Spring 2010 NEC Agenda & Winter 2009 NEC Minutes

[Pylon]

Here's the agenda for the 30 April/1 May NEC Meeting, as well as the draft minutes from the November 2009 NEC.

[Pylon]

With the exception of one agenda item about WMIRS, and one suggesting that unit commanders' personnel files be kept by the next higher echelon (not their own unit), the rest of the entire NEC's time is devoted to awards, ribbons, and ID cards... oh, and if we should go to Puerto Rico for our next NB conference. 

Maybe one step better than spending the entire NEC meeting talking about uniforms, but ribbon devices, ID cards, and awards still aren't exactly the long-range strategic planning expected of a massive non-profit's executive board.  In fact, there really is no long-range strategic initiatives in there at all.  And I'd personally argue that most of the awards stuff is similar to uniform stuff, in that, no other organization would spend this much time at the most senior executive level of their board discussing this.  It's a staff-level or executive director (in our case, maybe National Commander)-level responsibility at most.

[RiverAux]

Seems like a major waste of time and money based on the topics to be discussed.

Regarding the creation of an "Awards Officer",  it seems to me that the duties of our existing Personnel officers are very light and that there isn't any excuse for them not taking care of this.  What personnel officer is so overwhelmed they need an assistant to handle this? 

I do agree that CAP generally isn't very good about using our award system, but I'm not sure this is the way to fix it.  Not sure I have any better ideas though.

[Mustang]

Most NEC meetings are a major waste of time/money, when you consider the airfare, meals and lodging for the NEC plus all the attendant NHQ staff on-scene.

[RRLE]

Most NEC meetings are a major waste of time/money, when you consider the airfare, meals and lodging for the NEC plus all the attendant NHQ staff on-scene. ]

You are assuming that the purpose of the meeting is what is published in the agenda and hence the idea the meeting is a waste of time. There are those who believe the Real Purpose of these kinds of meetings is the 'meet and greet' and back-scratching to higher office that goes on before, during and after the meeting. And you cannot do the latter (at least not well) via video conference.

[bosshawk]

+1 on the post having to do with waste of time, money and energy.

In addition, why should we be paying for the members of the NEC to campaign for higher office at our expense?

[NCRblues]

Most NEC meetings are a major waste of time/money, when you consider the airfare, meals and lodging for the NEC plus all the attendant NHQ staff on-scene. ]

You are assuming that the purpose of the meeting is what is published in the agenda and hence the idea the meeting is a waste of time. There are those who believe the Real Purpose of these kinds of meetings is the 'meet and greet' and back-scratching to higher office that goes on before, during and after the meeting. And you cannot do the latter (at least not well) via video conference.

OH NOES...what would happen if the big wigs could not scratch each others back?

[FW]

Gentlemen, the published agenda is but a small slice of what goes on in an NEC meeting.  A large portion of business will be to approve the finance committee's recommendations and to discuss "new business" which the CS will bring up.  Remember, this is how the "CSU" was killed off.
Oh, yes,  we should not be surprised when this one is over.  I think we are going to find some real doozies in this one....

[wingnut55]

After over a 1/2 a century of being an auxiliary of the USAF we still have an ID card that looks like the membership card to the Ronald Reagan Library.

I have to pay $4.00 to get an ID card that will not get me Jacked up by the Cops when I am DFing an ELT.

All so sad and just pathetic, nothing changes we have found the perfect mass of do nothing attitude. well except making more uniform changes.

[PHall]

And nothing goes on here that couldn't be handled by a net meeting.
At a much lower cost to the membership and the taxpayers.

[JC004]

Do my membership dues pay for this?

"This card will help CAP be a more professional organization."
oh?

[bosshawk]

Oh, yes, your membership dues pay for this, plus mine and plus several hundred others.

It seems to me that the suggestion of a net meeting was put forth on this blog before the last meeting: looks like the "grin and grip" crowd won out over those who are concerned about how their membership money is spent.

[JC004]

Then I want either:

1.  A refund
2.  Them to talk about things that matter

[bosshawk]

Good luck on either or both.

[a2capt]

..and if you think thats a waste of money, try having that next meeting in Puerto Rico.

The types of hotels these people routinely book are even more obscenely priced on the island. Though I suppose they don't have to pay a portion of that 38% tax on top of it.

It would be cheaper to buy the airfare for those from Puerto Rico and bring them to the continent.

[JC004]

Sounds to me like maybe the NB just want an expenses-paid trip to PR.  NER or MER.  The expense is far too high...Are they STILL not getting this economic/unemployment problem?  Maybe, as with the uniforms, they are looking for additional ways to cost the members money?

[NCRblues]

So i had no clue what everyone was talking about so i went back and read the agenda...

ARE YOU KIDDING ME?

They want to host it in PR?

I will say this now...lowest turn out ever for such a meeting..... hope they can get the live link feed to work during that time, because their is going to be a lot more people watching from the desk's at home. 

[flyboy53]

Awards and decorations are a commander's responsibility and the tasking officer should be the personnel officer. Also, I thought that units already had awards and decorations and promotions committees.

It's sad to see that we need another level of bureauracy at the squadron level.

Did you people notice page 10. Is there now an Air Patrol Ribbon, or is it the new HLS Ribbon?

I wish they would devote their energy on things that really benefited the membership. How about the issue of reducing the dues of those members who chose not to receive the magazine? How about polling the membership about where to spend the kick-back from Vanguard? How about creating and funding real medals to go with all those fancy ribbons they keep dreaming up?

[FW]

How about paying attention to the 2nd largest paying customer base CAP, Inc. has: it's volunteer members.....

[heliodoc]

Wasn't another thread addressing the staffing cuts at NHQ and its timeliness of the annual budget?

Then another poster states the staffing cuts NHQ has "endured" the last few years...

It seems to me, for a "VOLUNTEER" organization on a "shoestring budget"....the least NHQ could worry about is a NB in Puerto Rico

As a2capt states a 38% sales tax.....where is the thinkin' of theses VOLUNTEER "officers" and the proper stewardship of "the corporation"

Its seems the ought to be worried less on where and what next fancy place they are going to hold a NB and start holding in the fancy issued USAF sponsored location called Maxwell.

'Bout time for some good old stay at home practices and the even more serious issue of stewardship of resources that CAP touts so well about core values and integrity

A vacation to a resort style hotel(s) for NB can hardly be an excuse for all the "hard work" that is being on the CAP members dime and then not being able to get a annual report on time.....

Can CAPTalkers really defend those practices in a a"professional volunteer organization?"  There ought to be some reigns pulled in on "those" people down there and across the country that put on a USAF style uniform and chirp about the RM and others while attending these "somewhat" lavish NB meetings that are put on.

I know, there are CAPTalkers that will defend this practice as....."Other 501(c)3 organizations do this, WHY can't WE"

Stewardship of resources, folks, for all those CAPers that want to address "core values", "integrity" and all those other buzzwords that seem to crop up while defending the actions of the few....

[JC004]

How about paying attention to the 2nd largest paying customer base CAP, Inc. has: it's volunteer members.....

:clap:

[lordmonar]

Did you people notice page 10. Is there now an Air Patrol Ribbon, or is it the new HLS Ribbon?

Yes...the chose the name Air Patrol Ribbon because it will cover all other operations not DR/SAR or CD not just HLS missions.

I wish they would devote their energy on things that really benefited the membership. How about the issue of reducing the dues of those members who chose not to receive the magazine? How about polling the membership about where to spend the kick-back from Vanguard? How about creating and funding real medals to go with all those fancy ribbons they keep dreaming up?

Has anyon communicated these desires up the chain?

[RiverAux]

Live stream underway.

National commanders report:
Cadet membership has been growing.
Accident rates dropping
5 AEO schools planned this year.  Except for HI, they're all in the east for some reason.
1600 AEMs and growing.  100K students impacted through program
ACE program in 23 states, 6500 students, 62 schools
250 teacher orientation flights in 09 in 19 wings
K-12 AEX program, 657 classrooms, 40K students involved

[Capt Rivera]

Thanks for the reminder River... I would have missed it otherwise...

[Capt Rivera]

Anyone know how to get this in full screen?

or a better link then this one i could use to have full screen?
http://www.capvolunteernow.com/live/index.cfm

[RiverAux]

control +

[Pingree1492]

Live stream underway.

National commanders report:
Cadet membership has been growing.
Accident rates dropping
5 AEO schools planned this year.  Except for HI, they're all in the east for some reason.
1600 AEMs and growing.  100K students impacted through program
ACE program in 23 states, 6500 students, 62 schools
250 teacher orientation flights in 09 in 19 wings
K-12 AEX program, 657 classrooms, 40K students involved

Any updates on the agenda items and debate after the obligatory commander's update? 

[A.Member]

A "ribbons" officer?  Are they serious?

Maybe one step better than spending the entire NEC meeting talking about uniforms, but ribbon devices, ID cards, and awards still aren't exactly the long-range strategic planning expected of a massive non-profit's executive board.  In fact, there really is no long-range strategic initiatives in there at all.  And I'd personally argue that most of the awards stuff is similar to uniform stuff, in that, no other organization would spend this much time at the most senior executive level of their board discussing this.  It's a staff-level or executive director (in our case, maybe National Commander)-level responsibility at most.

You and I are very much on the same page with this.   It's probably our greatest issue.  Yet, it remains rather puzzling to me that it continues to go on unaddressed.   We need some clear strategic planning from our "leadership". 

[Tubacap]

I didn't catch it all, but there is some sort of personnel management system called AMS.  Anyone have information on the capabilities/potential uses of this system?  Timeline?

[RiverAux]

They're going to use it to manage just about all individual CAP member information.  I think they said it would be totally in use pretty soon.  Evidently the same system that the Girl Scouts use. 

[Tubacap]

Any changes to the end user?

[RiverAux]

They didn't say other than all our info would be in one place.  Sounded like the separate ops qual system would be combined in with the regular personnel records. 
I would guess that the CAPWATCH download system would change.  This would be a good thing cause working with the text files is a pain compared to the old system of just downloading an Access database. 

[Capt Rivera]

Anyone taking notes?

[RiverAux]

If any of the topics were of any interest I probably would, but the agenda is so weak that its not worth my time, much less worth the time of the NEC.

[Capt Rivera]

Missed most of it but it looks like they are taking steps to finally stop hemorrhaging money on replacement ID cards...

- No more free replacements effective immediately ( i believe)
--- Replacements will cost you $3.00

- No more new ID for each promotion, each member gets 1 ID card per year as part of their membership.

- other stuff to reduce wasted money was also done/will be done... 

I know its still not the grand things we want and you wouldn't think it would take the NEC to make the above changes... but at least we will stop some waste...

[a2capt]

Ironic. they're concerned about ID card waste, but they have no issues wasting members money.  Thats just lovely.

I hope the ID card that looks like a cracker jack hack improves over all this. Probably not.. but one can hope.

..and while they are at it, they can do without these swank meetings.

[Capt Rivera]

Ironic. they're concerned about ID card waste, but they have no issues wasting members money.  Thats just lovely.

..and while they are at it, they can do without these swank meetings.

ID card waste was a waste of membership dues... Check out the numbers in the previously posted file... 80,000 extra cards produced in a year? We have roughly 57,000 members...  If I remember the wording wrong then there 23k extra cards produced... That's just ridiculous... and each card costs over $1 to produce... that's a lot of waste.

I can tell you without a doubt that at least one cadet in my squadron has gone through 3 or more cards due to losing the card or damaging it in the clothes dryer... People don't learn when they just click a button to get something for "free". I bet people will take better care now that it will cost them...

We are also standardizing on the photo id card i believe... with senior members being required to have pictures on file at some point in the future...

With that said... I don't know how much member money was spent to have the meeting. Since they had it... and will likely continue, I would prefer to focus on whats being done then just idle complaints being repeated... (swank meetings have been beaten pretty good) - Feel free to encourage your Wing Commander to bring up a motion for video conference use and greater use of military facilities...

[RiverAux]

Although I don't imagine they cost as much, they can also do away with that little plastic card they send out with various CAP telephone numbers on it.

[BillB]

The main problem seems to be doing a new card when a member transfers or gets promoted. In 1966 the front of the ID card did not have unit charter number or the members grade. The back of the card was blank and a sticker was sent each time a promotion or transfer occured. Sticker cost 2 cents, a new plastic ID card costs CAP $2.11. Even sending out a new plastic ID card with just the members name and serial number and a sticker on the back costs $165 (according to one card manufacturer) Postage for a plasic card may or may not be 42 cents, but a sticker to show changes would cost the minimum. And it's cheaper to send out the sticker annually to show renewal than to produce an expensive plastic card.

[JC004]

Ironic. they're concerned about ID card waste, but they have no issues wasting members money.  Thats just lovely.

I hope the ID card that looks like a cracker jack hack improves over all this. Probably not.. but one can hope.

..and while they are at it, they can do without these swank meetings.

Pretty much...
"Alright, now that the ID card waste is dealt with, let's move on to having the National Board meeting in Puerto Rico, then make a couple uniform changes..."   

Although I don't imagine they cost as much, they can also do away with that little plastic card they send out with various CAP telephone numbers on it.

I think that I could get behind that, actually.

[keystone102]

Our own Ned Lee was announced as the newest BOG member. Congrats and good luck.

[RADIOMAN015]

- other stuff to reduce wasted money was also done/will be done... 

I know its still not the grand things we want and you wouldn't think it would take the NEC to make the above changes... but at least we will stop some waste...

Gee I've yet to see a NB or NEC meeting discuss in any new proposal how much MORE time & money the volunteer is going to have to (waste) spend complying with the new proposals (pictures ID's).  There should be a requirement for this analysis on every policy/regulation.

Frankly just go back to the paper ID card and put a statement on the senior card that the holder must have a federal or state issued picture ID/driver's license in order for this card to be valid.   Look how much money that would save.
RM

[James Shaw]

Does anyone have a list of the approved and non approved items they can post?

[JC004]

Gee I've yet to see a NB or NEC meeting discuss in any new proposal how much MORE time & money the volunteer is going to have to (waste) spend complying with the new proposals (pictures ID's).  There should be a requirement for this analysis on every policy/regulation.
...

I keep saying that.

[ColonelJack]

Our own Ned Lee was announced as the newest BOG member. Congrats and good luck.

That's outstanding, Colonel!  Congratulations!  (I'd applied ... but in the face of the competition, I knew I never stood a chance.)

Jack

[BillB]

Since Ned is now on the BoG, I'll gladly take over as Senior Advisor to Cadet Programs.

Congrats Ned

[Tim Medeiros]

Since Ned is now on the BoG, I'll gladly take over as Senior Advisor to Cadet Programs.

You need to be a member first, though it might help if the MARB didn't decline to hear your appeal of membership termination.  (Ref Report of Recent Membership Action Review Board Cases)


Congrats Col Lee, glad to see you moving on up.

[Spike]

^ Yikes, that was not necessary.