24 Month Facebook Recruiting report

Started by OldGuy, July 16, 2019, 12:07:36 AM

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Gunsotsu

There's only squadron one that fits the claims made in the whole of WAWG. Those numbers don't support the notion that what's being done on Facebook is improving membership beyond the mean average for the rest of WAWG. Guessing from the data therein, the squadron in question has implemented the cohort method and those numbers show improvement, but the senior membership is well within the average CAP as a whole.

Exciting short term gains do not equate to success.

Holding Pattern

Quote from: Gunsotsu on July 18, 2019, 01:06:41 AM
There's only squadron one that fits the claims made in the whole of WAWG. Those numbers don't support the notion that what's being done on Facebook is improving membership beyond the mean average for the rest of WAWG. Guessing from the data therein, the squadron in question has implemented the cohort method and those numbers show improvement, but the senior membership is well within the average CAP as a whole.

Exciting short term gains do not equate to success.

Not even close.

OldGuy

Quote from: Gunsotsu on July 18, 2019, 01:06:41 AM
Exciting short term gains do not equate to success.
I am not in WAWG for what it is worth. And real gains sustained over multiple reporting quarters and with accelerating growth actually do equate to success.

Gunsotsu

Your history would indicate otherwise. Regardless, those of us skeptical and curious still would rather see the data than the conjecture.

THRAWN

Quote from: OldGuy on July 18, 2019, 12:44:17 AM
Quote from: Gunsotsu on July 17, 2019, 08:03:21 PM
That doesn't answer the question. How many cadets?
I answered, I don't know. Most of the responses this year have been seniors.

Quote from: Gunsotsu on July 17, 2019, 08:03:21 PM
Were you serious about this, you could always screencap your unit growth graph (available in eServices) for the last 60 months. You know, show proof.
Or not. You want proof? Why? My words are suspect? Are you calling me a liar? Again, how about that respect thing? You know, the core values?

You made a claim, back it with actual data, not "estimates".
Strup-"Belligerent....at times...."
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OldGuy

Quote from: Gunsotsu on July 18, 2019, 05:13:01 AM
Your history would indicate otherwise. Regardless, those of us skeptical and curious still would rather see the data than the conjecture.
Again, your lack of respect says something.

OldGuy

Quote from: THRAWN on July 18, 2019, 07:12:42 AM
You made a claim, back it with actual data, not "estimates".
Why? I made a factual statement. I do not have access to the hard data, nor do I care if you want that. My statements are factual based on experience. YMMV.

THRAWN

Quote from: OldGuy on July 18, 2019, 01:30:17 PM
Quote from: THRAWN on July 18, 2019, 07:12:42 AM
You made a claim, back it with actual data, not "estimates".
Why? I made a factual statement. I do not have access to the hard data, nor do I care if you want that. My statements are factual based on experience. YMMV.

Your numbers, as misleading and inaccurate as they are, do not support your claim of this activity being a success. Your reluctance to provide actual data supports the suspicion that while there may be some value to this activity, it is not as valuable as you claim it is. Not having access to hard data calls into question the validity of the numbers that you claim are factual. If you don't want people questioning your claims, don't make them.
Strup-"Belligerent....at times...."
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USAF ACSC 2011
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OldGuy

Quote from: THRAWN on July 18, 2019, 01:35:37 PM
Your numbers, as misleading and inaccurate as they are,....
Misleading? In what way? Innacurate? How so?
Quote from: THRAWN on July 18, 2019, 01:35:37 PM
...do not support your claim of this activity being a success.
Common respect could cause you to take my statements at face value.
Quote from: THRAWN on July 18, 2019, 01:35:37 PM
Your reluctance to provide actual data ...
You misspelled inability.  I do not have access to all the numbers.
Quote from: THRAWN on July 18, 2019, 01:35:37 PM
...supports the suspicion that while there may be some value to this activity, it is not as valuable as you claim it is.
Suspicion? Why? And to what end?
Quote from: THRAWN on July 18, 2019, 01:35:37 PM
If you don't want people questioning your claims, don't make them.
Is that really how you view other people in CAP? Your lack of basic respect is just incredible.

For the last two years, at a minimal investment in time, my old unit used Facebook to recruit at least a half dozen seniors and at least three cadets at NO COST and a minimal investment in time. You are free to try this or not. But to essentially call me a liar is not acceptable. More you and the others casting aspersions on my integrity detract from the reason CAPTALK exists which is to help others with good ideas. Why? Tell us why you think your ungentlemanly behavior is justified?


THRAWN

Quote from: OldGuy on July 18, 2019, 03:05:41 PM
Quote from: THRAWN on July 18, 2019, 01:35:37 PM
Your numbers, as misleading and inaccurate as they are,....
Misleading? In what way? Innacurate? How so?
Quote from: THRAWN on July 18, 2019, 01:35:37 PM
...do not support your claim of this activity being a success.
Common respect could cause you to take my statements at face value.
Quote from: THRAWN on July 18, 2019, 01:35:37 PM
Your reluctance to provide actual data ...
You misspelled inability.  I do not have access to all the numbers.
Quote from: THRAWN on July 18, 2019, 01:35:37 PM
...supports the suspicion that while there may be some value to this activity, it is not as valuable as you claim it is.
Suspicion? Why? And to what end?
Quote from: THRAWN on July 18, 2019, 01:35:37 PM
If you don't want people questioning your claims, don't make them.
Is that really how you view other people in CAP? Your lack of basic respect is just incredible.

For the last two years, at a minimal investment in time, my old unit used Facebook to recruit at least a half dozen seniors and at least three cadets at NO COST and a minimal investment in time. You are free to try this or not. But to essentially call me a liar is not acceptable. More you and the others casting aspersions on my integrity detract from the reason CAPTALK exists which is to help others with good ideas. Why? Tell us why you think your ungentlemanly behavior is justified?

You made a statement, but refuse to back it with verifiable data. Basic respect works both ways. You want to show that this plan works, provide the data, or don't bother bringing it up. Anybody can make claims about a program that they are using, but without the numbers, your claims are no better than fiction. That's not disrespect, it's diligence. You keep dodging the numbers issue. You started this whole caper with a series of "estimated" numbers. If you don't have the actual figures, don't even attempt to make the point. 77% of all discussions that start this way are not based in fact.
Strup-"Belligerent....at times...."
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OldGuy

#30
Quote from: THRAWN on July 18, 2019, 03:17:35 PM
You made a statement, but refuse to back it with verifiable data. Basic respect works both ways. You want to show that this plan works, provide the data, or don't bother bringing it up. Anybody can make claims about a program that they are using, but without the numbers, your claims are no better than fiction. That's not disrespect, it's diligence. You keep dodging the numbers issue. You started this whole caper with a series of "estimated" numbers. If you don't have the actual figures, don't even attempt to make the point. 77% of all discussions that start this way are not based in fact.
I provided numbers. That you do not accept them is on you. Again, respect.  If you want precision, sorry. As for your bizarro claim "77% of all discussions that start this way are not based in fact" it is an naked excuse to disrespect others. Shame on you.

TheSkyHornet

// Commentary //

I find this conversation to be overwhelmingly ridiculous...even for this forum's standards...

OldGuy

Quote from: TheSkyHornet on July 18, 2019, 03:32:52 PM
// Commentary //

I find this conversation to be overwhelmingly ridiculous...even for this forum's standards...
Yep.

Eclipse

The original thread: http://captalk.net/index.php?topic=22402.msg406405#msg406405

The ads linked:
https://www.facebook.com/pg/SpokaneCAP/jobs/1955649024720256/

https://www.facebook.com/pg/SpokaneCAP/jobs/1491477284268062/

https://www.facebook.com/pg/SpokaneCAP/jobs/263820430802708/



I stand by my assertion both then and now that these are misleading at best, and
that the "results" are no better, or worse, then a unit doing random word of mouth
recruiting, except that you have wasted at least 27 people's time.

Also, someone disagreeing with you does not automatically equal disrespect.
That idea is born of the safe-space generation who only want likes and cry foul
when math becomes involved.

"That Others May Zoom"

OldGuy

Quote from: Eclipse on July 18, 2019, 03:43:14 PM
The original thread: http://captalk.net/index.php?topic=22402.msg406405#msg406405

The ads linked:
https://www.facebook.com/pg/SpokaneCAP/jobs/1955649024720256/

https://www.facebook.com/pg/SpokaneCAP/jobs/1491477284268062/

https://www.facebook.com/pg/SpokaneCAP/jobs/263820430802708/



I stand by my assertion both then and now that these are misleading at best, and
that the "results" are no better, or worse, then a unit doing random word of mouth
recruiting, except that you have wasted at least 27 people's time.

Also, someone disagreeing with you does not automatically equal disrespect.
That idea is born of the safe-space generation who only want likes and cry foul
when math becomes involved.
1 - They are not misleading. Not ONE applicant has been at all confused.
2 - Disagreement is not disrespect. Calling people a liar is.
3 - Your little "dig" at the "safe space" is an example of disrespect.
4 - Don't use social media (and you do not), stay away. This is not for you.

Ned

This is why we can't have nice things.

Please consider taking this part of the exchange to PM.

etodd

As someone who has been in the advertising and marketing business of various types since 1970 .... I can attest to how different markets can be.  And how something that works in one small town market, doesn't necessarily mean it could be taken nationwide. And vice versa. Often, grass roots efforts for one Squadron, simply will not work for another.

So one person finds something they think works for them.  Great! Everyone should be happy for them.  If you want to try it and see if the idea works in YOUR location, go for it. If you think it would not, then why criticize and demean another CAP member. Be happy for them, and move along.

Find what works for your Squadron..  Every Squadron, town , city, metro area, is so very different.

Celebrate our diversity in methodologies.  Be happy.  :)
"Don't try to explain it, just bow your head
Breathe in, breathe out, move on ..."

THRAWN

Quote from: etodd on July 18, 2019, 04:11:13 PM
As someone who has been in the advertising and marketing business of various types since 1970 .... I can attest to how different markets can be.  And how something that works in one small town market, doesn't necessarily mean it could be taken nationwide. And vice versa. Often, grass roots efforts for one Squadron, simply will not work for another.

So one person finds something they think works for them.  Great! Everyone should be happy for them.  If you want to try it and see if the idea works in YOUR location, go for it. If you think it would not, then why criticize and demean another CAP member. Be happy for them, and move along.

Find what works for your Squadron..  Every Squadron, town , city, metro area, is so very different.

Celebrate our diversity in methodologies.  Be happy.  :)

Diversity is all well and good, but when it is supported by vague numbers and muddy math, it calls into question the validity of the claim. "Estimates" and "about the same" figures with no specifics available raise doubts.
Strup-"Belligerent....at times...."
AFRCC SMC 10-97
NSS ISC 05-00
USAF SOS 2000
USAF ACSC 2011
US NWC 2016
USMC CSCDEP 2023

OldGuy

Quote from: Ned on July 18, 2019, 03:55:35 PM
This is why we can't have nice things.

Please consider taking this part of the exchange to PM.
Yep.

etodd

Quote from: THRAWN on July 18, 2019, 04:18:53 PM
Quote from: etodd on July 18, 2019, 04:11:13 PM
As someone who has been in the advertising and marketing business of various types since 1970 .... I can attest to how different markets can be.  And how something that works in one small town market, doesn't necessarily mean it could be taken nationwide. And vice versa. Often, grass roots efforts for one Squadron, simply will not work for another.

So one person finds something they think works for them.  Great! Everyone should be happy for them.  If you want to try it and see if the idea works in YOUR location, go for it. If you think it would not, then why criticize and demean another CAP member. Be happy for them, and move along.

Find what works for your Squadron..  Every Squadron, town , city, metro area, is so very different.

Celebrate our diversity in methodologies.  Be happy.  :)

Diversity is all well and good, but when it is supported by vague numbers and muddy math, it calls into question the validity of the claim. "Estimates" and "about the same" figures with no specifics available raise doubts.

If you have doubts ... don't try it. Simple as that.  Move on.  Its just bad form to tear someone apart for no other reason that just to do it.  And its becoming more and more the status quo here.  Sad people online, that cannot stand it when someone happy comes along.  Geez.

(OK .... 3 ... 2....1)
"Don't try to explain it, just bow your head
Breathe in, breathe out, move on ..."