Model Rocketry

[DC]

If a squadron were to hold a model rocketry bivouac for the cadets, starting Friday evening and spanning to Sunday afternoon, I think that there would only be time to build the rockets from the Redstone Stage and part of the Titan Phase of the program.

My Question is, though there would only be limited rocket building time, could cadets take all of the written tests and get them out of the way.

So esentially by the end of the weekend they would have all of the testing done for the program, but only half of the rockets, is this legal, or is it like with Achievement testing where you cannot test for the next achievement until you have satified all requirments for the current one?

[Capt M. Sherrod]

I held a rocketry bivouac that started on a Saturday morning.  We went through the Redstone academic, Redstone "Launch", Titan Academic, and Titan Build on Saturday. Sunday AM we launched Titan.  We came back to the building completed the Saturn academic and Saturn build.  We were about to launch Saturn on Sunday afternoon but had to scrub due to weather.  It is entirely possible if you have the launch site and academic site close to one another.

On a separate note, when you are building, painting, etc.  Make sure to be well ventilated.  We had six of us building rockets and we decided after the weekend was over that we should have had more air in the building due to some headaches that people had when they got home on Sunday night.

[jimmydeanno]

We had six of us building rockets and we decided after the weekend was over that we should have had more air in the building due to some headaches that people had when they got home on Sunday night.

It is a violation of Federal law to use this product in a manner inconsistent with its labeling...

use in a well ventilated area...

I am sooo reporting you to the DDR police...

[DC]

I held a rocketry bivouac that started on a Saturday morning.  We went through the Redstone academic, Redstone "Launch", Titan Academic, and Titan Build on Saturday. Sunday AM we launched Titan.  We came back to the building completed the Saturn academic and Saturn build.  We were about to launch Saturn on Sunday afternoon but had to scrub due to weather.  It is entirely possible if you have the launch site and academic site close to one another.

On a separate note, when you are building, painting, etc.  Make sure to be well ventilated.  We had six of us building rockets and we decided after the weekend was over that we should have had more air in the building due to some headaches that people had when they got home on Sunday night.

Our bivouac site provides no 'buildings'. Construction of rockets would occur outside, under a tent or a large pavilion. Ventilation can't get any better than that!

I appriciate your answer, but it still does not answer my question. I will look into revising my schedule though.

[Capt M. Sherrod]

Yes, it can all be done in one weekend.

No, you can not progress to the next section of the program until the previous one is complete. (i.e. you can't build rockets for a stage until you have successfully passed the academic)  You can't stack academic without having done the launch.

What I was prepared to do though was if a cadet didn't pass an academic session, they were still allowed to build and launch with the rest of the class, it just didn't count towards the rocketry program.

I didn't have to execute that strategy, but it was what I was prepared to do.

[ThorntonOL]

where are the tests for the rocketry program? Have a copy or two of the book from nationals but no idea where the tests are.

[MIKE]

Under lock and key?

[IceNine]

you have to order them from nationals just as you do the other cadet tests.

CAPF 8 IIRC

[DC]

Under lock and key?

Where they should be. Test Security and all that...

Your Testing Officer might have copies...

[ThorntonOL]

Ok, I was wondering as I'm taking the lead so to speak, and will be running the program in my unit.
Won't be for a little while. Just making sure i have all my wits about me and all the supplies and so forth.
Thanks, I now know where they should be if we have them and who to get them requested from.

[IceNine]

It does take a while to get the tests from HQ so I would start checking with your TCO and make sure s/he has quite a few copies.

[Sleepwalker]

   We held a "Rocketry Weekend" this Spring, lasting from Saturday Morning through Sunday afternoon.  We did all the rocket building during the day on Saturday, stepping outside to launch the simple rockets right away.  They even built their more advanced rockets together (I strongly suggest getting all the same rockets - buy in bulk - so that you can go step by step together with them).  This building took all day, and believe me you don't have any time to fool around.  Lunch were sandwiches (that we had made) with chips and drinks.           
    Classroom units were handled at night.  When I finished a classroom section, they took the test there and then and corrected them right away; clearing up any questions immediately before moving on to the next classrrom section.  This took about 4 hours, and again, you don't have time to fool around.  Dinner was delivered pizza. We finished around midnight.
    The Cadets slept in the building in sleeping bags (with two SM staying as well) and woke up around 8 AM to a doughnut breakfast.  The Cadets finished painting their Rockets and cleaned up the building.  Launching was nearby at a High School field, which went into the afternoon (also, buy all rocket motors required in bulk as well so they are ready to go). 
    This was a VERY full weekend, and I think it went well.  I had 10 Cadets (all got certified) and I don't think I would have wanted any more than that unless I had a lot more help.  I had two Cadets who already earned their Rocketry Badge help as Instructors, and they were very useful.
   I don't know if I would try to do this in one weekend again, or split it up into two, as it was VERY hectic to get all the requirements in.
         

[DC]

It does take a while to get the tests from HQ so I would start checking with your TCO and make sure s/he has quite a few copies.

I just got my TCO to order them, he said it would take a week or so...

[DC]

   We held a "Rocketry Weekend" this Spring, lasting from Saturday Morning through Sunday afternoon.  We did all the rocket building during the day on Saturday, stepping outside to launch the simple rockets right away.  They even built their more advanced rockets together (I strongly suggest getting all the same rockets - buy in bulk - so that you can go step by step together with them).  This building took all day, and believe me you don't have any time to fool around.  Lunch were sandwiches (that we had made) with chips and drinks.           
    Classroom units were handled at night.  When I finished a classroom section, they took the test there and then and corrected them right away; clearing up any questions immediately before moving on to the next classrrom section.  This took about 4 hours, and again, you don't have time to fool around.  Dinner was delivered pizza. We finished around midnight.
    The Cadets slept in the building in sleeping bags (with two SM staying as well) and woke up around 8 AM to a doughnut breakfast.  The Cadets finished painting their Rockets and cleaned up the building.  Launching was nearby at a High School field, which went into the afternoon (also, buy all rocket motors required in bulk as well so they are ready to go). 
    This was a VERY full weekend, and I think it went well.  I had 10 Cadets (all got certified) and I don't think I would have wanted any more than that unless I had a lot more help.  I had two Cadets who already earned their Rocketry Badge help as Instructors, and they were very useful.
   I don't know if I would try to do this in one weekend again, or split it up into two, as it was VERY hectic to get all the requirements in.
         

My General Plan:

Arrive at bivouac site Friday night, set up tents, have fun, etc. Start at 0700 on Saturday, do the classes and test immediately, then move onto rockets. I'm thinking the Alka-seltzer and rubber band powered rockets for Phase 1, an Alpha and a Patriot for Phase 2, and a Nova Payloader (I'm sooooo happy Estes decided to start making those things again, great rockets) for Phase 3. The requirement for the phase three payload rocket is to launch three ounces to a certain altitude, I figured we could just use washers or something for the payload.

No one in my squadron has earned the badge, but several of the senior cadets and at least one SM are pretty experienced with model rocketry, so we should be pretty set on instructors. I'm thinking of splitting the cadets up into small groups, like three or four cadet to an instructor, so the cadets get more one on one help if they need it...

[Sleepwalker]

  DC:
     That sounds like a great plan.  You just need to make sure that everyone understands that they need to keep the program moving along or you will run out of time.  After having done this twice, I have learned that time is the one resource in short supply.
    It is a good idea to be sure that you have all the supplies you need (glue, scissors, X-acto knives, masking tape, etc) and plenty to go around.  It is a good idea to have this set up so that the Cadets can just show up and not worry about bringing anything other than overnight stuff.  When we had our Weekend, I just figured out what everything (Rockets, engines, building supplies, food, etc) was going to cost and charged a flat fee for the entire weekend.  It was still only $40 or so.
    The most difficult thing (surprisingly) all weekend was trying to keep a couple Cadets from moving a step ahead of where the rest of us were.  I had two Cadets who had a bad habit of trying to go on to the next step without ensuring they had completed the step they were on (they hadn't - and it took alot of time to go back and fix thier mistakes while everyone else had to wait).  It is very important to explain to them that they need to go at the pace of the instructors and to resist the temptation to jump ahead.         

[DC]

Another question, really a clarification. The list of requirements for the Saturn Phase of the program, found on page 55 of the rocketry textbook, says that you need to build one of the choices laid out. The 'Official Witness Log' for that phase, found on page 73 says in the first paragraph that you must build two rockets, both the payloader, and a two stage. Right below that, after the blank for the cadet's name, says that you only need to build one of the options. The same freaking form contradicts itself within three inches of text!

I would believe that you just go with the majority, and assume the paragraph on the OWL is just a humoungous typo, but, just to be sure: you only have to build ONE of the options, right?

[Capt M. Sherrod]

Correct.  Either the payload OR a multi-stage.

[DC]

Cool, thank you.

[helper]

Our squadron has done several Model Rocket Weekends similar to those described. Approximately 30 cadets have earned their badge.

What we do different is to reduce the cost by building the rockets from scrap paper. FedEx mailing envelopes work great for the body tubes and nose cones with the small size boxes for fin material, ES marking tape for streamers and small WalMart bags for parachutes. 8 1/2 x 11 card stock can also be used with custom designs created on a PC then printed. 

The cadets get a real sense of accomplishment by starting from scratch and its affordable even if the rocket is not recovered (lands in a tree). 

[NC Hokie]

What we do different is to reduce the cost by building the rockets from scrap paper. FedEx mailing envelopes work great for the body tubes and nose cones with the small size boxes for fin material, ES marking tape for streamers and small WalMart bags for parachutes. 8 1/2 x 11 card stock can also be used with custom designs created on a PC then printed.

I'd be VERY interested in seeing pictures of these as well as any documentation (instructions, templates, etc.) that you might have.