What award would be applicable?

[DKirkendall58]

Sitiuation: A cadet is hiking with a friend, and friends father who is a navy corpsman. At the end of the trail is a waterfall with jumps at various heights up to 40 feet. Another hiker jumps from the 40 foot jump and is severely injured. (Spinal injury). The cadet helps to retrieve the injured person from the water, and calls 911. After calling 911 the cadet continues to provide aid for the injured hiker by helping to position her on a flat rock. The rock is only half protruding from the water so the cadet is forced to support the injured hiker from waist deep ice cold water. The cadet uses medical skills learned in CAP to help treat for shock and immobilize the injured hiker. The cadet stays with the hiker rendering aid for 45 mins. Once first responders arrive on scene the cadet assists them in moving the hiker onto a spine board and then  assists the responders in carrying  her to a clearing where she is placed In a stokes basket and air lifted out.

My question, would this cadet be eligible, or meet the criteria for any kind of lifesaving, or commendation award?

[MSG Mac]

The Certificate for Lifesaving would seem to be the appropriate Award. But despite the prestige, the Commanders Commendation is the higher award and is also appropriate.

[Al Sayre]

If properly written up, appears to qualify for Bronze Medal of Valor:
CAPR 39-3 Sect B.9.b:
"b. Bronze Medal of Valor. Distinguished and conspicuous heroic action where danger to
self is probable and known. (NOTE: In cases where a member is credited with saving a human life,
but where the act does not meet the criteria for the Silver or Bronze Medal of Valor, the member
should be recommended for a Certificate of Recognition in accordance with paragraph 9h.)"

I'd say standing in waist deep ice cold water for 45 min at great risk of hypothermia would qualify...

[Flying Pig]

So what was the Navy Corpsman and the other friend doing during this whole incident?   

The cadet used medical skills learned in CAP...or did the cadet act at the direction of the Corpsman?   Your post reads like the cadet took charge of the incident. Did he/she?   

People were purposely jumping into the water to swim on purpose right?  So the argument that the water was a near death experience may me a little tough.  This cadet had to stay in the water solo for 45min?  People didnt think to switch out to minimize the exposure?   And after 45 min in freezing cold water, this cadet was STILL able to assist EMS personnel and help carry the victim to the LZ?  That tells me clearly that the water temp was not a factor in this incident.   Was the cadet treated for hypothermia by the EMS crew as well?   Again.... you just nullified the water temp concern.  Was the injured swimmer treated for any hypothermia after being wet and laid out on a rock for 45 min?  Was ANYONE treated for it?  "risk of hypothermia" isnt the same as standing in a burning building.  You either suffer from hypothermia or you don't. 

The cadet treated for shock?  How?  I thought they were all wet and freezing on a rock?  Again.... this cadet entered the water solo while everyone else stood on the shore in awe? 

From what you wrote, Im not seeing a Lifesaving.  Maybe even an Achievement Medal?  Your version of events mentions other people on scene, one who is a medical professional.... then apparently the cadet acted alone during the entire event.

Your post leaves out a lot of detail and also uses details that voids the concerns you mentioned.  Not that there arent valid explanations, but if any type of pre-award investigation is done (which I hope there is) these would be glaring questions that would need addressed.

[DoubleSecret]

Sitiuation: A cadet is hiking with a friend, and friends father who is a navy corpsman. At the end of the trail is a waterfall with jumps at various heights up to 40 feet. Another hiker jumps from the 40 foot jump and is severely injured. (Spinal injury). The cadet helps to retrieve the injured person from the water, and calls 911. After calling 911 the cadet continues to provide aid for the injured hiker by helping to position her on a flat rock. The rock is only half protruding from the water so the cadet is forced to support the injured hiker from waist deep ice cold water. The cadet uses medical skills learned in CAP to help treat for shock and immobilize the injured hiker. The cadet stays with the hiker rendering aid for 45 mins. Once first responders arrive on scene the cadet assists them in moving the hiker onto a spine board and then  assists the responders in carrying  her to a clearing where she is placed In a stokes basket and air lifted out.

My question, would this cadet be eligible, or meet the criteria for any kind of lifesaving, or commendation award?

What does CAPR 39-3 and the cadet's chain of command say is the appropriate award?  Who would initiate the recommendation?  If the act wasn't personally witnessed by the recommender, what would they use to document the recommendation?  Who witnessed the cadet's actions?  What EXACTLY did the cadet do?  How much were other parties involved before the first responders arrived?

[lordmonar]

DKirkendall58,

To answer your question Yes....those actions as described would warrant some sort of recognition.

Ad DoubleSecret said.....it is up to 39-3 and your chain of command to make the call....anything from a BSV (that's a stretch) to a Commander's comm, to a Lifesaving, to an Achievement Award....all the way down to a "That'll do pig".

Don't let anyone here stop you from doing what you think is right.    Write it up and send it up the chain and see what happens.

[Eclipse]

If the facts support that the cadet saved someone's life, write it up as Lifesaving, otherwise, nothing.

CAP Decs should be for CAP service.  This wasn't even a CAP activity.

[lordmonar]

If the facts support that the cadet saved someone's life, write it up as Lifesaving, otherwise, nothing.

CAP Decs should be for CAP service.  This wasn't even a CAP activity.

That is not supported by regulations nor by past performance.

[Eclipse]

It's supported by common sense, integrity, and whomever is approving the dec.

Mistakes made in the past are irrelevant.

[lordmonar]

It's supported by common sense, integrity, and whomever is approving the dec.

Mistakes made in the past are irrelevant.

Mistakes according the Eclipse are not mistakes. 

[Phil Hirons, Jr.]

39-3 does not list during a CAP activity / mission as a requirement for the Silver / Bronze MOV or the Lifesaving Cert. CAP duty is mentioned in the rest of the decorations definitions. IMHO this means the Silver / Bronze MOV or the Lifesaving Cert can be awarded for non-CAP activities.

Could this situation warrant a BMOV? As someone else suggested more review would be required. I would think common sense would allow a commander to review the MOV paperwork and decide does not make the bar, and approve a Lifesaving Cert instead.

[Eclipse]

It's supported by common sense, integrity, and whomever is approving the dec.

Mistakes made in the past are irrelevant.

Mistakes according the Eclipse are not mistakes. 

To believe this is a mistake.

Phil has the right track - if it rises to a valor medal, so be it, otherwise the other decs are for CAP service and activities.

[DKirkendall58]

Here is some further information: initially the corpsman (cadets friends father) helped to retrieve the hiker from the water.  the Cadet, the Corpsman, and a friend of the injured hiker moved her to the rock. The reason she was still partially in the water was because that was the flattest rock around, and also closest to the location of the injury occurring. (The bottom of a waterfall). After the hiker was positioned om the rock the cadet called 911, but then handed the phone over to the corpsman who left the scene to find a possible clearing for a helicopter. Leaving the Cadet in charge of the scene. Upon the corpsmans return he stayed close to the injured hiker, however left the cadet and the hikers friend to support the hiker. The reason there was no rotation of people was that the hiker was in a precarious position and any movement would of caused great pain, and possible damage to the hikers spine. The cadet asked the his friend (corpsmans son) to remove towels and jackets from his bag to put around the upper body of the injured hiker to help keep her warm. The cadet stayed supporting the injured hikers body with his own body (so she did not slip into the water) and continued to comfort the injured hiker until first responders arrived.

So to be clear: there were 3 people directly involved in the rescue and stabilization of the injured hiker. The Cadet, the Corpsman, and the injured hikers friend. 

[DKirkendall58]

Also note: the water was being used for recreational purposes at own risk. The water was very cold, and there is a possibility of contracting leptospirosis from this water. It is intended to only have minimal contact with the water, but the cadet and injured hikers friend exposed themselves to the water for around 45 minutes.

[James Shaw]

Outside of the Regs they mention you would have to be prepared to have;

Very Detailed information.

1) Written and signed witness statements
2) Copy of Police or EMS report if that is available.
3) Any photos that are available (if possible or they exist)
4) Someone to fill out and submit the 120 to the COC.

One thing to remember on this whole process is interpretation of the incident. What some members may view as a BMV others may view as a Lifesave and so forth. It is really going to be difficult to get in their heads as something like this could go before many different people. They are going to have varying opinions. They only review these 1 or 2 times a year. It may be submitted and not heard about again for an entire year.

[DKirkendall58]

I believe there is video and photo evidence that is available.

[Flying Pig]

There ya go... that explanation was a little better.

[ZigZag911]

I think Lifesaving is likely, BMV certainly ought to be considered...if I were submitting, would request BMV, as facts seem to warrant it...let higher level awards review board make the final call.

BTW, in my experience it seems  most CAP awards for valor or lifesaving are given for events outside CAP activities.

[GroundHawg]

I can tell you from experience that in a military setting, we write up awards to a higher one than expected to receive. I have only seen one award upgraded, an AAM to a ARCOM, but many downgraded. Write it up for the BMOV if you feel thats what is most appropriate, and if the documentation warrants it, they will receive it, if not it may get approved for a Lifesaving or Comm Comm.

A side note, do not tell them if their award package was downgraded, just congratulate them and tell them you appreciate their service.

[Eclipse]

A side note, do not tell them if their award package was downgraded, just congratulate them and tell them you appreciate their service.

You mean you shouldn't just hand them the original 120 with the higher dec crossed out instead of redoing it?

Seen those, talk about lazy and self-defeating.

[GroundHawg]

A side note, do not tell them if their award package was downgraded, just congratulate them and tell them you appreciate their service.

You mean you shouldn't just hand them the original 120 with the higher dec crossed out instead of redoing it?

Seen those, talk about lazy and self-defeating.

Exactly. Seriously, take 5 min and do it right.

[Flying Pig]

Just on an admin note.....

If you submit for, lets say a Lifesaving and it gets approved for a Commanders Commendation, wont it have all of the signatures on it when you get it back?  How would you redo it without losing all the approval signatures?

[Alaric]

Just on an admin note.....

If you submit for, lets say a Lifesaving and it gets approved for a Commanders Commendation, wont it have all of the signatures on it when you get it back?  How would you redo it without losing all the approval signatures?

Depends on the level of review.  For instance I have submitted awards to Wing, then got the call that the act did not merit (for instance a Commander's Commendation) I would resubmit for an Acheivement Award, which would be signed and used for the members file.  The original F120 would be returned to the requester (me) with the reason it did not merit the Commander's Commendation and I would keep it in my Admin files.  The member never knew.

[Flying Pig]

Ahhhh gotcha.  I was never in a position where a award got reduced.  However I did have one where the Group CC arrived for our Sq awards banquet and had upgraded an Achievement Medal that had been submitted to a Commanders Commendation.  When I submitted the 120 to Group... he took the info and sent it up as a Commanders Comm after reading it.   Proof that you should go with the highest award and let them reduce it.

[Eclipse]

+1 On Alaric's post and to yours, few people mind when something is considered more commendable then originally submitted.

Part of the issue is the circular nature of CAP staff and echelons - to the rank and file with no service outside a small unit,
Wing and Region may seem like strangers no one ever knows or meets, but once you venture outside the unit, you
find they are just "other guys you know who happen to have a say about 'x' more then you do...today...".

In a lot of cases, the reasons for denying a decoration are as arbitrary as the non-existent "standard" by which they are judged,
and the person denying the request may also be someone's personal friend, direct supervisor, or even their subordinate in another role
(a region or wing staffer or even cc could well be a subordinate during ES ops or large cadet activities, and even lower in grade then the
person the request is for).  The last thing you need is "Quinton doesn't think I'm worthy of an ESA, so maybe he's not worthy of staff job next flight academy".

Further to that, when you understand the totality of the situation, how subjective these decs are, even moreo then in the military, and
when you know the full story behind others who have received them, when you're talking about otherwise competent commanders and staff
who are just trying to give another high-achiever an "atta boy" or "thank you", it's more then a little insulting when an otherwise properly
written 120 is sent back by someone who coincidentally is wearing the same dec with an attachment that just coincidentally aligns with the
number of years they have been doing a staff job. The same goes when dec are presented at a scope that is inappropriate but expeditious,
whether that means a lower dec as a consolation prize because the higher one was turned down, or a higher one simply because the person with the
pen is at a higher level.

Anything that gets lowered should be re-written.

[Al Sayre]

As someone who sits on the wing awards and promotions committees, here is what you need to do to get an award through the first time:

1.  Fill out the top of CAPF 120, CAPF 2 or CAPF 2A correctly, with the complete information including CAPID and duty position.
2.  In the remarks section, specify the correct regulation and section and describe how the person met the requirements for the award. 
for example: "... IAW CAPR 39-3 Sect B.9.f, Capt Smuckatelli performed in an outstanding manner in his duties as Chief Donut Procurement officer for the recent Wing Professional Development Weekend, greatly contributing to its overall success by keeping the attendees well fed and alert during the 18 hours of mind numbing power point presentations. ...  for his exemplary and outstanding performance in a position of great importance to the XX Wing, Capt Smuckatelli is hereby nominated for the Commanders Commendation award." 

[Private Investigator]

As someone who sits on the wing awards and promotions committees, here is what you need to do to get an award through the first time:

1.  Fill out the top of CAPF 120, CAPF 2 or CAPF 2A correctly, with the complete information including CAPID and duty position.
2.  In the remarks section, specify the correct regulation and section and describe how the person met the requirements for the award. 
for example: "... IAW CAPR 39-3 Sect B.9.f, Capt Smuckatelli performed in an outstanding manner in his duties as Chief Donut Procurement officer for the recent Wing Professional Development Weekend, greatly contributing to its overall success by keeping the attendees well fed and alert during the 18 hours of mind numbing power point presentations. ...  for his exemplary and outstanding performance in a position of great importance to the XX Wing, Capt Smuckatelli is hereby nominated for the Commanders Commendation award."

That is a great example for a ComCom but I have seen something similar for a Distinguished Service. They aim high hoping for a Exceptional or Meritorious Service Award instead of the ComCom. 

[Al Sayre]

No matter what the award or promotion, the key is to fill out the form completely and correctly, and in the remarks section state what the standard is and how it was met.  Anything less will probably be rejected.  Anything not clearly pertinent to how the standard was met is un-necessary and a waste of your time writing it and my time reading it, and could cause the award to be rejected.

[Alaric]

+1 On Alaric's post and to yours, few people mind when something is considered more commendable then originally submitted.

Part of the issue is the circular nature of CAP staff and echelons - to the rank and file with no service outside a small unit,
Wing and Region may seem like strangers no one ever knows or meets, but once you venture outside the unit, you
find they are just "other guys you know who happen to have a say about 'x' more then you do...today...".

In a lot of cases, the reasons for denying a decoration are as arbitrary as the non-existent "standard" by which they are judged,
and the person denying the request may also be someone's personal friend, direct supervisor, or even their subordinate in another role
(a region or wing staffer or even cc could well be a subordinate during ES ops or large cadet activities, and even lower in grade then the
person the request is for).  The last thing you need is "Quinton doesn't think I'm worthy of an ESA, so maybe he's not worthy of staff job next flight academy".

Since there is an awards committee, Quinton (unless the group/wing/region/national commander) doesn't get to decide, at best they are a member of a committee that recommends