Has anyone ever heard of this bunch?

[Майор Хаткевич]

Good deeds and all.

[a2capt]

It's funny, all through this thread where it drifted to the air ambulance service, I was like "Who?" .. I guess I've tuned that whole thing out

[Майор Хаткевич]

Nice. Not too familiar with Wales usage myself.

[MSG Mac]

According to what I heard on NPR today, Flt Lt Wales is considering flying helecopters for an Air Ambulance Company.
Just proves that saving lives is a hard habit to break! :clap:

Now that he's become a Duke. he is referred to as Flt Lt Cambridge.

[Майор Хаткевич]

According to what I heard on NPR today, Flt Lt Wales is considering flying helecopters for an Air Ambulance Company.
Just proves that saving lives is a hard habit to break! :clap:

Now that he's become a Duke. he is referred to as Flt Lt Cambridge.

Why don't they use Windsor?

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

According to what I heard on NPR today, Flt Lt Wales is considering flying helecopters for an Air Ambulance Company.
Just proves that saving lives is a hard habit to break! :clap:

Now that he's become a Duke. he is referred to as Flt Lt Cambridge.

Why don't they use Windsor?

I believe that the actual last name of the Royal Family is Windsor-Mountbatten, but that Prince Charles and his descendants use "Wales" because of his title as the Prince of Wales.

Hence, Flight Lieutenant and Captain Wales.

[Brit_in_CAP]

Yes, quite true!  The 'other realms and dominions' adopted the pattern of uniform from the 'Mother Country' to an amazing extent!  That is, part from (wait for it)...the cammo uniforms..!

New Zealand personnel are almost indistinguishable from the "Mother Country," except for the nationality flash, as are the RCN. 


The Canadian Army has a different shade of green, and the RCAF uses gold sleeve rings and Army ranks.  The Australian Army uses their famed "slouch hat."

The RAAF uses the same cut as the RAF, but in a (very attractive) "midnight blue."

Personally, I rather liked the NZ air force - both the people and the uniform - and tried to transfer.  Such things were, at the time, both reasonably common and quite permissible.  Sadly, my timing was poor and the NZ air force didn't want engineers!  I met several at the RAF College, and I found them to be a very professional organization.  Their summer uniform, intended for the NZ summer, always caused a few smiles: short sleeved shirt, knee-length shorts and long socks!  I never had the opportunity with work with the RAAF or the Canadian Forces, sadly.  The RAAF did impress me, I have to say, when they attempted to rescue the crew of a yacht on which my friend and former colleague was a crew member.  Sadly, that turned into a body recovery but the professionalism of the response was very impressive.

[Brit_in_CAP]

According to what I heard on NPR today, Flt Lt Wales is considering flying helecopters for an Air Ambulance Company.
Just proves that saving lives is a hard habit to break! :clap:

Now that he's become a Duke. he is referred to as Flt Lt Cambridge.

Why don't they use Windsor?

I believe that the actual last name of the Royal Family is Windsor-Mountbatten, but that Prince Charles and his descendants use "Wales" because of his title as the Prince of Wales.

Hence, Flight Lieutenant and Captain Wales.

If I may....the 'family name' is Windsor for all those who are in the direct line of succession.  The family name of Mountbatten-Windsor applies to the members of the Royal Family who are not entitled to use the title of Prince or Princess.

The name 'Windsor' was adopted in WW1 as the original family name was linked to the German monarchy!  Mountbatten-Windsor.  Edward VII and his son, George V, were members of the German ducal House of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha by virtue of their descent from Albert, Prince Consort, husband of Queen Victoria. High anti-German sentiment amongst the people of the British Empire during World War I reached a peak in March 1917, when the Gotha G.IV, a heavy aircraft capable of crossing the English Channel, began bombing London directly and became a household name. In the same year, on 15 March, King George's first cousin, Nicholas II, the Emperor of Russia, abdicated, which raised the specter of the eventual abolition of all the monarchies in Europe. The King and his family were finally convinced to abandon all titles held under the German Crown and to change German titles and house names to anglicized versions. Hence, on 17 July 1917, a royal proclamation issued by George V declared that the 'family name' would be Windsor.  That was later confirmed by the current Queen when Lord Louis Mountbatten, whose nephew she had married, politicked to have the family name changed to that of the husband (Mountbatten). (Thanks, Wikipedia for some help here)

That action famously caused Prince Philip to comment (and I quote): "I am nothing but a bloody amoeba. I am the only man in the country not allowed to give his name to his own children."

The children of the Prince of Wales use 'Wales' simply as a derivative of their father's title, Prince of Wales.  As small children, when they occasionally travelled circumspectly, their airlines passages etc were booked under the name of Cambridge, as it happens.

[Eclipse]

http://capvolunteernow.com/todays-features/?uk_civil_air_patrol_chairman_hails_bond_with_us_cap_between_nations&show=news&newsID=18622



"Capt. Bill Henry (right) of the Mississippi Wing's Col. Berta A. Edge Composite Squadron is welcomed to the UK Civil Air Patrol by the organization's chairman, James A. "Tony" Cowan, at one of the UK's premier aviation events, AeroExpo at Sywell Aerodrome in Northamptonshire.


The approach of the 70th anniversary of the D-Day landings in Normandy on June 6, 1944, has prompted the chairman of Civil Air Patrol's U.K. counterpart to share his thoughts about the links between the two organizations and their nations.

"Many of us, particularly those who have served in the military, will recognise the 'special relationship' that binds our two great countries, the UK and the USA, particularly as we remember the liberation of Europe and the D-day landings that took place 70 years ago in Normandy, France," James A. "Tony" Cowan said in an email Monday to National Headquarters.

"This 'special relationship' also extends to the Civil Air Patrol in both countries," Cowan added.

He also took the opportunity to note that "one of the UK CAP's most recent recruits is Bill Henry, who is also a member of the U.S. CAP Mississippi Wing."

"Bill is resident in the UK this summer, and he will now pursue his CAP activities on this side of the 'pond,'" he said.

Henry, a CAP captain, serves as deputy commander for seniors for the Mississippi Wing's Col. Berta A. Edge Composite Squadron. His wing commander, Col. Mallory Woodcock, is a native of England who moved to the U.S. in 2000 to pursue an aviation career.

Cowan's organization, also known as Sky Watch Civil Air Patrol, was founded in 2000. It focuses on the use of small aircraft and microlight pilots to assist with air traffic control and emergency services, providing search and rescue and air-sea rescue resources when called on to do so."

[Brad]

What's really interesting is the can of worms of the actual RAF volunteer components:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Air_Force_Volunteer_Reserve

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Auxiliary_Air_Force

[Brit_in_CAP]

What's really interesting is the can of worms of the actual RAF volunteer components:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Air_Force_Volunteer_Reserve

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Auxiliary_Air_Force

..and that's an understatement!

In reality it is much simpler than is described in the ever helpful Wikipedia.  The RAuxAF forms the deployable portion of the 'weekend warrior' reservists.  The RAF Volunteer Reserve (Training Branch) or RAF(VRT) exists solely to provide commissioned officers for the Air Training Corps and RAF Elements of the Combined cadets Force (found in large, usually fee-paying) schools.  Unlike the CAP, VRT officers hold actual commissions and can be paid up to (I think) 14 days per year in their substantive tank, which is never higher than Flying Officer (1st Lt); VRT officers wearing rank above that hold acting rank.  The University Air Squadrons (UAS) are likewise purely for training, similar to the ROTC.  During the Cold War, the UAS were allocated as home defense forces and actively practiced that role.

The whole reserve structure was rebuilt post Persian Gulf war so that all the reserves were deployable - training portions excepted - and 'home defence units' (sic) were removed.  Further restructuring removed the RAFVR, RAuxAF and RAF Reserves as separate entities and consolidated them, albeit that some of the titles remain.

It really is simpler in reality than it appears!

The British Army and RN Reserves were likewise massively restructured, which led this year to the demise of the Territorial Army when it was combined into a single organization with the existing Army Reserves.  Some of the regimental titles remain, principally the Yeomanry units.

During my time at college, I had a 'war role' as part of (if I recall correctly) London UAS which would have seen us deployed to support the squadron's aircraft used as observation platforms performing post-attack reconnaissance and similar roles.  Having spent 5 years enlisted, this was not something that concerned me although it rather worried some of the 'young gentlemen' who aspired to fly when they realized that would, at best, be a sentry under the command of someone like me...

[Brit_in_CAP]

http://capvolunteernow.com/todays-features/?uk_civil_air_patrol_chairman_hails_bond_with_us_cap_between_nations&show=news&newsID=18622

The approach of the 70th anniversary of the D-Day landings in Normandy on June 6, 1944, has prompted the chairman of Civil Air Patrol's U.K. counterpart to share his thoughts about the links between the two organizations and their nations.

"Many of us, particularly those who have served in the military, will recognise the 'special relationship' that binds our two great countries, the UK and the USA, particularly as we remember the liberation of Europe and the D-day landings that took place 70 years ago in Normandy, France," James A. "Tony" Cowan said in an email Monday to National Headquarters.

"This 'special relationship' also extends to the Civil Air Patrol in both countries," Cowan added.

He also took the opportunity to note that "one of the UK CAP's most recent recruits is Bill Henry, who is also a member of the U.S. CAP Mississippi Wing."

"Bill is resident in the UK this summer, and he will now pursue his CAP activities on this side of the 'pond,'" he said.

Henry, a CAP captain, serves as deputy commander for seniors for the Mississippi Wing's Col. Berta A. Edge Composite Squadron. His wing commander, Col. Mallory Woodcock, is a native of England who moved to the U.S. in 2000 to pursue an aviation career.

Cowan's organization, also known as Sky Watch Civil Air Patrol, was founded in 2000. It focuses on the use of small aircraft and microlight pilots to assist with air traffic control and emergency services, providing search and rescue and air-sea rescue resources when called on to do so."

Interesting; thanks for sharing. 

I once asked, via CAPTALK, if anyone knew of more Brits in the CAP.  The replies offered a few names but the reality is that there are more than I thought.

Being able to be part of the CAP and to serve the young people in the cadet program was not something I ever anticipated when we moved to the United States and you have made me more than welcome since I joined in 2011. 

I've heard much in recent days about the special relationship but I've seen it at first hand, both in CAP and through the eyes of my Marine Corps son and Coastguard daughter.

Thank you for allowing me the privilege of serving with you.  I look forward to a long association!

[Garibaldi]

http://capvolunteernow.com/todays-features/?uk_civil_air_patrol_chairman_hails_bond_with_us_cap_between_nations&show=news&newsID=18622

The approach of the 70th anniversary of the D-Day landings in Normandy on June 6, 1944, has prompted the chairman of Civil Air Patrol's U.K. counterpart to share his thoughts about the links between the two organizations and their nations.

"Many of us, particularly those who have served in the military, will recognise the 'special relationship' that binds our two great countries, the UK and the USA, particularly as we remember the liberation of Europe and the D-day landings that took place 70 years ago in Normandy, France," James A. "Tony” Cowan said in an email Monday to National Headquarters.

"This 'special relationship' also extends to the Civil Air Patrol in both countries," Cowan added.

He also took the opportunity to note that "one of the UK CAP's most recent recruits is Bill Henry, who is also a member of the U.S. CAP Mississippi Wing."

"Bill is resident in the UK this summer, and he will now pursue his CAP activities on this side of the 'pond,'" he said.

Henry, a CAP captain, serves as deputy commander for seniors for the Mississippi Wing's Col. Berta A. Edge Composite Squadron. His wing commander, Col. Mallory Woodcock, is a native of England who moved to the U.S. in 2000 to pursue an aviation career.

Cowan's organization, also known as Sky Watch Civil Air Patrol, was founded in 2000. It focuses on the use of small aircraft and microlight pilots to assist with air traffic control and emergency services, providing search and rescue and air-sea rescue resources when called on to do so."

Interesting; thanks for sharing. 

I once asked, via CAPTALK, if anyone knew of more Brits in the CAP.  The replies offered a few names but the reality is that there are more than I thought.

Being able to be part of the CAP and to serve the young people in the cadet program was not something I ever anticipated when we moved to the United States and you have made me more than welcome since I joined in 2011. 

I've heard much in recent days about the special relationship but I've seen it at first hand, both in CAP and through the eyes of my Marine Corps son and Coastguard daughter.

Thank you for allowing me the privilege of serving with you.  I look forward to a long association!

There is a cadet in my unit who was born there to an American father and an English mother, and lived there for a time, but he doesn't have an accent.

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

Unlike the CAP, VRT officers hold actual commissions

It is much the same in Canada, Australia and New Zealand.

The only difference in Canada is the cap badge


RCAF Officer

RCAirC Officer

Other than that, the uniform is exactly the same as that worn by the RCAF.

In Australia and New Zealand, the only difference is the shoulder flashes; they are organisation-specific (in Australia, "AAFC") rather than just the standard curved nationality flashes.



They also tend not to have the demands of svelteness placed on them as we do, nor the Bravo Sierra gamut of "alternative" uniforms.

[Brit_in_CAP]

There is a cadet in my unit who was born there to an American father and an English mother, and lived there for a time, but he doesn't have an accent.

Interesting.  From personal experience I would say that children are much quicker in loosing accents than adults; the older they are, the less likely they are to loose the accent.  YMMV.

[Brit_in_CAP]

Unlike the CAP, VRT officers hold actual commissions

It is much the same in Canada, Australia and New Zealand.

The only difference in Canada is the cap badge


Other than that, the uniform is exactly the same as that worn by the RCAF.

In Australia and New Zealand, the only difference is the shoulder flashes; they are organisation-specific (in Australia, "AAFC") rather than just the standard curved nationality flashes.

They also tend not to have the demands of svelteness placed on them as we do, nor the Bravo Sierra gamut of "alternative" uniforms.

The similarities don't surprise me, to be honest.  I used to teach ATC history WIWAC and I have a vague memory that the Commonwealth formations drew on the mother country's model extensively.  As we've discussed elsewhere the air forces of the commonwealth drew heavily on the RAF at their formation so a similarity in the cadet organizations is to be expected.

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

^^^My point is that the RAF/RAAF/RCAF/RNZAF do not impose the strictures on "distinctiveness" or H/W/grooming on their Cadet services that the AF does with us, nor do they have this pantechnicon full of "alternate" uniforms that we do.

http://www.aircadets.ca/870/pers_staff.shtml
The RCAirC officers of this unit are nearly indistinguishable from their RCAF counterparts.

[lordmonar]

^^^My point is that the RAF/RAAF/RCAF/RNZAF do not impose the strictures on "distinctiveness" or H/W/grooming on their Cadet services that the AF does with us, nor do they have this pantechnicon full of "alternate" uniforms that we do.

http://www.aircadets.ca/870/pers_staff.shtml
The RCAirC officers of this unit are nearly indistinguishable from their RCAF counterparts.

No....they hold their officers to the same entry criteria as their real officers....so there you go.

[Storm Chaser]

May we should do the same in CAP. 

[Mela_007]

I will be interested to hear from my fellow squadron member about his time with the UK CAP this summer!  Bring home lots of stories Bill.