New national Vice Commander and Chief of Staff

[Garibaldi]

Just got the email about the new appointment. COL Larry Myrick of PCR is the new Vice Commander, and COL Larry Ragland of MER is the new Chief of Staff.

[futura]

COL Larry Myrick of PCR is the new Vice Commander - an outstanding CAP officer. Excellent news!

[Private Investigator]

COL Myrick deserves the "star", he is just very exceptional on many levels   :clap:

[dwb]

Two excellent choices. I look forward to seeing this new command team in action!

[Eclipse]

More of the same.

I'm sure these gentlemen are fine members but they look to be "safe" choices that will not be interested in the
disruptive change CAP desperately needs to remain viable.

[capmaj]

I'm not familiar with Col Ragland. but Col Myrick is very much a proponent of CAP defining it's identity and moving forward with the times.

[Alaric]

More of the same.

I'm sure these gentlemen are fine members but they look to be "safe" choices that will not be interested in the
disruptive change CAP desperately needs to remain viable.

+1

[PHall]

Haven't we had enough "disruptive change" in the past couple of years?

[Eclipse]

Haven't we had enough "disruptive change" in the past couple of years?

We have had zero "disruptive" or for that matter any substantive change in a decade if not more, unless
you count program shrinkage and loss of missions and members.

"Drama" and other trivialities like uniforms are not "change" they are distractions.

All we have had under Maj Gen Carr is "station keeping".

A number of people whom I've whined about discussed this with feel that it is likely
that Maj Gen Carr was essentially advised to "go slow" and let "CAP cool off" after the
TMZ-like 5 years it had goes through previous to his tenure.  I have nothing attributable, but
that certainly wold not surprise me.

What we need are leaders who will make non-trivial hard choices, create and dictate strategic plans,
and accept the initial attrition that would come with actually expecting people to do their jobs and show up.

[MSG Mac]

I don't believe MG Carr was told to "go slow", but that under the new governance his mandate is to run CAP on a day to day basis in accordance with the C&BL, and Regulations. The BofG is now the governing body and they make policy and corporate decisions-Not the National Commander, Commanders Council, or the Senior Advisory Group. 

[Eclipse]

I don't believe MG Carr was told to "go slow", but that under the new governance his mandate is to run CAP on a day to day basis in accordance with the C&BL, and Regulations. The BofG is now the governing body and they make policy and corporate decisions-Not the National Commander, Commanders Council, or the Senior Advisory Group.

The new governance did not take effect until well into his term, and when you consider CAP's inertia, not to mention all the
transition tasks which were required to get through the changes, Gen Vasquez will really be the first CC/CEO to actually execute fully
in the new structure.

In both of their defense (not that they need my validation), Maj Gen Courter had a literal mess to clean up after HWSRN, and
then spent the rest of her term fighting people more interested in tearing her down personally instead of working in
the organization's best interest.  We still see that today in comments made off-handedly by people who probably shouldn't be (or aren't)
members any more.

When Maj Gen Carr took office, he still had to deal with many of those same people working in the background to undermine
his tenure because they viewed him as the same team. 

With that said...

The CC/CEO sets the tone, timbre and vector - he is the voice, face, and fuel behind getting anything done in CAP, just as with
any company or similar organization.  The BOG may wield the real behind-the-scenes power, but they will not stir men's souls to action,
nor are they the force behind turning the wrenches (or screws) to get things done.

If it is not important to HEADCAP, it will not be important to anyone else, and what is presented as important, can be
an indication to the membership as to whether or not a leader is serious about addressing real issues or simply wants
to maintain the apple cart.

[Panache]

What we need are leaders who will make non-trivial hard choices, create and dictate strategic plans,
and accept the initial attrition that would come with actually expecting people to do their jobs and show up.

With today's attitudes and priorities, that's easier said than done.  I have problems getting people to come to their "real" jobs, and we're paying them to do so!

The general consensus seems to be "I'll come in to work if I feel like it today."

[Eclipse]

I wish I could disagree...

[Chappie]

I'm not familiar with Col Ragland. but Col Myrick is very much a proponent of CAP defining it's identity and moving forward with the times.

Likewise...I have only met Col Ragland on a couple of occasions - but I have served with Col Myrick when he was a group commander, incident commander, wing commander and region commander.  I don't see him as a "place holder" but a "pace setter".

[Chappie]

More of the same.

I'm sure these gentlemen are fine members but they look to be "safe" choices that will not be interested in the
disruptive change CAP desperately needs to remain viable.

It is obvious that you have not spent time or been around Col Myrick.  He is not interested in the status quo.

[Chappie]

COL Myrick deserves the "star", he is just very exceptional on many levels   :clap:

+1

[flyboy53]

Col. Myrick was one of the instructors at the '09 NSC. Learned a lot, also came away highly motivated. You know both he and MG Carr were at that staff college. Should have realized we were working with the movers and shakers of this organization.

I do have a question though. Is this an interim appointment, or have we begun the military process of ensuring the command structure is intact by having one in place while the other is in transition.

And for the record, I though General Carr's tenure has been outstanding given the challenges. I also thought he accomplished a lot.

[Alaric]

Col. Myrick was one of the instructors at the '09 NSC. Learned a lot, also came away highly motivated. You know both he and MG Carr were at that staff college. Should have realized we were working with the movers and shakers of this organization.

I do have a question though. Is this an interim appointment, or have we begun the military process of ensuring the command structure is intact by having one in place while the other is in transition.

And for the record, I though General Carr's tenure has been outstanding given the challenges. I also thought he accomplished a lot.

Haven't seen much moving or shaking under Gen Carr's tenure

[THRAWN]

Haven't we had enough "disruptive change" in the past couple of years?

We have had zero "disruptive" or for that matter any substantive change in a decade if not more, unless
you count program shrinkage and loss of missions and members.


What we need are leaders who will make non-trivial hard choices, create and dictate strategic plans,
and accept the initial attrition that would come with actually expecting people to do their jobs and show up.

Could not agree more with these statements. The organization has engaged in a lot of busywork, but hasn't hunted new missions, or expanded existing missions and organizational relationships. When the most high profile "accomplishments" are a paperweight and creating a new class of member, there is a lot of room for improvement.

What we need is someone who will look to expand our ES capabilities into fields that we've touched on but not become the SME in. We need someone who will look at the cadet program and ask "If the military is giving incentives to cadets who enlist, why isn't there a mechanism in place to award some kind of credit to cadets who don't do that and go to college?". We need a leader who will look at our stagnant 1960's-one step above a filmstrip AE program and breathe some life back into it. We need a LEADER. Period.

[FW]

Our new Leadership team will take it's place in less than 60 days.  All have a deep knowlege of CAP and it's possiblities.  My hope is they serve CAP to its advantage and advance our organization to new heights. I wish them the best, and smooth air.  They deserve nothing less from all of us.

[Mustang]

More of the same.

I'm sure these gentlemen are fine members but they look to be "safe" choices that will not be interested in the
disruptive change CAP desperately needs to remain viable.

You haven't a clue what you're talking about.  As usual.

Myrick remains the best wing commander I've served under in nearly 30 years of writing checks to NHQ.

[Private Investigator]

More of the same.

I'm sure these gentlemen are fine members but they look to be "safe" choices that will not be interested in the
disruptive change CAP desperately needs to remain viable.

You haven't a clue what you're talking about.  As usual.

Myrick remains the best wing commander I've served under in nearly 30 years of writing checks to NHQ.

I agree, best Wing Commander ever and CAP has had many Wing Commanders.  :clap:

[Private Investigator]

"One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter". That could be paraphase to include National Commanders. WE all have agendas and anyone who has been a Commander at any level knows AE, CP and ES does not get an equal third of anything. So saying all that to say this, you can not make everyone happy and it is what it is.   

[Chappie]

More of the same.

I'm sure these gentlemen are fine members but they look to be "safe" choices that will not be interested in the
disruptive change CAP desperately needs to remain viable.

You haven't a clue what you're talking about.  As usual.

Myrick remains the best wing commander I've served under in nearly 30 years of writing checks to NHQ.

I agree, best Wing Commander ever and CAP has had many Wing Commanders.  :clap:

And you can add Region Commander to that list as well - just sayin'.

[Chappie]

"One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter". That could be paraphase to include National Commanders. WE all have agendas and anyone who has been a Commander at any level knows AE, CP and ES does not get an equal third of anything. So saying all that to say this, you can not make everyone happy and it is what it is.   

What I learned from Col Myrick was that if one doesn't know what there is to know about AE, CP, ES, etc. surround yourself with people who do.    When he approached me about serving as the CAWG HC years ago, he stated to me: "The CAWG Chaplain Corps is broken, fix it".   When I inquired as to how he wanted me to go about it, he simply said, "I don't know...do your Chaplain thing".   With that he gave me the latitude and the trust to do what I could to turn things around -- and that we did.  He never micro-managed but wanted to be kept in the loop.  And the quality of people of people who served on his staff -- at wing and region -- were amazing.  Best experience ever.

[Eclipse]

Myrick remains the best wing commander I've served under in nearly 30 years of writing checks to NHQ.

How nice for you - many people who were in the inner circle of HWSRN liked him, too, some still believe
he should still be commander and was on the right track.

That is not to say Col Myrick is in the same club.

I would love to be pleasantly surprised.

[Eclipse]

And the quality of people of people who served on his staff -- at wing and region -- were amazing.  Best experience ever.

Here's my issue with that, because I hear this all the time "Wing and Region staff are awesome..."  etc., etc.

Yes, for those >on< staff it can be great, pretty much carte blanch power in whatever your area is, up to and including
the whole wing / region, no real expectations of performance or even that people down or upstream know who you are,
and the ability to participate pretty much anywhere you want, in any mission or activity.

Then there's the access to resources, money, and information at a level the average member doesn't have, opening more opportunities
for those "in the know" and sometimes keeping them from the rank and file.

All "great" for the staff.

Except in far too many of those case the pyramid is upside down, and no one is helping the units of groups, who often feel
completely disconnected from CAP "reality".  Staff officers get decorations and awards for collating reports from the units and
groups, but never actually >do< anything with the information except file it and check the CI box.  The get an HS on their
inspection because they had 29 POAs (or whatever) in their folder, and that's the end of the conversation. (etc., etc.)

I've had far too much recent experience with too many people who talked a good game and then did either nothing
or the opposite of what they promised those around them they would do, or when off on shiny tangents that just waste time and resources
to take anyone at face value anymore.

Show me what people have done to "fix" CAP, and then we can talk about "awesome".

[Private Investigator]

^ I think we will just disagree. 

[Chappie]

^ I think we will just disagree. 

^ +1

And to borrow the statement from Mustang to Eclipse: "You haven't a clue what you're talking about.  As usual." -- especially when it comes to the leadership style demonstrated in the CAWG and PCR under Col Myrick and what he expected .... make that demanded ... of his staff.  He placed great emphasis on and reminded staff of why they were there....to serve and help facilitate the needs of the members.   

Sorry about your recent experiences and how it is affecting your current outlook, but Col Myrick has had a consistent track record of bringing out the best in others and providing the opportunities/resources to do so at each of his commands from squadron to region --- and I expect no less than that in his new assignment.

[arajca]

To the champions of Col Myrick, please keep in mind to many of us he was just a name on paper, if that. We have no experience with him and his leadership styles/abilities. So we have good reason to be skeptical until WE have seen how he operates and can form our own opinions of him. Many of us have seen the results, or lack thereof, of folks appointed to national leadership positions.

[Eclipse]

To the champions of Col Myrick, please keep in mind to many of us he was just a name on paper, if that. We have no experience with him and his leadership styles/abilities. So we have good reason to be skeptical until WE have seen how he operates and can form our own opinions of him. Many of us have seen the results, or lack thereof, of folks appointed to national leadership positions.

Exactly.

[Chappie]

To the champions of Col Myrick, please keep in mind to many of us he was just a name on paper, if that. We have no experience with him and his leadership styles/abilities. So we have good reason to be skeptical until WE have seen how he operates and can form our own opinions of him. Many of us have seen the results, or lack thereof, of folks appointed to national leadership positions.

Exactly.

Nice back pedal there Eclipse.  For only seeing his name on a piece of paper and not knowing his leadership style or experienced serving with him, you were sure quick to pull the trigger and prejudge him as "more of the same".  Hmmmm...if you haven't served with him or under his command or haven't seen him in action, how did you reach that conclusion???

[Eclipse]

Nice back pedal there Eclipse.  For only seeing his name on a piece of paper and not knowing his leadership style or experienced serving with him, you were sure quick to pull the trigger and prejudge him as "more of the same".  Hmmmm...if you haven't served with him or under his command or haven't seen him in action, how did you reach that conclusion???

Well, for starters, I see what leaks out of the edges of PCR and CAWG, and there are plenty of members
here who post regularly about the foibles, inexplicable policies, and general "left-coasty-ness" of CAWG and PCR.

Shall we start with a special GTM uniform and nomex required for flying, not to mention the
seeming inability to properly maintain the very supplements that assert those requirements?

That was my serve, this is where you hit the ball back and tell us how much they have fixed that made a difference at the unit level for the rank and file.

[SamFranklin]

More of the same.

I'm sure these gentlemen are fine members but they look to be "safe" choices that will not be interested in the
disruptive change CAP desperately needs to remain viable.

Give them a chance. Geesh!

[Mitchell 1969]

To the champions of Col Myrick, please keep in mind to many of us he was just a name on paper, if that. We have no experience with him and his leadership styles/abilities. So we have good reason to be skeptical until WE have seen how he operates and can form our own opinions of him. Many of us have seen the results, or lack thereof, of folks appointed to national leadership positions.

You've heard from people who know him and they speak highly of him. True, to others, he is just a name. But, "right to be skeptical?" How about tempering that a bit to "right to be neutral" until you get to know him? What has he done to earn skepticism?

[Chappie]

Nice back pedal there Eclipse.  For only seeing his name on a piece of paper and not knowing his leadership style or experienced serving with him, you were sure quick to pull the trigger and prejudge him as "more of the same".  Hmmmm...if you haven't served with him or under his command or haven't seen him in action, how did you reach that conclusion???

Well, for starters, I see what leaks out of the edges of PCR and CAWG, and there are plenty of members
here who post regularly about the foibles, inexplicable policies, and general "left-coasty-ness" of CAWG and PCR.

Shall we start with a special GTM uniform and nomex required for flying, not to mention the
seeming inability to properly maintain the very supplements that assert those requirements?

That was my serve, this is where you hit the ball back and tell us how much they have fixed that made a difference at the unit level for the rank and file.

Hmmmm --- difference at unit level and for rank and file???  Try taking command of a wing the size of California which was placed on a freeze until all of the assets were accounted for in the 50+ squadrons???  How about evaluated SARXs and Compliance Inspections that were marginal and satisfactory becoming Excellent and Outstanding?  Know about motivating membership participation that receives national recognition on a consistent basis at National Conferences?  How about providing a top notch Professional Development program for Seniors and Cadets???  That is the difference between what you and I see as leadership.  You see uniform issues and I see how his leadership impacted the membership.

[lordmonar]

Shall we start with a special GTM uniform and nomex required for flying, not to mention the
seeming inability to properly maintain the very supplements that assert those requirements?

That was my serve, this is where you hit the ball back and tell us how much they have fixed that made a difference at the unit level for the rank and file.

GTM uniforms were imposed on PCR by the NB not the other way around....and the Nomex required for flying is a thing of the past......not Myricks doing at all.

So...your serve is a Fault.....re-serve. 

[Eclipse]

What's he done?

[Eclipse]

GTM uniforms were imposed on PCR by the NB

Why would the NB care?

Cite please.

So something in the past, instituted or at least tolerated by the people we're discussing aren't relevent anymore?

[Eclipse]

Hmmmm --- difference at unit level and for rank and file???  Try taking command of a wing the size of California which was placed on a freeze until all of the assets were accounted for in the 50+ squadrons???  How about evaluated SARXs and Compliance Inspections that were marginal and satisfactory becoming Excellent and Outstanding?  Know about motivating membership participation that receives national recognition on a consistent basis at National Conferences?  How about providing a top notch Professional Development program for Seniors and Cadets???  That is the difference between what you and I see as leadership.  You see uniform issues and I see how his leadership impacted the membership.

Do you have any idea how many wings that list applies to?

You go back to the early 2000's and 1/2 the organization was on freeze, the other stuff is just part and parcel of keeping the doors open.  BTDT, all of it.

[lordmonar]

What's he done?

Ran the Region and IIRC no major F-ups, wings getting excellent on their evals, no major scandals, no politicians getting mad at us.    You know......his job.

Why....what is he supposed to do?  Sure there is what YOU want him to do.   But really......you are just a Debbie Downer about everything.

Gee.....we did not hire "that guy who's got the chopps to really "fix" CAP".   

A)   Not everyone......and by this I mean the BoG sees that CAP needs to be fixed all that much.   Sure here on CAPTALK we seem to be all doom and gloom.   But you have not really defined the problem....nor have you shown that we are "desperate" need to fix said problem.

B)  Even if the BoG sees the problem you have yet to define......their answer to it may be a little different.

As much as I like to argue about how we can "fix" CAP.......I am also perfectly happy with leaving it alone as well and I don't see any reason that we "MUST" "Fix" anything.

[lordmonar]

GTM uniforms were imposed on PCR by the NB

Why would the NB care?

Cite please.

So something in the past, instituted or at least tolerated by the people we're discussing aren't relevent anymore?

Because that was imposed on the region by the NB....I can't remember when....but just a few years ago.  I bet you can find reference to it here on CT with the search engine.

[lordmonar]

Hmmmm --- difference at unit level and for rank and file???  Try taking command of a wing the size of California which was placed on a freeze until all of the assets were accounted for in the 50+ squadrons???  How about evaluated SARXs and Compliance Inspections that were marginal and satisfactory becoming Excellent and Outstanding?  Know about motivating membership participation that receives national recognition on a consistent basis at National Conferences?  How about providing a top notch Professional Development program for Seniors and Cadets???  That is the difference between what you and I see as leadership.  You see uniform issues and I see how his leadership impacted the membership.

Do you have any idea how many wings that list applies to?

You go back to the early 2000's and 1/2 the organization was on freeze, the other stuff is just part and parcel of keeping the doors open.  BTDT, all of it.

When were you a Wing Commander?   I'm sorry I seem to have missed that in your CV.

[Eclipse]

You go back to the early 2000's and 1/2 the organization was on freeze, the other stuff is just part and parcel of keeping the doors open.  BTDT, all of it.
When were you a Wing Commander?   I'm sorry I seem to have missed that in your CV.

Relevance?

Is this information only available to the Skull and Bones?
Do you think fixing all those issues are not actually done by other people?

[Eclipse]

Ran the Region and IIRC no major F-ups, wings getting excellent on their evals, no major scandals, no politicians getting mad at us.    You know......his job.

And that's fair enough, which is...

What.
I.
Said.

"more of the same"  "safe choices"

And you're right, I want CAP "fixed", or at least working like the pamphlets say it should, for everyone.
Safe choices will only perpetuate the current trend.

I also said I would prefer to be surprised.

[lordmonar]

You go back to the early 2000's and 1/2 the organization was on freeze, the other stuff is just part and parcel of keeping the doors open.  BTDT, all of it.

When were you a Wing Commander?   I'm sorry I seem to have missed that in your CV.

Relevance?

Is this information only available to the Skull and Bones?
Do you think fixing all those issues are not actually done by other people?

You stick the words "led and directed" in front of it then.

Sure the work was done by other people.    Eisenhower did not win WWII.....other people did that.    The encampment director did not put on the encampment....other people did that.

Yep....no need for leaders at all....other people with just "do that" and we will have a happy successful program.

As for Relevance....you just said "BTDT".....I was wondering when you ever ran a wing and how you turned it back from going down in flames.

[RNOfficer]

Just got the email about the new appointment. COL Larry Myrick of PCR is the new Vice Commander, and COL Larry Ragland of MER is the new Chief of Staff.

Col Larry Myrick as Vice CC. What a disaster. A man without scruples or ability. A classic organization man who does nothing.

[SunDog]

I don't have a dog in the fight, and won't even be a player come Fall. . .and usually find Eclipse on the opposite side of the street. . .but. . .

Some of you guys think the new man is pretty, and done good work. . .but he's just another name to most of us.  Has he master-minded and driven transformational change?  You say he's done good on some inspections and evals designed and valued by the same culture that's overseeing CAP's descent into irrelevance? That  don't mean squat, does it?

Give him a chance? Not up to us - he already has the job. You mean wait a while before doubting him on this forum? Why? If he's all that, words in a row here won't matter.  If he's bought into the status-quo, he's just a diffrent face on the same show.

[Eclipse]

Don't tell Cyborg that (then) Col Myrick was responsible for seconding the motion to eliminate the CSU...

...sssshhhhhh...

[SunDog]

What's he done?

Ran the Region and IIRC no major F-ups, wings getting excellent on their evals, no major scandals, no politicians getting mad at us.    You know......his job.

But you have not really defined the problem....nor have .....I am also perfectly happy with leaving it alone as well and I don't see any reason that we "MUST" "Fix" anything.

I'm not all seeing, but will take a crack at defining a couple. . .

Something like half of senior members are 'ghosts" - not a sustainable situation for a membership organization.

The bureacratic hassles are so bad we can't give away free flying time. Or keep pilots. It's the Civil Air Patrol, not the Civil do gobs of useless administrivia Patrol.

NHQ can't indentify, embrace, and sell a set of capabilities to potential customers. We ain't gonna sustain ourselves hauling obsolete sensor packages and acting as air defense practice targets.

Wing fiefdoms. Non-GOB's can play. Some. Not too much, though.

[PHall]

Just got the email about the new appointment. COL Larry Myrick of PCR is the new Vice Commander, and COL Larry Ragland of MER is the new Chief of Staff.

Col Larry Myrick as Vice CC. What a disaster. A man without scruples or ability. A classic organization man who does nothing.

Funny, the folks who have actually served under the man seem to think differently.
Care to enlighten us?

[SarDragon]

Somehow, I think there's a sarcasm tag missing there. I certainly hope so.

[Eclipse]

Was thinking that was a little "direct" myself...

[FW]

GTM uniforms were imposed on PCR by the NB

Why would the NB care?

Cite please.

So something in the past, instituted or at least tolerated by the people we're discussing aren't relevent anymore?

Because that was imposed on the region by the NB....I can't remember when....but just a few years ago.  I bet you can find reference to it here on CT with the search engine.

Not quite. CAWG was in jepordy of losing it's ground SAR capability unless it's uniform complied with state mandates. The CAWG/CC made the motion to approve the uniform and the NB approved it.  End of Story.

[FW]

Just got the email about the new appointment. COL Larry Myrick of PCR is the new Vice Commander, and COL Larry Ragland of MER is the new Chief of Staff.

Col Larry Myrick as Vice CC. What a disaster. A man without scruples or ability. A classic organization man who does nothing.

Funny, the folks who have actually served under the man seem to think differently.
Care to enlighten us?

Can we play a little nicer? Our next National Commander made the decision to appoint his Vice Commander.  The BoG approved the decision.  CASE CLOSED.  The kind of arguments presented on this thread have, in the past, caused major turmoil in CAP.  IMHO, I think we should begin preparing for the future, and doing what we are asked in getting CAP to its stated goals.  Otherwise, please step to the rear of the bus...

[SunDog]

If comments on an unofficial forum caused major turmoil, something else is very broken. Ouside the one post, which was harsh, it sounded like some cheerleaders debating with some weary cynics.

Hey, if the guy is superman, good for CAP; if he's just another status quo insider, bad for CAP.  Either way, who cares if the CC appointed him and the BoG approved? They appoint and approve bad actors and poor leaders with regularity.  We pay to play, this isn't USAF, and we aren't following these folks into combat. No reason to not debate the competency or leadership of these folks.

I hope his cheerleaders are right, too. . .

[FW]

Debating a member's character on a public forum, IMHO, doesn't do anything positive for us, however I do understand what you are saying. I'm just tired of hearing the "same old same old ". It's been going on in CAP for ever, or for at least the last 30 years. It has lead, in some part, to our present governance, diminished the authority of our region and wing commanders, and may be causing a decline in mission effectiveness. Then again, it is nice to see almost 400 members enjoying PAWGs summer cadet training schools at FIG. Maybe it really doesn't matter. Just sayn'.

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

The kind of arguments presented on this thread have, in the past, caused major turmoil in CAP.

What kind of "major turmoil?"

[jeders]

Somehow, I think there's a sarcasm tag missing there. I certainly hope so.

I doubt it.

Was thinking that was a little "direct" myself...

Considering the disrespect shown by the poster in the past, I'm not surprised. Oh well, I guess I'll just ignore it.

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

Don't tell Cyborg that (then) Col Myrick was responsible for seconding the motion to eliminate the CSU...

...sssshhhhhh...

Rather irrelevant so long after the fact...though I would like to know his reasons.

[FW]

The kind of arguments presented on this thread have, in the past, caused major turmoil in CAP.

What kind of "major turmoil?"

CT, as an "unofficial forum" for CAP, has more influence on opinions than you may expect.  You would be surprised to know some of the "lurkers" enjoying our posts.  I get feedback from "friends" all the time.  It is a source of information which is not taken for granted. Arguments (ok discussions) presented here are also made between our leaders.  It is part of the give and take of the "process", however public personal attacks or praise from those who don't have the knowledge to make a full assesment cause problems, and turmoil.

From the "inside", I can only speak of "arguments" (as presented on CT and elswhere) between 1999 and 2011.  We can start with the events leading to the "visit" by the FBI and ending with the election of our current National Commander.  IMHO, more cooperation and less personal agenda may have prevented much of the "major turmoil" (most of which were presented here on CT) in CAP.  In those years, we've seen the publication of a white paper changing the nature of CAP, the creation of othe BoG, the resignation of a National Commander, the relief of cammand of another, the complete change of the authority of the region and wing commanders, and two constitutions and bylaws. As an observer of the National Leadership between 1994 and today, I would even venture to say our history would have led us in a very different path if we had put personal agendas and petty personal feuds aside.
I understand we all want things to go our way, all the time; it just isn't reality to expect it.  I believe in our core values, and want to make CAP work.  That means working with our leadership; no matter who they are. It is what professionals do.  YMMV...

[SunDog]

Not too surprised, I think; got a thinly disguised, and annoyed, response from top leadership once.  But again, if tough criticism and venting on CT has precipitated damaging change, the management model is broken.

Someone can be smart, nice, hard working, professional, dedicated, and well connected. And abysmal as a senior manager. And/or the culture can be so gacked that superman couldn't change it's course.

CAP probably isn't fatally broken, not yet; but it most definetly is broken to a serious degree.  Don't care who is arranging the deck chairs; Wing, Region, National, it really doesn't matter to most of us. Cut out the nonsense, the time sucks, the freakin' death grip on the 1960's org charts. . .guess what? Most of us know we can't have it all our own way, and don't need to be told that.

Just no more "free beer tomorrow" . . .

[Mitchell 1969]

GTM uniforms were imposed on PCR by the NB

Why would the NB care?

Cite please.

So something in the past, instituted or at least tolerated by the people we're discussing aren't relevent anymore?

Because that was imposed on the region by the NB....I can't remember when....but just a few years ago.  I bet you can find reference to it here on CT with the search engine.

Not quite. CAWG was in jepordy of losing it's ground SAR capability unless it's uniform complied with state mandates. The CAWG/CC made the motion to approve the uniform and the NB approved it.  End of Story.

Fwiw, those "mandates" were phantom at the time and nobody I know ever actually saw them. I know I never came across them at all as the head of a law enforcement agency in CA. Personally, I doubt that they ever existed, other than in the mind of one or two CAP people who sold somebody a bag of magic beans.