Short Stacking

[Zen Master Charlie]

Hello everyone,

Just a quick show of hands. I know females are allowed to "Short Stack" According to 39-1 "All some or none" but males cant "All or none" Would it be worth me proposing this for males too at the next CAC meeting in my group. Im not sure when it is so I'd like to get the proposal to my Rep ASAP. To be honest I'm fine going without all of my ribbons, infact, I usually dont wear them (Drill Team being the exception) But when I am required to wear my ribbons (if this is set as a standard for Encampment Staff or Squadron SOP Etc) I get really annoyed because I can't wear both my GTM badge and my Wings. I'm mighty proud of all of my ribbons, but at this point they just annoy the crap out of me!    Anyone think its worth it to type a memo for the next CAC meeting? I mean afterall, you can choose to wear all, some, or none, if this rule is approved. I think it would just make it a whole lot easier for people in my situation.

Just an Idea...

btw this is my first time back to CAPTalk in years, I elected to leave after people were chewing me out and being extremely rude, so I'm giving the forum a try again, I hope i get some positive feedback... it ceases to amaze me how rude some people can be on here...    But I know there's a few good souls out there! 

[arajca]

The loss of the "some" option for cadets came as a result of the NCAC proposing to force cadets to only wear their highest cadet achievement or milestone ribbon. The National Board took the opposite approach and removed the "some" option for cadets. The rationale of the NCAC was that higher ranking cadets had some many ribbons that it was more appropriate for cadets to just wear their highest. Since younger cadets would want to still wear all of their ribbons, they could eventually have a bigger stack than cadet officers who chose to short stack and this would not have been right. Obviously, the NB did not agree.

Would it be worthwhile to propose adding the "some" option back to cadets? Probably. Keep in mind it would need to go through your wing commander to be brought up to the National Board and would probably be sent to the uniform committee who is supposed to be developing a cohesive uniform policy/program for CAP.

Your wing commander cannot unilaterally authorize short stacking for cadets, since that is not in the authorized uniform modifications the wing commander can make.

[MIKE]

I don't think that cutting it down to your highest award/achievement ribbon, but wear everything else is unreasonable... and would be consistent with the practice of senior members.

[arajca]

I don't think that cutting it down to your highest award/achievement ribbon, but wear everything else is unreasonable... and would be consistent with the practice of senior members.

Only some senior members do this. I haven't seen many that short stack. Most wear all or none, except when they haven't bothered to update their rack.

[MIKE]

Meant that as a senior I could wear only my Earhart... I had to drop the Mitchell and the other achievement ribbons.  However; seniors have the option of wearing only the highest professional development ribbon as well.

[Zen Master Charlie]

The loss of the "some" option for cadets came as a result of the NCAC proposing to force cadets to only wear their highest cadet achievement or milestone ribbon. The National Board took the opposite approach and removed the "some" option for cadets. The rationale of the NCAC was that higher ranking cadets had some many ribbons that it was more appropriate for cadets to just wear their highest. Since younger cadets would want to still wear all of their ribbons, they could eventually have a bigger stack than cadet officers who chose to short stack and this would not have been right. Obviously, the NB did not agree.

Would it be worthwhile to propose adding the "some" option back to cadets? Probably. Keep in mind it would need to go through your wing commander to be brought up to the National Board and would probably be sent to the uniform committee who is supposed to be developing a cohesive uniform policy/program for CAP.

Your wing commander cannot unilaterally authorize short stacking for cadets, since that is not in the authorized uniform modifications the wing commander can make.

So the option was there years ago, but was dropped because of confusion and/or disagreement at the National board? Haha, why am I not supprised 

[MIKE]

Yeah... back WIWAC or 'round about then, there was a C/Col who was either cadet of the year or NCAC chair who was noted for it.  As seen in a nationally published photo.

[cnitas]

Go ahead and send it through your CAC.  It can't hurt, just don't hold your breath.

Really, there should not be a ribbon for each achievement.  There is already an award (stripe) for each promotion.  Ribbons for only Curry + milestones would cut down greatly on the generalissimo look of cadet officers.

Just my opinion as a former cadet officer.

[Zen Master Charlie]

Go ahead and send it through your CAC.  It can't hurt, just don't hold your breath.

Really, there should not be a ribbon for each achievement.  There is already an award (stripe) for each promotion.  Ribbons for only Curry + milestones would cut down greatly on the generalissimo look of cadet officers.

Just my opinion as a former cadet officer.

Agreed, and like I had said, I am proud of my ribbons, but my whole concern arose when a former Army officer who just jokingly said to me in a nice way, You look like a little General. It was kinda' funny at the time, but I thought about it, and its a sad truth. Its kind of embarrasing. In CAP its cool, I can show off all I want to younger cadets, but from an outsider standpoint, it looks rather unprofessional... like we get ribbons for squating on a toilet or something...

[ßτε]

You are mistaken that female cadets have "all, some, or none." They also have "all or none."

[Zen Master Charlie]

yes, depending on the unifrom combination. But in one of them, they do have the option of all some or none.

[ßτε]

yes, depending on the unifrom combination. But in one of them, they do have the option of all some or none.

Which one, specifically?

[Mark_Wheeler]

yes, depending on the unifrom combination. But in one of them, they do have the option of all some or none.

CAPM 39-1 Page 27 (Female Cadet Long Sleeve Blouse)

Ribbons:  Worn centered on the left side between buttons and arm seam, even with to 1 1/2 inches
higher or lower than the first exposed button with 3 in a row.  Bottom of ribbons will be even with
bottom of nameplate.  Wear all or none.  All ribbons and devices must fall below the bottom tip of
the collar when worn as an outer garment.

CAPM 39-1 Page 29 (Female Cadet Short Sleeve Blouse)

Ribbons:  Worn centered on the left side between buttons and arm seam, even with to 1 1/2 inches
higher or lower than the first exposed button with 3 in a row.  Bottom of ribbons will be even with
bottom of nameplate.  Wear all or none. 

Mark

[Zen Master Charlie]

yes, depending on the unifrom combination. But in one of them, they do have the option of all some or none.

CAPM 39-1 Page 27 (Female Cadet Long Sleeve Blouse)

Ribbons:  Worn centered on the left side between buttons and arm seam, even with to 1 1/2 inches
higher or lower than the first exposed button with 3 in a row.  Bottom of ribbons will be even with
bottom of nameplate.  Wear all or none.  All ribbons and devices must fall below the bottom tip of
the collar when worn as an outer garment.

CAPM 39-1 Page 29 (Female Cadet Short Sleeve Blouse)

Ribbons:  Worn centered on the left side between buttons and arm seam, even with to 1 1/2 inches
higher or lower than the first exposed button with 3 in a row.  Bottom of ribbons will be even with
bottom of nameplate.  Wear all or none. 

Mark

The idea comes from Senior Member unifroms. All cadet must wear all ribbons... it sucks, but some unifroms senior officers may wear all some or none. Thats where my idea comes from.

[AlphaSigOU]

Until the reg is changed, cadets are only allowed 'all or none'.

There is an unwritten tradition in the Air Force which has also been adopted by CAP: enlisted wear ribbons on the light blue shirt, while officers generally do not. As a senior member, I have a full stack of ribbons on my service dress while I just wear a short stack of nine ribbons on the shirt.

Top row: decorations (Commander's Commendation, National Commander's Unit Citation, Unit Citation)
Second row: professional development, cadet milestone and service awards (Paul Garber, Amelia Earhart awards and the Red Service Ribbon)
Third row: activity ribbons (Find, Disaster Relief with V and encampment ribbons)

For more details regarding short stacking, read my monograph on 'The Proper Wear of CAP Ribbons' pinned at the top of this forum.

[Hawk200]

There is an unwritten tradition in the Air Force which has also been adopted by CAP: enlisted wear ribbons on the light blue shirt, while officers generally do not.

It would be more accurate to say "some" in CAP have adopted this. I haven't, and I know many that haven't either.

As military enlisted, I wore all ribbons on blue shirts while AF, and do so on Class B's in the Army.

Not everyonr attempts to completely emulate AF officers at every turn.

[a2capt]

Great.. more "unwritten" ... "rules" ..

If it's not published via the official channel, it's not a rule, a regulation or anything like it. OTOH, it's open to interpolation and takes wild turns.

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

...National Board and would probably be sent to the uniform committee who is supposed to be developing a cohesive uniform policy/program for CAP.

Someone wake me when that happens.

A former squadron had several dual-status CAP/AFJROTC cadets, and they were allowed to wear ribbons from both.

I remember one cadet who had so many he had to wear them four to a row, and they still came up almost to his epaulettes.

In my experience, the average cadet ends up with considerably more ribbons than the average NPS CAP officer.

I do not think it is unreasonable to permit a "top-three" option for cadets.  I know the dual-status cadet I referred to earlier had a very difficult time keeping all those ribbons in proper order, clean and without fraying.

[Zen Master Charlie]

Until the reg is changed, cadets are only allowed 'all or none'.

There is an unwritten tradition in the Air Force which has also been adopted by CAP: enlisted wear ribbons on the light blue shirt, while officers generally do not. As a senior member, I have a full stack of ribbons on my service dress while I just wear a short stack of nine ribbons on the shirt.

Top row: decorations (Commander's Commendation, National Commander's Unit Citation, Unit Citation)
Second row: professional development, cadet milestone and service awards (Paul Garber, Amelia Earhart awards and the Red Service Ribbon)
Third row: activity ribbons (Find, Disaster Relief with V and encampment ribbons)

For more details regarding short stacking, read my monograph on 'The Proper Wear of CAP Ribbons' pinned at the top of this forum.

haha, I am well aware of this USAf tradition, I actually kind of agree with it. I met an AF Lt Col last week who wore his ribbons on his SS Blues, and I thought it was a little strange. Only later did I find out he was an enlisted man once   I personally prefer not to wear my ribbons, but some activities require them, such as NCC, or some encampments etc.

[Zen Master Charlie]

...National Board and would probably be sent to the uniform committee who is supposed to be developing a cohesive uniform policy/program for CAP.

Someone wake me when that happens.

A former squadron had several dual-status CAP/AFJROTC cadets, and they were allowed to wear ribbons from both.

I remember one cadet who had so many he had to wear them four to a row, and they still came up almost to his epaulettes.

In my experience, the average cadet ends up with considerably more ribbons than the average NPS CAP officer.

I do not think it is unreasonable to permit a "top-three" option for cadets.  I know the dual-status cadet I referred to earlier had a very difficult time keeping all those ribbons in proper order, clean and without fraying.

That brings up another good reason I want to have the ability to short stack. Were all volunteer members, and we pay CAP enough from our pockets as it is, some of us, a few dollars, and some of us, thousands of dollers, but when it comes to my ribbons, every time I get a new one or break a rack etc, I have to get a new rack, and taking ribbons off old racks and putting them on new racks they get frayed or bent. My last complete rack replacement cost $45... Its not like I just have that laying round, Im a poor student!!!!