Narrow Band Transition Experience

[wuzafuzz]

Now that the transition to narrow band is in progress, how is it affecting you? 

How does radio traffic sound?
Did your effective range change?
How many radios went silent (non-compliant)?
Any other related issues?

My local repeater hasn't changed quite yet, but it is linked to another repeater that did change.  So far I've noticed a reduction in net check ins, more traffic with extremely low audio levels, an annoyingly long repeater tail, and a pretty quick time out (which is happening frequently thanks to the long tail).

Hopefully these issues will be resolved quickly.  Few transitions of this magnitude is seamless.

[cap235629]

Our side of the state has made the switch.  I actually have better coverage on the portables (I hit a repeater that is 60 miles away as the crow flies but is on the highest mountain between the rockies and the Mississippi).  Haven't had a chance to use the encrypted side yet to see if there is any loss of coverage due to distance

[arajca]

The long tail is being addressed with National. The low audio levels are a known issue when mixing wide and narrowband systems - there is nothing that can be done about it.

[wuzafuzz]

The long tail is being addressed with National. The low audio levels are a known issue when mixing wide and narrowband systems - there is nothing that can be done about it.

Thanks for sharing some good news.  Is it safe to say the audio levels will improve when we are all talking on the same bandwidth?  Some of those folks were low audio prior to the transition, but I suspect they had individual radio issues.

[arajca]

As far as I know, audio levels should equal out when everyone is on the bandwidth. With the obvious exception of those with soft voices and radio problems.

[desertengineer1]

Our state put together a really comprehensive plan and were rejected within minutes.  Still trying to find out what happened, but it looks like we're relegated outside the circle for a long time.

We'll continue to use broadband until NHQ and NTC can work out the drama.

What are they going to do, ignore us?  (been doing that from the start - LOL!)

[arajca]

We'll continue to use broadband until NHQ and NTC can work out the drama.

No. You'll use it until 30 Sept 2009 when wideband gets shut down for CAP.

[desertengineer1]

We'll continue to use broadband until NHQ and NTC can work out the drama.

No. You'll use it until 30 Sept 2009 when wideband gets shut down for CAP.

LOL.  What are they going to do, ignore us?  hehe

[arajca]

CAP does not have the authorization to use the wideband frequnecies after 30 Sept.

[desertengineer1]

Maybe someone will answer our inquiries after 30 Sept, then. 

We honestly don't know what we said or did to be ejected from the "circle".  We put together a very detailed plan, with detailed costings, schedules, and even fancy schedule charts with milestones.  We even broke it into phases according to swap replacement and several levels of new coverage expansion.  We submitted it on time, with the signed agreeement from the wing CC, as requested.

The committee pretty much trashed the plan immediately.  Sadly, most of thier questions were answered directly in the original report.  This meant they either didn't take the time to read it and threw it in the "too expensive" pile (I thought the costing was actually really low), or someone had a beef with us to begin with.  I really hope it isn't the latter.

Understand one thing here - there were several individuals that were heroic in thier attempts to help us, but in the end, we were pretty much left out to dry. 

Even after repeated inquiries to the status, nobody at the upper echelons took the time to actively reply to our responses to thier concerns.  So I basically gave up. 

When they are done playing and are ready to engage, we will be.  Otherwise, I won't waste more time spinning wheels.

Yeah, I'm still a little unhappy...

[desertengineer1]

To answer the originator's question, I'm not too happy about it.  Technically, we stated we were ready immediately.

Obviously, that was the wrong thing to say 

[Slim]

As I understand the situation here, we're most likely going to go completely silent on 30 Sept.  Our frequencies are still trying to be coordinated with Canada, and can't be used within 75 miles of the international border until that's done.  Which means pretty much the entire eastern half of the lower peninsula and most of the upper won't have any comm capability unless this is resolved by then.

Last estimate was somewhere just beyond "We have no idea....."

[N Harmon]

So, if this isn't straightened out before 1 Oct, does that mean we start putting HAM radio operators on our ground teams/aircraft to pass mission traffic for us?

[Slim]

So, if this isn't straightened out before 1 Oct, does that mean we start putting HAM radio operators on our ground teams/aircraft to pass mission traffic for us?

Far as I know, using amateur frequencies and operators for CAP business is still a non-starter.

Hope you got unlimited minutes on your cell package, I guess.

[desertengineer1]

Sad.  We have a published plan.  We have towers ready for installation.  We have people ready to swap them.  We even have a channel plan for all the radios.  We're just in a penalty box - reason unknown.

This is much more painful than it has to be.

[N Harmon]

Far as I know, using amateur frequencies and operators for CAP business is still a non-starter.

Hope you got unlimited minutes on your cell package, I guess.

Woops, you are correct. I was getting a little ahead of myself. It's the CAPR 100-1 Draft proposal that provides for amateur radio assistance. It is also yet unapproved. So unless it gets approved before then, communications is going become really interesting.

[Slim]

Far as I know, using amateur frequencies and operators for CAP business is still a non-starter.

Hope you got unlimited minutes on your cell package, I guess.

Woops, you are correct. I was getting a little ahead of myself. It's the CAPR 100-1 Draft proposal that provides for amateur radio assistance. It is also yet unapproved. So unless it gets approved before then, communications is going become really interesting.

Actually, I just got some word of a resolution.  In the affected area of Michigan, the repeaters on the east side of the lower, and the one going to the UP are going to be set on the alternate pair.  Apparently those frequencies aren't an issue.

Waiting for word on whether we're keeping a common access tone or not.

[scooter]

After having some experience with the new frequencies, etc. the system seems to work OK. The new airborne repeaters are a really asset. However, I was wondering what the standard is going to be to tell an aircrew to change frequency. So far I have experienced a call to switch to A1 rather than channel 1. (these are not the real numbers for opsec). Not sure if all CAP FM radios are going to be channelized the same or not. It makes a difference for the observer trying to lookup the new channel to switch to. The channel line up sheet needs to be in Alpa order if we are going to use the letter codes for channels or channel numbers if we use them. Is there any formal guidance from the guys in charge as to how we are to refer to channels?

[SarDragon]

At a minimum, ALL corporate radios are currently supposed to have the first four channels programmed the same. As I've been told, this policy will continue with the new frequency plan. The channels all have designators associated with them.

[arajca]

The channel plan was developed by National and is required to be used in all CAP radio. There are several channels set aside for wing specific programming and these are the same numbers for ALL wings. i.e. channels 1-64 are identical for ALL cap radios, channels 65 - 96 have wing programming (what's programmed in may differ, but ONLY these channels are different), and channels 97-256 are identical for all CAP radios.

Note: the details listed above are not from the actual plan, just used to provide an example.