Use Of Private Plane

[NeoSys]

Hi,

I apologize if this has been asked before but in a forum search I could not find info to answer my doubt.

I am looking at starting a squadron in our home town the closest squadron is hours away. I was in CAP as a child and have wonderful memories now that my daughter is about to become 12 I though this would be an amazing thing we could do together.

Again I am still in the research mode and I deduct that I will have to start a non profit that would become chartered.

I know many squadrons do not have a plane assigned by CAP National to them as such my question is does the CAP allow the local squadron a 172 if it was donated by me?

And if they can have it branded in CAP scheme and logo.

Thanks in Advance for any info.

[Eclipse]

Not likely.

[FW]

You can donate an aircraft to CAP, however once it becomes corporate property you lose control of the asset. My advice is to keep it and use it as you wish. Member owned aircraft can be used if no corporate aircraft are available.
Your 172 can be painted in a CAP scheme, however permission is needed to add the decals.

[lordmonar]

60-1 allows for Member Owned aircraft to be used.....with approval by wing and/or regional approval.

So....write up what you going to use it for and how....and send it up the chain.

As for donating aircraft to CAP.......it can be done.....hasn't for a long time....but it can be done.
The kicker on this is.....once it is donated to CAP then it becomes a CAP asset and can be moved around at the discretion of the corporation.  Now there are way to make sure this aircraft stays with the local unit.....that would have to be coordinated with NHQ (as it would have to be anyways as all donations over a certain amount must go through NHQ anyways).

So....long and short of it.....yes you can donate and aircraft to CAP and it could be painted up in CAP colors.  Yes there is away to make sure that aircraft stays with the unit...but no guarantees.

Again the alternative could be just to get permission to use this aircraft as a member owned.

Thanks for your interest in CAP and thanks for thinking about donating this sort of money and time to CAP.

[a2capt]

Based on the thread title, I suspect the question was more along the lines of donating the -use- of the 172.

As for a donation, I get the impression that NHQ may take it and turn it into a for bid item, because they're shaving down the amount of aircraft owned, at least that's what you hear every other report coming out of NHQ saying. "We're going to reduce that from 550 to 500.." and then there's squeals, and then they don't do it or buy some back. Wash, rinse, repeat.

But one thing is for sure, it's not the same as you remember it.

[NeoSys]

Thank you all for the quick response to my doubt.

My intent was to donate the complete aircraft in the intent that the squadron would have an aircraft to fly. But since donating it to national they could do do with it what they want no doubt given the opportunity for the squadron to own an operate there own aircraft it would just make since to have it owned by the operating charter.

My daughter has the dream of becoming an airline pilot as such I will be spending tons of money on fight training for her might as well spend that money and teach her much more important things along with flying, I believe CAP does this.

As for things changed.

Yes indeed I have been reading and it seems it is not the CAP I grew up with. I hope that by creating our own squadron and been blessed to have the resources I can provide her with a quality squadron and try to replicate as much as I can from my childhood.

Again thank you so much for the information.

[JeffDG]

Just to address one other assumption you made...you do not form a non-profit, then receive a charter.

CAP operates under a single 501(c)(3) determination from the IRS.  There's no need for you to go to the effort of chartering a new organization and then being adopted into the CAP umbrella.

You put together your squadron or flight, meet the minimum membership requirements under the regulations (someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but I think you can utilize pledges to join a newly formed unit for this), and ask the Wing for a charter (which they obtain from NHQ).  You become part of CAP's organization, not a separate entity.

[NeoSys]

Interesting!

But in order to receive donations from private entities than they would have to be made to the national organization how would we know we would get the money?

How would dues paid locally to the squadron be processed for taxes?

If I provide the plane to the squadron I would not be able to get a tax deduction unless it is a non profit.

Please if anybody who has started a squadron could chime in would be great.

[JeffDG]

Interesting!

But in order to receive donations from private entities than they would have to be made to the national organization how would we know we would get the money?

How would dues paid locally to the squadron be processed for taxes?

If I provide the plane to the squadron I would not be able to get a tax deduction unless it is a non profit.

Please if anybody who has started a squadron could chime in would be great.

Funds go into a wing-level bank account, but all the funds are accounted for to the unit level...called Wing Banker.  The accounting procedures are quite strict, and funds donated to your unit are under the control of your unit.

Same for local squadron dues, paid to the wing account, processed via national 501(c)(3).

[SunDog]

Using a private plane can be tricky;  I have used a non-CAP plane for a CAP check ride several times, just to avoid real long drives, etc.  It didn't show on CAP radar until after-the-fact; the examiner and I flew together, accomplished all the things required for a Form 5.  Having completed the flight safely, he did the necesaries to update my CAP currency. CAP didn't have a mechanism for recognizing the check ride was done in a non-CAP airplane. No issues, no problems with CAP.

Since it was out of my pocket, CAP wasn't in the loop. BUT, if we'd broke the airplane (or worse) CAP wouldn't have been on the hook for anythinig - it was just two guys flying, CAP affiliation not relevant.

I've also done MP training on my own dime, in a non-CAP airplane. Two guys in blue jeans, sweat shirts, and a C-172. No mission number, no flight release, no CAP cognizance. And no insurance, etc.

Probaly fine for adults who understand the situation - bigger problem if you represent it as a CAP affiliated activity, especially for cadets. 

[lordmonar]

Interesting!

But in order to receive donations from private entities than they would have to be made to the national organization how would we know we would get the money?

How would dues paid locally to the squadron be processed for taxes?

If I provide the plane to the squadron I would not be able to get a tax deduction unless it is a non profit.

Please if anybody who has started a squadron could chime in would be great.

As the donator.....it is possible to put contingencies on your donation.   "We will give you money but it must be used for XYZ".   

So what you are trying to do is two things.

1.  Form a new unit at your locality....which is pretty straight forward.....contact your local wing to get that ball rolling.
2.  Donate an aircraft to CAP for the exclusive use of this new unit.  This one is problematical but not un-do-able.   It may not happend.  NHQ may not want to accept a donation with to many contingencies on it or it may be counter to policy....I don't know if they are any.  Again the place to check up on that would be to contact NHQ.

Bottom line is that.....CAP Inc.  Owns everything in CAP.....even your local squadron dues and any donations made to your local unit.   Don't get too bent out of shape over this.....despite a lot of moaning and goaning about wing banker.....as far as I know....no one has ever gotten their "local" funds taken from them.

The financial regulation already states that donations over a certain amount (I want to say $10K but don't quote me) must go through wing and/or national.  Even with this requirement there are units out there that have gotten large sum donations from private individuals.

Good luck.

[Eclipse]

Your aircraft, presumably,  does not have CAP radio equipment or DF gear, among other required equipment which I'd
added after market, which would make it, non mission capable.

Few wings could justify O-ride only aircraft, donated or not.

Start the squadron, worry about the plane later.  If you intend to be the CC you'll be too busy to fly much anyway.

[Cliff_Chambliss]

As an idea, keep your plane and award a "flight scholarship".

Years ago the Birmingham Alabama Aero Club (A Civic and Scial Club not a flying club) would award a number flight scholarships each year.  Open to all interested high school students, the rewuirement was to write a paper on an aviation theme determined by the Aero Club.  Papers would be graded on content, spelling, grammar, etc.  Awardees would then be provided a "summer school" Private Pilot Ground Class, and depending on the funds available a number would receive flight training up to and including Solo, and the lucky one or two could even get a Private Pilot Certificate.  One year I donated my time as instructor and was able to take two outstanding young men (who just happened to be CAP Cadets) all the way through to Private Pilot. 

This was not a CAP Activity and CAP was not involved in any way other than the young men being CAP Cadets.

this may be a way for you to consider.

[SunDog]

You might look at AngelFlight.com, too.  Several CAP pilots in my wing are kinda shifting their volunteer focus that way.  Real missions, for people in real need. You might be able to have your daughter participate with you in some capacity.

IRT CAP, if driving to one of the closer sqdns is viable, maybe you could attend a few meetings, and take your daughter along? Get a feel for how things have changed, pro & con?  Get a measure for where CAP is now, before spinning up a real big effort.

[Eclipse]

The other non-trivial issue is that if you aren't actually a member now, you're not likely to be opening a new unit, daughter or no.

Joking aside about the requirements to be a Squadron CC, "former cadet" isn't going to be enough knowledge and experience-wise
to be allowed to start a charter.

[AirAux]

Actually I think $90.00 and 14 members will start a Charter..  they can't be too picky if they let Pineda be a national Commander..

[Eclipse]

^ + Wing CC approval, not something the average FNG off the street is going to get.