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In defense of wannabes

Started by RiverAux, December 16, 2007, 09:27:20 PM

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flyguy06

Quote from: mikeylikey on December 17, 2007, 03:47:56 AM
Quote from: flyguy06 on December 17, 2007, 03:39:35 AM
Quote from: mikeylikey on December 17, 2007, 03:31:43 AM
Quote from: flyguy06 on December 17, 2007, 03:25:15 AM
Quote from: Short Field on December 17, 2007, 02:40:47 AM
Quote from: Major Carrales on December 17, 2007, 01:10:51 AM
We are not the USAF, many parallels do not work...we are CAP, and have been since 1942 (1941 for the rest of the Non-CORPUS CHRISTI audience) .

True words.

I joined CAP because it offered a good mission and looked like more fun than other volunteer organizations.  I like what CAP does and like supporting the mission.  If I had wanted a more military or paramilitary organization, I would have looked for one and joined it.    CAP is CAP.

I wanted to join the USAF and be a pilot but couldn't because of my vision

So you became an Officer in the Army.  Well my friend, that is exactly the same story here.  I wanted to be a pilot, but navigator would have been the closest to it, and that was not for me.  Then the Army had me talked into flying for them (just not flying as the pilot in charge).  So I said well lets move on, and I now have a rewarding Field artillery Career.  Besides, whats better than blowing crap up 3 to 7 miles away?  I get to be a technical expert, and say that I attended one of the most difficult (physical and technical) and longest Officer BASIC Courses in the Army.  Now, Officer Advanced is not nearly as long, but close.  Plus, I am a "King of Battle", and Fort Sill is by far one of the best military posts in the continental US.  At least thats what the sign there says "Best military installation-1988"

For me, since I couldnt fly inthe military period, I had went to an Army military college and isaw al the upperclassmen waling around with Airborne wings and being the young impressionable 18 year old I was, I decided to do that. I knew I wanted to be a high ranking officer and I had always heard thatin order to make General youhad to be combat arms. So I went into the Infantry. However now atthe age of 39, i am tired of the Infantry and am thinking of branch transferring to Quartermaster. Plus I have my civilian career to focus on

NOOOO!  The new Officer Branch of Logistics just opened up.  That is where you want to go.  That will produce more LTC's and COL's than the other branches, because they will be the ones running the Army.  They are taking Quartermaster, Transpo and Ordinance.  Basically you will be the Officer everyone wants around and comes to for help. 

However you cant Branch Transfer to it until you make CPT or CPT (P).
.
The Guard is differant. Plus I will be a Captain in a few months. In the Guard you canbranch transfer whenever you want. Just find a unit and go toeither the transiton course or the Captains Career Course. I heard they were going tobe doing something with Logistics I just wasnt sure what. Thanks for the heads up.

Dragoon

Being enthusiastic about CAP is great.

Being enthusiastic about being on the Air Force Team is great.

Where things get bad is when someone wants to use CAP to get others to think they're cool.  Not for what they actually DO in CAP, but for what they hope people will THINK that they do.

Folks who want salutes from other members, but don't actually want the responsibility of being in charge.
Folks who want to raise the quality bar just high enough to exclude everyone below themselves.
Folks who secretly hope someone will mistake them for warriors.


We all have a Walter Mitty factor - it's human nature.  But too much of it causes problems.  It makes CAP too much about "me" and not enough about "us."

That's the "wannabee" that worries me.





Trung Si Ma

Quote from: mikeylikey on December 17, 2007, 03:31:43 AM
[...and Fort Sill is by far one of the best military posts in the continental US.  At least thats what the sign there says "Best military installation-1988"

And 1992, 1993, 1994, 1996.

Don, retired 13F4P plus some really cool - but meaningless - ASI's
Freedom isn't free - I paid for it

Trung Si Ma

Quote from: flyguy06 on December 17, 2007, 03:39:35 AM
...thinking of branch transferring to Quartermaster. Plus I have my civilian career to focus on

Just stay out of the Acquisition Corps - it really limits your post retirement options.
Freedom isn't free - I paid for it

mikeylikey

^ That branch is being merged with Transportation and Ordinance to for the new Logistics branch.  Saying your a logistician will actually get you better job offers than saying "I was infantry". 

I actually thought about jumping ship and branch transferring to Logistics, but I have way too much fun in the Artillery.
What's up monkeys?

flyguy06

Quote from: Trung Si Ma on December 17, 2007, 05:35:25 PM
Quote from: flyguy06 on December 17, 2007, 03:39:35 AM
...thinking of branch transferring to Quartermaster. Plus I have my civilian career to focus on

Just stay out of the Acquisition Corps - it really limits your post retirement options.

I'm in the Guard. I dont have post retirement options. The Guard doesnt drill on Army Posts

Trung Si Ma

Quote from: flyguy06 on December 17, 2007, 09:16:44 PM
Quote from: Trung Si Ma on December 17, 2007, 05:35:25 PM
Quote from: flyguy06 on December 17, 2007, 03:39:35 AM
...thinking of branch transferring to Quartermaster. Plus I have my civilian career to focus on

Just stay out of the Acquisition Corps - it really limits your post retirement options.

I'm in the Guard. I dont have post retirement options. The Guard doesnt drill on Army Posts

Acquisition Corps membership effects who you can work for when you leave the service (post retirement), but I don't know if the NG's even have AQ slots.  I know that the USAR does (and it effects their non-USAR careers), but not sure about the NG.
Freedom isn't free - I paid for it

riffraff

Quote from: ddelaney103 on December 17, 2007, 03:51:36 AM
The second one was adoption of a standard of making officership or grade harder to get.  Again, not a bad idea.  The mark of the wannabe was the desire to exclude other people from officership or grade by recommending stuff he had (like a college degree or AF PME) as the gatekeeper to keep out the riff-raff.
<----------------   Wow! I've only been here a few months and the wannabe's are already trying to get rid of me!

O-Rex

"Wannabe" is a state of mind, and not necessarily a demographic.

I am former military who when he got out in 1990 swore he'd never wear a uniform again: I call it my "Beatles post break-up period:" comparing it to alot of rock band members who grew up in a whirlwind of this "thing" that was bigger than themselves, and when it wound down, wanted desparately to shake off their old persona and reinvent themselves.  Eventually, they did rebuild their lives and careers, put some distance with their former lives, and as memories age like good wine, realize that it wasn't really all that bad.  The result, reunion tours. . . .

CAP is kind of like that for me: I was still young, in my mid-20's and didn't want the military to be the be-all-end-all of my existence: college, family & corporate life beckoned.  Well, as many of you know, even that gets old, and you start looking at the yellowing photos, get that faraway look in your eyes, and say "Yeah...yep..yep...."

You run into an old buddy who's a member, or run across some CAP activity, and well, the rest of the story many of you know. . . . . .

Many former mils spend the first couple of years making the comparisons, or walking around with a veteran's insouciance, talking about how they "did it for real." 

I was no exception, but I like many others experienced that certain  "CAP paradigm shift" and finally realized that this organization is it's own peculiar breed of animal, regardless of the costume.  As my military years become a receding figures in the rearview mirro of like, I find that CAP doesn't necessarily do it wrong, just different.

So when I get some long-ago hero who sees me with a couple of military been-there-done-that ribbons, and they do the nudge-nudge-wink-wink-we-know-how-it's-really-done thing, I reply "Maybe so, but nonetheless here we are."

I'd like to think that I achieved some state of equilibrium, and can keep it all in perspective: the costumes, credentials, blingage and all other "wannabee" trimmings give way to that feeling that somehow the best is yet to be:  It won't substitute for being 18 years old, fresh out of basic training with your whole future ahead of you, but it still puts some spring in my step.

Wannabee? Not a wannabee?

Who cares: I'm having fun and I'd like to think I'm making a difference.

To those who share that sentiment: more power to you.

To others: godspeed in your journey through CAP, and hope our paths cross, and that your journey is as fulfilling as mine  :)

aveighter

Very insightful and very well said.

JohnKachenmeister

I'll plead guilty to being one of the guys who wants to raise our standards a bit.  I think an officer should be capable of performing at least at the level of a Curry cadet with respect to uniform wear, drill, military courtesy, and general military knowledge.  The current web-course-plus-OJT-at-the-unit isn't doing the job any better than the sit-here-and-watch-this-video method.

But I made the transition long ago to the CAP-unique way of doing things.  It took a while to understand how a military organization can work when the first thing we do when a mission presents itself is discard our unit integrity.

But that does not stop me from believing that with some additional training we can put some panache back into CAP, and do our jobs with professionalism and style! 
Another former CAP officer

Stonewall

I'd like to point out that while some wannabes are harmless, I do think there are some that could, if not supervised by someone with common sense, influence some younger cadets the wrong way.  I've met some pretty good phonies out there, some I would call "wannabes" and yes, they were in CAP.  I can't imagine the end result of a couple of these knuckleheads getting together with a small group of cadets for a couple of years.

When I first arrive to DCWG in '92, there was a squadron being run by a brother/sister team.  It was awful and gave me chills to think about what they were doing with their cadets.  For the longest time I thought they were married and almost puked when I learned they were siblings and she was married to some mechanic guy that worked on their CAP van for free.  Later we found out that they used the CAP van for personal use every single day, to include long distance family trips.  In about 2 or 3 years they put 60K miles on it.  They smoked and the windows were clouded with this nasty film (smoke).

Anyway, he was an LPN/school nurse and I have no idea what she did.  She weighed in at a good 300 lbs and he was a scruffy looking d00d with a broomstick mustache and wreaked of cigarettes. 

He'd show up to SAR-EX's wearing a kaybar upside down on his LBE, an AF survival knife strapped to his ankle and of course, his sleeves rolled up regardless of the temperature with black fingerless gloves.  This is a guy in his 40s.  Well, his cadets followed suit and were often seen with black pistol belts, black hats and black gloves with sleeves rolled up.  They called themselves "the cadre".

One day, at summer encampment in '93, he managed to get himself named encampment commander.  Out of the blue, this guy shows up in old army khakis with a 101st patch and ranger tab.  Said he was  LRRP in Vietnam.  Later, of course, the truth came out.  Don't remember if he was even a veteran.

Anyway, we ran him off after learned that he had cadets at his house all the time and some shady stuff going on at his squadron.

I pegged this guy the minute I met him.  And yes, I called him a "wannabe".  Sometimes a wannabe can be detrimental to the program or even worse, to a specific cadet or two.
Serving since 1987.

mikeylikey

Quote from: Stonewall on December 18, 2007, 12:37:11 AM
Out of the blue, this guy shows up in old army khakis with a 101st patch and ranger tab.  Said he was  LRRP in Vietnam.  Later, of course, the truth came out.  Don't remember if he was even a veteran.

Do that today and you find yourself in Prison.  How times have changed.   

What's up monkeys?

Major Lord

As a private investigator, I have a branch office in Los Angeles that does pre-employment screening. I would say that any given week will turn up 10-20 people claiming to have been SEALS, Rangers, DELTA, or other groups too secret to even have a name. Usually, the various associations will know the posers, but we try to collect specific weed-out questions. Rangers for instance, will know their class number, and how the number is arrived at. Seals will know about BUDs and swim buddies. Secret ninjas will know what color the boat house at Hereford is.....CAP special ops people will know where the donuts stores are and have them programmed into their GPS units as POI's. Some things are harder to verify, like the genuine former Spetznatz member (as far as I know, there is no Spetznatz Association in America....) By the way, I wanted to be a Marine, but my parents were married......

Major Lord
"The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the iniquities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he, who in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of darkness, for he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who would attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know my name is the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon thee."

docspur

I'm a Wannabe.  I wanted to be a Soldier.  Because of health I couldn't...although I tried three times.  So, what do I do?  Join CAP?  Nope...didn't even know that CAP was around until 2002.  Nope, what I did was become a Volunteer.  Not able to be a soldier the next best thing is to help the real soldiers out.  That is what I did, and still do....I do volunteer work for the Missouri Nat'l Guard and whatever I can for any other unit, Full-Time, Reserve, or Guard...when needed.  And now that I'm in CAP and have a Squadron to command, you think my "Wannabe" has ended?  Nope, I still help out soldiers as much as I can...and you wouldn't believe the support I now get from them in my CAP career.  I had 15 soldiers show up for my Change of Command ceremony.  I will not try to change my Cadets & Seniors into an Army unit...and I will not try to make myself like an Army commander.  But I do throw in a few HOOAHS now and then.  ;D

Quote from: Major Lord on December 18, 2007, 01:13:27 AM
<snip> By the way, I wanted to be a Marine, but my parents were married......

Wow, you went there...LOL

Capt DL Spurlock, Commander
NCR-MO-127 - Trail of Tears Composite Squadron

Group IV Safety Officer
Missouri Wing

JAFO78

Ok so now I feel I want to make my position clear as a Wannabe.

I want to be back in CAP. I am a former member, and I am returning not to play military, but to make a difference and influence both cadets & adults to do something for their community, state and country. 

I have read what Kirt and the others have posted, I too have seen these people, I do not want to be this kind of person.

JAFO

Stonewall

Quote from: RobG on December 18, 2007, 02:19:48 AMI have read what Kirt and the others have posted, I too have seen these people, I do not want to be this kind of person.

I think we're talking about 2 different types of wannabes.

1.  The good guy.  Like most of us who want to be a part of CAP because of the good that comes from it.  The good feelings we get from working with cadets, helping our community, state and nation.  You can be a goofball and still be one of the "good wannabes".

2.  The guy that shows up to be something he's not.  The one that shows up with his chest sticking out trying to impress people with all the bells and whistles of a "bad guy" wannabe.  The one that is dangerous, a bad influence and projects a bad image of CAP.

It's kind of like a volunteer fire department.  You've got your good guy volunteers that enjoy volunteering as a non-paid firefighter.  Then you've got the squirrels.  The guy that carries a scanner, pager and cell on their belt.  The guy that doesn't own a shirt that doesn't say something about being a firefighter.  The one with 30 stickers on their car making sure everyone knows they're a firefighter.  The one with a 1989 Ford Escort with a dash light who expects people to yield to him while en route to a kitty cat stuck in a tree.

To me, those are the two types of wannabes.  #1 being okay.
Serving since 1987.

AC

Very good thread, sir. Looks like I'm still a wannabe, but definately not a poser!

Terence Maroste      "We're Paratroopers, Lieutenant. We're
Maj, CAP                   supposed to be surrounded."
AEO
SWR-TX-293                  -Captain Richard Winters

flyguy06

Quote from: Trung Si Ma on December 17, 2007, 09:26:04 PM
Quote from: flyguy06 on December 17, 2007, 09:16:44 PM
Quote from: Trung Si Ma on December 17, 2007, 05:35:25 PM
Quote from: flyguy06 on December 17, 2007, 03:39:35 AM
...thinking of branch transferring to Quartermaster. Plus I have my civilian career to focus on

Just stay out of the Acquisition Corps - it really limits your post retirement options.

I'm in the Guard. I dont have post retirement options. The Guard doesnt drill on Army Posts

I have a good civilain career. I am a Flight Instructor withhopes to be an airline pilot. So it has nothing to do with my military life. I try to keep the two seperate

Acquisition Corps membership effects who you can work for when you leave the service (post retirement), but I don't know if the NG's even have AQ slots.  I know that the USAR does (and it effects their non-USAR careers), but not sure about the NG.

davedove

My definition of a wannabe, especially where CAP is concerned is the individual who either couldn't get into the military, or wants to relive his glory days, and tries to mold a unit into his version of what a military unit should be like.  This individual accepts only the input that coincides with his "vision" and anyone else just doesn't understand "how it ought to be."

David W. Dove, Maj, CAP
Deputy Commander for Seniors
Personnel/PD/Asst. Testing Officer
Ground Team Leader
Frederick Composite Squadron
MER-MD-003