. The Army has JROTC that helps feed their recruiting needs. AF LOs or LNCOs could help do likewise for the AF. 2. I think there's a case to be made for enhancements to Professional Development that could be improved by more AF LO involvement. My Son as a Cadet Lt was quitting CAP 3 years ago because of what he described as disorganized leadership where there was too much standing around. When AF people visit and brief us what they deliver is more dynamic and interesting which keeps us interested and setting goals. The role they play would likely make us better at what we do.

[Ned]

Not to take anything away from your post, but for historical accuracy:

1. The AF benefits from recruiting Cadets for Military Service. Presently we have a lot of Cadets leave the program after a year.

Our retention rates are pretty much the same as they have always been.  (Lousy, but consistent across the decades).  Most cadets left after one year in the 60's, 70's, and 80's as well.

The Army has JROTC that helps feed their recruiting needs. AF LOs or LNCOs could help do likewise for the AF.

Of course, the AF has their own AFJROTC detachments.  It has always been problematic to allow SDs/LO's/LNCOs/ to directly recruit cadets.

My Son as a Cadet Lt was quitting CAP 3 years ago because of what he described as disorganized leadership where there was too much standing around.

Again, not to beat a dead horse, but historical exit interviews have always suggested that units with high turnover often have issues with "disorganized leadership."  Not much has changed over the years.   And frankly, it is not too surprising.  I certainly have better things to do with my Tuesday nights than waste time at a unit where all we did was stand around (or just drill around the parking lot.)

[Major Carrales]

What would happen if the appoinment/election process was reversed? MeaningSquadron Commanders elected a Wing Commander. Wing Commanders elected the Region Commander and the Region Commanders acting as the NEC elected the National Commander? Alond the same line, the National Commander would appoint the Vice Commander, someone they could work with.

In that "anti-matter" universe we would have all the political problems involved with "running for office."  You know, people actively campaigning for WING COMMANDER, reprisals for commanders who did not support the WING commander and a host of real "lap dog"  and "pork barrel" politics.

Let's just leave it like it is.

[billford1]

This is for Ned but I'll spare the quotes. Ned do you feel like things are better now for CAP than they were back then?  Everybody I talk to who can remember it liked it better then. I don't mind when the AF Academy folks or other AF folks tell our Cadets about the AF. I do mind when Military Recruiters call the house and try to sell my Son a great future and give him DVDs. During the Viet Nam War the recruiters couldn't have got past my Parents because they had already lost a Son but not in Nam. Years later on I spotted the Army ROTC Officer at Broward Community College and  joined the  program with no assistance. In recent years we had an AF Liason Officer visit our CAP Squadron who later joined us. For a while he was our PDO and he really spoiled us.

[Ned]

Ned do you feel like things are better now for CAP than they were back then?  Everybody I talk to who can remember it liked it better then.

90% of we do or fail to do in the CP is at the squadron level.  And my take is that local units are substantially unchanged when compared to the past- some are successful, but most have challenges of one sort or another.

The great majority of the things that we spend so much time discussing here on CT - stuff like national-level drama and politics, uniforms, and CAP's choice of aircraft - rarely touch the typical Tuesday night meeting.  Where cadets and the dedicated seniors who support them largely go on training in Aerospace Education, Leadership, Character Education, & PT much like they have done since the late '60's.

Human nature being what it is, people always believe that things were better/tougher/stricter "in the old days."  I certainly had Old Salts take me aside when I was a cadet in the '60's and tell me about how Sorensen's new cadet program was a pale imitation of the "real" cadet program.  Similarly, when I commissioned into the Army in 1982, there was much complaining and bemoaning how "soft" the Cold War army had become.  And I certainly tell young attorneys today how easy they have it in court compared to when I was first starting out.


I certainly agree that all cadets benefit from a clear and genuine exposure to military life, and I know that Big Blue appreciates that aspect of our program.

Thanks for your contributions to our cadet program.  They are appreciated.


Ned Lee
National Cadet Advisor
(Cool job, crummy job title)

[High Speed Low Drag]

I've mentioned and explained my opinion on this in quite a number of recent posts.  As a former NB/NEC member, I've already made all the "difference" I could in CAP.  Now is the time for others to get involved and move to the top.  For members to make change in CAP, they must open up to more than just what is going on in their unit or, just talk about the state of things on CT.  I'm no longer interested in hearing excuses about why things can't be.  I'm no longer intereseted in hearing excuses about lack of time to be more involved in the "greater good". 
You either like the staus quo or, your not really interested in making positive change.  Either way, nothing will happen unless qualified and motivated members take the extra time, become more involved and move into positions of influence and authority. We need leaders more interested in the betterment of CAP than self.  You interested?

That's why I accepted the poistion of Dep Cmndr Cadets after 6 months back in CAP.  I probably spend at least 10-20 hours a week.  I have made the commitment.  When I am offered a position of higher responsibility, I will accept.  So yes, I am interested.

[Eclipse]

The great majority of the things that we spend so much time discussing here on CT - stuff like national-level drama and politics, uniforms, and CAP's choice of aircraft - rarely touch the typical Tuesday night meeting.  Where cadets and the dedicated seniors who support them largely go on training in Aerospace Education, Leadership, Character Education, & PT much like they have done since the late '60's.

+1

[High Speed Low Drag]

Human nature being what it is, people always believe that things were better/tougher/stricter "in the old days."  I certainly had Old Salts take me aside when I was a cadet in the '60's and tell me about how Sorensen's new cadet program was a pale imitation of the "real" cadet program.  Similarly, when I commissioned into the Army in 1982, there was much complaining and bemoaning how "soft" the Cold War army had become.  And I certainly tell young attorneys today how easy they have it in court compared to when I was first starting out.

Agreed - I tell the same things to new recruits as they come out of academy.
Some things that are better now then 25 years ago -

Availability of Resources - now that they are online, training is a lot easier - Communication amongst different areas of the country are better (Look at us here)
Cadet Programs - A lot more NCSAs, a lot more cool things to do during the summer.  Also, more respect for the cadet program from senior members.
More NHQ support of members - NHQ Staff are really helpful and seem to be really interested in helping members with their issues.

But having said that, there are other things that I think aren't as good - as mentioned previously.  I went to NSSC (Blue Beret) in '85.  I was reading yesterday how the program changed in the late '80s and early '90s.  I think that kinda reflects the change in mindset at that time.   Just told turkey needs attention - gotta go