Wannbe's (USDRC)

[flyboy53]

Would she feel the same way if you were a captain or lieutenant in a volunteer fire department or ambulance squad?

The sad thing is that I question if you would really see these guys at a disaster or, if they were, what their real roles might be. Its another reason why we as an organization should strive to be as professional as possible in everything we do. It's that professionalism that will draw more gold stars from the Air Force and gain us greater credibility and respect as an organization.

Also, you forgot to mention the various state guards or state defense forces that are out there.

And, I now see why it was so important to go through all the NIMS stuff. Without it, the CAP might be in the same boat.

[mbrown]

I think it's sad that these people have to join these 'organizations'. Also like others, my mind immediately jumped to USRC. And while some others said that these groups only help make us look better towards the Air Force, what about the people, who whenever they see people running around in BDUs with blue name tapes that say 'Civil Air Patrol' they just think we're a bunch of wannabe's.

[Eclipse]

Your bearing, attitude, and responses when asked will decide their impression.

What I tell my people is that we don't benefit from the inherent "cool points" that those in the active services get automatically, we need to be on our best behavior at all times and insure we characterize our role and place in the universe honestly.

[RADIOMAN015]

Here's a story I figured some of you would enjoy....

I notice a guy dressed in woodland BDU's with a set of rail road tracks on his collar and an eight pointed cap on the table talking to a guy in civilian dress.

We get out order, and we sit on the table accross the guy when a women comes up and thanks him for his service. As the 'captain' turns, I see that he has 'USDRC' on his service tape, and remembered see this link on CAPTalk a while back (http://www.usdrc.us/). I didn't say anything the second or third civie came up and thanked him.

This same type of mistaken identity takes place also with CAP personnel dressed in military type BDU's.   Again this is why I advocate us (especially seniors) going to the Blue BDU's and also Blue Flight Suits.  I would hope that at least CAP personnel would state who they really are and what we do and not take credit for thanks for something they are not

I think it is better for CAP to be "distinctive" and known/identified as Civil Air Patrol rather than be mistaken for being military personnel.

As far as this organization goes, I did a quick google news search and could not come up with even one news article about this organization.  So apparently they either have no PAO policy; are secretative of what they do; or really aren't doing anything other than running around with BDU's and stopping in eat establishments to be "thanked for their service"
RM

[mbrown]

Here's a story I figured some of you would enjoy....

I notice a guy dressed in woodland BDU's with a set of rail road tracks on his collar and an eight pointed cap on the table talking to a guy in civilian dress.

We get out order, and we sit on the table accross the guy when a women comes up and thanks him for his service. As the 'captain' turns, I see that he has 'USDRC' on his service tape, and remembered see this link on CAPTalk a while back (http://www.usdrc.us/). I didn't say anything the second or third civie came up and thanked him.

This same type of mistaken identity takes place also with CAP personnel dressed in military type BDU's.   Again this is why I advocate us (especially seniors) going to the Blue BDU's and also Blue Flight Suits.  I would hope that at least CAP personnel would state who they really are and what we do and not take credit for thanks for something they are not

I think it is better for CAP to be "distinctive" and known/identified as Civil Air Patrol rather than be mistaken for being military personnel.

As far as this organization goes, I did a quick google news search and could not come up with even one news article about this organization.  So apparently they either have no PAO policy; are secretative of what they do; or really aren't doing anything other than running around with BDU's and stopping in eat establishments to be "thanked for their service"
RM

I don't think we need to wear the Distinctive Uniforms, the problem is that this person wasn't honest to those people in the restaurant and wanted the thanks. I think there's nothing wrong with us wearing our uniforms and doing our jobs. This person was just there to take credit. 

[Hawk200]

Here's a story I figured some of you would enjoy....

I notice a guy dressed in woodland BDU's with a set of rail road tracks on his collar and an eight pointed cap on the table talking to a guy in civilian dress.

We get out order, and we sit on the table accross the guy when a women comes up and thanks him for his service. As the 'captain' turns, I see that he has 'USDRC' on his service tape, and remembered see this link on CAPTalk a while back (http://www.usdrc.us/). I didn't say anything the second or third civie came up and thanked him.

This same type of mistaken identity takes place also with CAP personnel dressed in military type BDU's.   Again this is why I advocate us (especially seniors) going to the Blue BDU's and also Blue Flight Suits.  I would hope that at least CAP personnel would state who they really are and what we do and not take credit for thanks for something they are not

I think it is better for CAP to be "distinctive" and known/identified as Civil Air Patrol rather than be mistaken for being military personnel.

As far as this organization goes, I did a quick google news search and could not come up with even one news article about this organization.  So apparently they either have no PAO policy; are secretative of what they do; or really aren't doing anything other than running around with BDU's and stopping in eat establishments to be "thanked for their service"
RM

I don't think we need to wear the Distinctive Uniforms, the problem is that this person wasn't honest to those people in the restaurant and wanted the thanks. I think there's nothing wrong with us wearing our uniforms and doing our jobs. This person was just there to take credit.

I'd agree. I've taken the time to educate people on what Civil Air Patrol is, and explain the difference between us and regular military. It's a little easier to explain the differences when I tell them I'm both, although it raises a few eyebrows when the former military ones find that I'm enlisted military, and officer CAP. But it has also resulted in new recruits a few times that ended up to our benefit.

The issue of people looking for "thanks" still puzzles me. Personally, I feel a little awkward in some of the profuse thanks I have received in the past for my military service. I've been around a while, but I've never done anything dangerous or heroic that would merit the label of "hero" that I've been given at times. I've served, but it's not the same. Some people have funny ideas about what heroes actually are.

[tdepp]

And, I now see why it was so important to go through all the NIMS stuff. Without it, the CAP might be in the same boat.

Fly:
Agreed.  The FEMA training and requirements not only helps prepare us for disaster missions but also gives us credibility with our counterparts who are in LE, fire/rescue, emergency management, etc.  They take the same courses.  It shows our members' commitment to training and standards that are similar to theirs.

I've talked to some old timers in the US Coast Guard Auxiliary and some of their members have been reluctant to embrace the FEMA training.  (I believe they have a similar set of requirements as CAP does so if people don't do them, they can't be on certain missions.  There are still other duties USCGA auxiliarists can do, if I understand their organization correctly.)  CAP is an interesting dichotomy of USAF/corporate as well as professional/volunteer.  We are expected to be as professional as the professionals while we are volunteering.  Might seem like an odd concept but when I meet my local volunteer firefighters, they have the same attitude: we may not be paid but we're trained and professional.

If these guys in the AVR and the like are wanting to feel important by wearing Army uniforms and paying to be "generals" and thanked for their "service," that's pathetic.   

[vmstan]

I think it's sad that these people have to join these 'organizations'. Also like others, my mind immediately jumped to USRC. And while some others said that these groups only help make us look better towards the Air Force, what about the people, who whenever they see people running around in BDUs with blue name tapes that say 'Civil Air Patrol' they just think we're a bunch of wannabe's.

I just got back from doing parade "security" with another senior member and about 12 cadets. I walked the entire route of the parade multiple times with the other SMWOG. He was in BDUs and I was in the blue polo because I didn't get the name tapes for mine until last night (finally) and wasn't able to get it put on in time and I refuse to wear an incomplete uniform.

Anyway, point is, in the 4 hours I spent walking around with him he received many "thank you for your service" comments and even salutes from various people including a lot of small kids. However, they'd look at me and could care less who I was... even though he and I have almost identical levels of experience within CAP. (I will say he was prior duty Air Force, so he deserved it on other levels.)

I think most people don't really have an understanding for what the various branches are, what "active duty vs reserve vs national guard vs auxiliary vs wannabes" or what all the ranks even really mean.

[mbrown]

The issue of people looking for "thanks" still puzzles me. Personally, I feel a little awkward in some of the profuse thanks I have received in the past for my military service. I've been around a while, but I've never done anything dangerous or heroic that would merit the label of "hero" that I've been given at times. I've served, but it's not the same. Some people have funny ideas about what heroes actually are.

I too find it awkward when people 'thank' me for my 'civil air patrol service' and even more awkward when you try to explain to them that we are not military but an auxiliary, and they still don't get it. And I would also agree that some people have funny ideas about what heroes actually are

[Spike]

This same type of mistaken identity takes place also with CAP personnel dressed in military type BDU's.   Again this is why I advocate us (especially seniors) going to the Blue BDU's and also Blue Flight Suits.  I would hope that at least CAP personnel would state who they really are and what we do and not take credit for thanks for something they are not

I think it is better for CAP to be "distinctive" and known/identified as Civil Air Patrol rather than be mistaken for being military personnel.

Radio......we have heard this here on CAPTALK before.  You are in the minority, and well frankly, many of us are tired of hearing this same thing over and over again. 

I guess you missed the bright blue and white branchtapes on the BDU's that say "Civil Air Patrol"??  How about the polo shirt?  The Air Force wears a Polo Shirt now.....do you want us to get out of that.  The Blue Flight Suits and Blue BDU's CAN and HAVE been mistaken for military before.  In fact......the military used to wear similar items.  I think one area in the AF wore a blue flight suit up until last year if I am not mistaken.

Stop with this put-down of CAP and it's members for choosing to wear the uniforms that the Government says we can wear legally.

[Strick]

This same type of mistaken identity takes place also with CAP personnel dressed in military type BDU's.   Again this is why I advocate us (especially seniors) going to the Blue BDU's and also Blue Flight Suits.  I would hope that at least CAP personnel would state who they really are and what we do and not take credit for thanks for something they are not

I think it is better for CAP to be "distinctive" and known/identified as Civil Air Patrol rather than be mistaken for being military personnel.

Radio......we have heard this here on CAPTALK before.  You are in the minority, and well frankly, many of us are tired of hearing this same thing over and over again. 

I guess you missed the bright blue and white branchtapes on the BDU's that say "Civil Air Patrol"??  How about the polo shirt?  The Air Force wears a Polo Shirt now.....do you want us to get out of that.  The Blue Flight Suits and Blue BDU's CAN and HAVE been mistaken for military before.  In fact......the military used to wear similar items.  I think one area in the AF wore a blue flight suit up until last year if I am not mistaken.

Stop with this put-down of CAP and it's members for choosing to wear the uniforms that the Government says we can wear legally.

+1

[flyboy53]

And here's another big also!

Those blue utility uniforms and flight suits are worn by special duty aircrews and people like transient maintenance so that argument is is so wet it's drowning!

[Майор Хаткевич]

But then on the other hand...the main use of the BDU cloth for us is SAR (outside of CP). Not that blue is perfect, but sure as hell better than Woodlawn when trying to get noticed by aircrew in the middle of the woods.

[raivo]

[The uniform] is also not to be worn on any military installation or in DOD buildings unless installation commander or manager has approved such visit.

Gee, can't imagine why.

[Hawk200]

Not that blue is perfect, but sure as hell better than Woodlawn when trying to get noticed by aircrew in the middle of the woods.

What's better is orange. Like that vest you're supposed to be wearing when you're in the woods on CAP business.

[Майор Хаткевич]

Not that blue is perfect, but sure as hell better than Woodlawn when trying to get noticed by aircrew in the middle of the woods.

What's better is orange. Like that vest you're supposed to be wearing when you're in the woods on CAP business.

Put on some gear, which tends to be US Surplus, and the vest becomes obscure. This is where I'm actually ok with the Orange hats that people wear in some wings.

[Hawk200]

Put on some gear, which tends to be US Surplus, and the vest becomes obscure. This is where I'm actually ok with the Orange hats that people wear in some wings.

Ways around that.

Even if we did go to blue BDU's, I doubt it would eliminate a hi vis vest. So an argument that blue is more suitable isn't really a good one.

To top it off, the only way to really deal with a vest being covered is to require gear that maintains the same high visibility. I doubt anyone is going to be the least bit inclined to replace all their gear with hi vis stuff.

"Blue is better" fails from that aspect.

I am thinking an orange hat is a good idea. Not difficult to do. Many outdoors stores carry a plain one that is easily appropriated, and would be very practical.

[flyboy53]

Put on some gear, which tends to be US Surplus, and the vest becomes obscure. This is where I'm actually ok with the Orange hats that people wear in some wings.

Ways around that.

Even if we did go to blue BDU's, I doubt it would eliminate a hi vis vest. So an argument that blue is more suitable isn't really a good one.

To top it off, the only way to really deal with a vest being covered is to require gear that maintains the same high visibility. I doubt anyone is going to be the least bit inclined to replace all their gear with hi vis stuff.

"Blue is better" fails from that aspect.

I am thinking an orange hat is a good idea. Not difficult to do. Many outdoors stores carry a plain one that is easily appropriated, and would be very practical.

AGREE! From the perspective of an aircrew member, I can tell you that's a four gold star recommendation. Otherwise, forget trying to look for a ground crew in a wooded area. The NESA hats should be in orange and someone ought to tell the big uniform monoply in the sky.

[wuzafuzz]

Aaaarrrrgggh!  I hate when CAPTalk times out while I'm authoring my masterpiece.   

RE: this USDRC group.  Strange.  Anytime fancy titles, uniforms, and gear eclipse your mission you are firmly in the Twilight Zone and deserve all the negative attention Hamsexy.com can throw your way.   

As to whether those guys and gals should join an existing service group, I say "it depends."  If you want to provide a reasonable service like CERT or basic GSAR and existing groups could care less, then go for it.  Or if an existing group is fatally infested with weirdos and freaks, then start a new one.  Just focus on your mission instead of bling and gear.  Make sure form follows function.  Ensure your group is reasonably trained, organized, and affiliated with or sponsored by the folks who would call on your services.

[Seabee219]

  I think that what I would do is wear my uniform the best I know how, and say proudly that I am a Civil Air Patrol member.   We as a group have to get our name out to the public and let them know who we are, what we do (I am sure we are already). 

  These other groups will fade away in time and no one will remember them.