Airborne Photographer

[Ricochet13]

I noted in the NIMS Training Memo dated April 2008, that an ES qualification for Airborne Photographer is listed in ATTACHMENT ONE - NIMS TRAINING COMPLIANCE CHART.  Does anyone have a SQTR for this ES qualification which they could share.  As far as I can tell, this qualification is authorized at the wing level, not national.

[davidsinn]

It hasn't been authorized yet. It's in the draft 60-3. It should be coming out soon.

[Tubacap]

Is this an extension of the SDIS Operator?  Are the requirements in 60-3?

[Ricochet13]

Does anyone have an advance copy of the Airborne photographer Task Guide or SQTR?  Would like to look as we have several members in two squadron who are very interested in pursuing this.  I'd like to give them a chance to see what's coming.  Hope it doesn't require pre-qualification in SDIS.

[JayT]

I've always felt that these skills should be part of the MS and MO rating.

[Eclipse]

I've always felt that these skills should be part of the MS and MO rating.

MS Should be the pre-req, but Photo Recon Officer should be a separate rating.

[jeders]

I've always felt that these skills should be part of the MS and MO rating.

MS Should be the pre-req, but Photo Recon Officer should be a separate rating.

Assuming that national is gonna use the training syllabus that I was taught back in Nov, then MS is a pre req. Mostly though, the quals are knowing how to work a camera and take decent photographs. I'll have to try and dig up the training cd, there were SQTRs for photographer/videographer and a mission staff position that processes and transmits the photos from mission base to the customer.

[Flying Pig]

Photo Recon Officer?  Something tells me the name is cooler than the job.

[JayT]

Photo Recon Officer?  Something tells me the name is cooler than the job.

Sounds like what I already do on air crew........snap pictures out of the side of a Cessna and log them.

[Eclipse]

Photo Recon Officer?  Something tells me the name is cooler than the job.

Sounds like what I already do on air crew........snap pictures out of the side of a Cessna and log them.

At the most basic level, that's what you're doing.  Just as all a Ground Team does is walk around looking for lost stuff, all mission pilots do is fly a plane, and all a comm guy does is talk on the radio.

But to be consistently successful at these things requires training, reasonable expectations, and practice.

Taking a photo of a still object on a sunny day with no pressure of performance is a skill some people never master - expecting them to be handed a camera on the way to the plane, especially when you consider that many scanners are treated like ballast to start with, is not reasonable or fair.

Its about time we started setting expectations and standards for a mission we have been pushing as a "marquee ability" for 5+ years.

[Frenchie]

Taking a photo of a still object on a sunny day with no pressure of performance is a skill some people never master - expecting them to be handed a camera on the way to the plane, especially when you consider that many scanners are treated like ballast to start with, is not reasonable or fair.

The 182 lands much better with some ballast in the back seat. 

[BigMojo]

Photography is like <CENSORED>.

Everyone can do it as long as the equipment is functional, but only a fraction are really good at it, and fewer still good enough to get paid very well to do it.

I like the idea...A quality picture by someone that has the training and skills is monumentally more useful than a point-n-pray out the back window.

[Psicorp]

I've been wondering when National was going to set up an actual training regiment for this.  The ability to do aerial photography makes us a great asset, but you're right, the pictures are only going to be as good as the training/talent of the lifeform behind the camera.

I recently aquired a Canon S5 IS and have been practicing with RoboGeo (ground photos only at this point) and am really interested in getting more air time to practice.   I haven't worked with the SDIS system yet.

Photo Recon Officer, huh?  Do we get "Recon" tabs with that? 

[Trung Si Ma]

Do we get "Recon" tabs with that? 

But can only be worn on AF style uniforms when the moon is full and the sun is directly overhead and all four seats in the 172 are filled.

[jimmydeanno]

Sure, but it would have to be lower precedence than the HMRS tab because you wouldn't be a real recon guy 

[RiverAux]

The thing is that taking a picture isn't that hard and there is absolutely no reason to track it by 101 card.

Why?  Because the vast majority of problems associated with aerial photography missions do not relate to the actuall photography skills of the person doing the work.

The main problems relate to trying to use a camera that you are not familiar with and not recording photos properly.

The first problem can't be solved by an ES qual since cameras vary widely across CAP and most of the time a scanner is going to be handed a camera on the tarmac and be told to make the best of it.  They may train with an actual CAP camera, but they may or may not ever actually use it.

The second problem is really an Observer issue.  A photographer rarely has the time to record photos and the Observer needs to be doing that paperwork while the photographer is looking out the plane. 

So, I predict that this ES qual will be roundly ignored and whatever Scanner or Observer is handy will be given a camera and be told to take pictures. 

[jeders]

The thing is that taking a picture isn't that hard and there is absolutely no reason to track it by 101 card.

Why?  Because the vast majority of problems associated with aerial photography missions do not relate to the actuall photography skills of the person doing the work.

The main problems relate to trying to use a camera that you are not familiar with and not recording photos properly.

The first problem can't be solved by an ES qual since cameras vary widely across CAP and most of the time a scanner is going to be handed a camera on the tarmac and be told to make the best of it.  They may train with an actual CAP camera, but they may or may not ever actually use it.

The second problem is really an Observer issue.  A photographer rarely has the time to record photos and the Observer needs to be doing that paperwork while the photographer is looking out the plane. 

So, I predict that this ES qual will be roundly ignored and whatever Scanner or Observer is handy will be given a camera and be told to take pictures. 

Actually, not so much. There is a lot more to taking a quality photo that the customer actually wants than just point and click. Also, a large part of the problem comes from the scanner not knowing how to get the pilot to line up the aircraft for a good shot. This specialty is intended to help solve these issues.

Also, it's my understanding that in Texas at least, most of the photo recon missions from the EOC will only be flown by people with this qualification. So if you want the missions, you have to get the training.

[RiverAux]

yes, it is more than point and shoot, but we're really just talking about a task rather than a position.  No need to make our scanners jump through even more hoops to maintain an unneeded slot on their 101 card.  Just have it be a task or two within what they're already expected to do.  Less to keep track of that way. 

[Eclipse]

I disagree, this needs to be a specifically identified position, mandating additional training and sorties.

we need to separate the "look out the window guys" from those who have chosen to take the time and learn how to take, process and use aerial photos.

As someone who has invested a lot of time and effort training myself, building a training curriculum, and flying real-world, successful missions, I can speak from experience that the average 2-missions a year scanner is as likely to take a photo of his own eye, or the curvature of the earth return anything useful.

Its like anything else, you can just do it, or you can do it right.

[RiverAux]

I look at it like the SDIS qualification which has been mostly a failure and ignored in our Wing. 

This is a task that every single scanner needs to know how to do since it is arguably a more important mission to CAP than looking out the window for broken airplanes.  I'm willing to be that the number of aerial photography sorties CAP does is approaching, if not already higher, than those looking for mission airplanes, which is mostly what we train our scanners to do. 

Why not up the capabilities of this position overall rather than coming up with a whole new system for something which isn't terribly difficult.