In defense of wannabes

[RiverAux]

Often on CAPTalk I see references to "wannabes".  At the basic level most folks would probably define the term to mean people who really wanted to be in the military but never served.  They might not have served for a variety of reasons including things such as medical conditions, or perhaps the urge to serve didn't strike them until they were too old.  Some folks include prior military service people who join in order to recapture their glory days as wannabes. 

Some uncharitable folks would point out that maybe some didn't serve because of pschyological problems or perhaps they wanted to and could have served when young, but decided other things were more important. 

But, in general, wannabes are like everyone who joins CAP in that they want to serve their country in some capacity though they are more interested in the military aspects of the organization. 

Again, at the basic level, this does no harm to the organization.  One could say that our original coastal patrol pilots were wannabes.  They wanted to serve, but CAP was the only outlet given their age or medical condition. 

Also, a significant number of our cadets are wannabes.  They do want to join the military and want to learn what aspects of military life that they can from CAP.  I was certainly in that group as a cadet.  If its wrong for a senior to be a wannabe, then it is wrong for the cadets to be as well. 

Some CAPTalkers focus in on a specific sub-group of wannabes who are "in it for the bling".  Why does it matter to CAP one way or another if some members are only interested in ribbon and rank?  They have to jump through the same exact hoops as those who don't care about either in order to get them.  Does it hurt anyone if they secretely like all the shiny badges and ribbons on their service dress coat?  Do you care if they spend every evening polishing their IC badge? 

The folks who throw "in it for the bling" charges out are also the ones who seem to look down on anyone who wants to wear the military uniform.  That particular aspect of wannabe-ism has been discussed in other threads, so I won't belabor it here. 

The wannabe title is also thrown at those who some think excessively emphasize military customs and courtesy's and perhaps take their rank a little too seriously.  But, I'm not sure that this is actually a "wannabe" issue.  Some people when they get a little bit of authority go nuts and let it go to their head.  You don't have to be interested in the military aspects of CAP for this to happen.  The head of the state American Legion could just as easily act that way as a CAP "Wing King". 

Another thing that gets lumped in with the wannabe charge is non-performance of duties.  In particular the "in it for the bling" people who stop doing the job once they get the bling.  In the example above this would be the guy who really, really wants the IC badge and once he gets it, no longer really wants to do anything.  The thing is that this is something that you really can't prove.  Maybe the new IC has been a hard-charging CAP member for 5 years and just got burned out by the time he got his IC badge.  Maybe that new Lt. Col. has a sick relative he isn't telling anyone about and has to cut back on CAP time and just pay dues for a while. 

When it comes right down to it, we don't know what people's motivations are and it doesn't really matter anyway.  If someone wants to be a CAP mission pilot just so they can wear an AF flightsuit and wings, thats fine by me.  They don't get to wear the suit, unless they're flying and if they're flying they're doing something useful for CAP. 

[JAFO78]

Oh, Oh, (jumping up and down) I'm a wannabe. (jumping up and down).

Seriously, I am a wannabe, I wannabe able to help my country. I am too old to join the military. I did have the chance out of high school, but it did not work out. I know there are other organizations out there I could join, but as a former member of CAP I still feel a connection to CAP.

At this time the nearest squadron to me is over a hour drive, mostly due to traffic around the Orlando area. I have decided to rejoin as a National Patron, if it is still available.

My goal is to start a flight or squadron in Kissimmee, Florida. My youngest son is in Navy Sea Cadets, and they have 130 kids enrolled, at his middle school. I feel that there is a need for a CAP program here.

[mikeylikey]

Wasn't there a song in the early ninetees, "I wannabe a wannabe"?

[Walkman]

I'm in the "wanted to serve but couldn't" category. A combination of medical and family issues prevent me from serving. The last time I tried I was turned down for the Coast Guard Reserves.

One the main reasons I joined CAP was to be affiliated with the armed forces in some way. Until I found CAP, I thought I'd never have the opportunity to do anything like this to serve the country.

I'll admit to being a "wannabe", but I'm working hard to not be someone that's a joke.

Thanks River.

[Major Carrales]

Also, do not confuse "wannabe" and "poser/pretenderism" with peope merely serious about truely building CAP.

There are far to many of us with the opposite attitude...the one that has CAP as an "inferiority complex." 

Fact is, and I will write it again for the likely 20th time...

"Be more proud of what you are than ashamed of what you are not!"

We will not be a professional organization until we accept the fact that we have intrinsic worth and start to act like a professional organization.  We are not the USAF, many parallels do not work...we are CAP, and have been since 1942 (1941 for the rest of the Non-CORPUS CHRISTI audience) .

If we continue to look at this from the position of "we are inferior" and "the USAF is would not do it like this so it must be wrong," then we will never...ever...have any pride in the difference between the USAF and CAP. 

The proper position to take, in mu opinion is, to honor USAF customs and proceudres that apply the most as well as honor those things we must do as part of the reality that is the Civil Air Patrol.  Don't fight over uniforms or demand strange classifications merely because the USAF has them, but rather see how we can best be an effective CAP.   One does not have to be the hammer , or have the hammer be like them, to drive in a nail, merely they must have a reliable hammer in one's hand.  We are that hammer.

[RiverAux]

we are CAP, and have been since 1942.

1941

[Major Carrales]

we are CAP, and have been since 1942.

1941

Sorry, I was going from my History of Corpus Chrsiti's CAP. 

[flyguy06]

I have always said that one of he main reasons I joined CAP was because I always wanted to be a military pilot. I couldnt due to my vision. I did join the military in a non aviation job, but the yearning to be a military ppilot has always been there.

So for me, CAP is the closets I will ever get to being a military pilot, so I look at it that way, so in a way I am a wannabe. I always wear flightsuits when I fly. I never wear that blue shirt thingy. I try to do things by the book and opspecs. I am eventually going to be a stan eval officer.

[Short Field]

We are not the USAF, many parallels do not work...we are CAP, and have been since 1942 (1941 for the rest of the Non-CORPUS CHRISTI audience) .

True words.

I joined CAP because it offered a good mission and looked like more fun than other volunteer organizaitons.  I like what CAP does and like supporting the mission.  If I had wanted a more military or paramilitary organization, I would have looked for one and joined it.    CAP is CAP.

[Stonewall]

My idea of a wannabe, and I've seen many like this in CAP, is the dude who shows up at the SAR-EX in a boonie cap, survival knife upside down on his LBE strap, and black beret hanging out of his cargo pocket.  Yes! I have seen this guy.

My idea of a wannabe, and I've seen this in CAP, is the guy who shows up barking orders like a seen out of Full Metal Jacket.  Yes!  I have seen this guy.

My idea of a wannabe, and I've seen this in CAP, is the guy who shows up as a scanner trainee in aviator shades, dog tags looped around his collar and tucked in, aviator scarf and helmet bag with nothing in it.  Yes!  I have seen this guy.

My idea of a wannabe, and I've seen this in CAP, is the guy who shows up with a sniper patch on his BDU pocket because "he earned it in the Marine Corps".  Yes!  I have seen this guy.

My idea of a wannabe, and I've seen this in CAP, is the guy with advanced first aid training who shows up with a large trauma kit, star of life on his car, tourniquet hanging off his LBE, drop leg "blow out kit", bandage (EMT) sheers dangling off a D-ring and scanner taped to the other LBE strap.  Yes!  I've seen this guy.

My idea of a wannabe, and I've seen this in CAP, is the guy that shows up in civilian clothes to a meeting, spouting off all this special operations, black ops, secret squirrel, Agent Orange stuff that hasn't ever sat inside a C-130.  Yes!  I've seen this guy.

My idea of a wannabe, ALL CADETS!  Yep, I said it, all cadets.  If they weren't, I'd be worried.  Actually, I've met several that don't seem to have any dreams, let alone goals.  Anyway, every cadet, as far as I'm concerned is a "wannabe".  Who cares about the cadets?  They should be wannabes!!!!  They should day dream about being something great.  Something of a legendary figure.  A doctor, blue angel pilot, ranger, PJ, astronaut, paramedic, hero.  

But it's not the cadets I concern myself with when we talk about wannabes.  As far as I'm concerned, and by no means am I the authority, but I think it's complete cool to be ate up with this stuff.  It's cool to be in_to_it.  Going on a mission can give you a rush.  Going wheels-up for a distress beacon and hearing that WHOOP WHOOP as soon as you clear the tree line.  As I have said before, JUST BE CAP.  I mean, when I see a 40 year old show up with a beret, or a 30-something show up with enough medical equipment to conduct field surgery, yet they only have basic first aid, I worry about their ability to make decisions, period.  Not just decisions that may affect young people or during times of stress, but run of the mill decisions.

Like ribbons, badges, and gear?  Fine.  But be practical.  Make good decisions.  Don't let the physical aspect of the program become more important than the intangible things, like leadership by example.

Oh, and when I speak of wannabes, I'm not talking solely about non-military veterans.  What's worse is coming across a REMF guy who pushed papers or turned a wrench, showing up acting like a drill sergeant, some snake eating ninja, or the be all - end all to your squadron's need for military leadership.  Yes, these folks can be worse than anyone out there.  Even something as drill and ceremonies.  It's not like the whole military practices D&C regularly after basic training.  So if some dude that served a 4 year enlistment as a chaplains assistant shows up saying that he'll bring your drill team to national, watch him like a hawk.  NOTE: this is not a slam on non-combat MOS's or AFSC, I'm just saying, I've met a ton of non-combat job types who come across as snake eating woodsmen.

And of course, there is the guy that shows up wearing a ton of bling he didn't earn.  That's a wannabe.  A wannabe IS NOT the CAP senior member wearing 16 CAP ribbons correctly who earned them.  No, it's the guy wearing the crapola that he didn't earn who is the wannabe.

Like I said, nothing wrong with being motivated as long as you can recognize the difference between real life and fantasy.  As long as you understand that you are not a Tier 1 SOCOM asset, or that you really do not need a kaybar knife taped upside down on your LBE.  And no, it is not cool to deck your Ford Focus out with $2,500 worth of emergency lights and sirens.

[Eclipse]

It's cool to be in_to_it.  Going on a mission can give you a rush.  Going wheels-up for a distress beacon and hearing that WHOOP WHOOP as soon as you clear the tree line.  As I have said before, JUST BE CAP.

[darn], well said.  Too often those of us who enjoy it for what it is get grief because we don't take fire while doing it.

Some of the "lamest" CAP stuff is cooler than what most people do with their free time.

[flyguy06]

We are not the USAF, many parallels do not work...we are CAP, and have been since 1942 (1941 for the rest of the Non-CORPUS CHRISTI audience) .

True words.

I joined CAP because it offered a good mission and looked like more fun than other volunteer organizaitons.  I like what CAP does and like supporting the mission.  If I had wanted a more military or paramilitary organization, I would have looked for one and joined it.    CAP is CAP.

I wanted to join the USAF and be a pilot but couldnt because of my vision

[ddelaney103]

Like I said, nothing wrong with being motivated as long as you can recognize the difference between real life and fantasy.  As long as you understand that you are not a Tier 1 SOCOM asset, or that you really do not need a kaybar knife taped upside down on your LBE.  And no, it is not cool to deck your Ford Focus out with $2,500 worth of emergency lights and sirens.

Um, I gotta go and rewrite my Christmas list now...

[mikeylikey]

We are not the USAF, many parallels do not work...we are CAP, and have been since 1942 (1941 for the rest of the Non-CORPUS CHRISTI audience) .

True words.

I joined CAP because it offered a good mission and looked like more fun than other volunteer organizations.  I like what CAP does and like supporting the mission.  If I had wanted a more military or paramilitary organization, I would have looked for one and joined it.    CAP is CAP.

I wanted to join the USAF and be a pilot but couldn't because of my vision

So you became an Officer in the Army.  Well my friend, that is exactly the same story here.  I wanted to be a pilot, but navigator would have been the closest to it, and that was not for me.  Then the Army had me talked into flying for them (just not flying as the pilot in charge).  So I said well lets move on, and I now have a rewarding Field artillery Career.  Besides, whats better than blowing crap up 3 to 7 miles away?  I get to be a technical expert, and say that I attended one of the most difficult (physical and technical) and longest Officer BASIC Courses in the Army.  Now, Officer Advanced is not nearly as long, but close.  Plus, I am a "King of Battle", and Fort Sill is by far one of the best military posts in the continental US.  At least thats what the sign there says "Best military installation-1988"

[flyguy06]

My idea of a wannabe, and I've seen many like this in CAP, is the dude who shows up at the SAR-EX in a boonie cap, survival knife upside down on his LBE strap, and black beret hanging out of his cargo pocket.  Yes! I have seen this guy.

My idea of a wannabe, and I've seen this in CAP, is the guy who shows up barking orders like a seen out of Full Metal Jacket.  Yes!  I have seen this guy.

My idea of a wannabe, and I've seen this in CAP, is the guy who shows up as a scanner trainee in aviator shades, dog tags looped around his collar and tucked in, aviator scarf and helmet bag with nothing in it.  Yes!  I have seen this guy.

My idea of a wannabe, and I've seen this in CAP, is the guy who shows up with a sniper patch on his BDU pocket because "he earned it in the Marine Corps".  Yes!  I have seen this guy.

My idea of a wannabe, and I've seen this in CAP, is the guy with advanced first aid training who shows up with a large trauma kit, star of life on his car, tourniquet hanging off his LBE, drop leg "blow out kit", bandage (EMT) sheers dangling off a D-ring and scanner taped to the other LBE strap.  Yes!  I've seen this guy.

My idea of a wannabe, and I've seen this in CAP, is the guy that shows up in civilian clothes to a meeting, spouting off all this special operations, black ops, secret squirrel, Agent Orange stuff that hasn't ever sat inside a C-130.  Yes!  I've seen this guy.

My idea of a wannabe, ALL CADETS!  Yep, I said it, all cadets.  If they weren't, I'd be worried.  Actually, I've met several that don't seem to have any dreams, let alone goals.  Anyway, every cadet, as far as I'm concerned is a "wannabe".  Who cares about the cadets?  They should be wannabes!!!!  They should day dream about being something great.  Something of a legendary figure.  A doctor, blue angel pilot, ranger, PJ, astronaut, paramedic, hero.  

But it's not the cadets I concern myself with when we talk about wannabes.  As far as I'm concerned, and by no means am I the authority, but I think it's complete cool to be ate up with this stuff.  It's cool to be in_to_it.  Going on a mission can give you a rush.  Going wheels-up for a distress beacon and hearing that WHOOP WHOOP as soon as you clear the tree line.  As I have said before, JUST BE CAP.  I mean, when I see a 40 year old show up with a beret, or a 30-something show up with enough medical equipment to conduct field surgery, yet they only have basic first aid, I worry about their ability to make decisions, period.  Not just decisions that may affect young people or during times of stress, but run of the mill decisions.

Like ribbons, badges, and gear?  Fine.  But be practical.  Make good decisions.  Don't let the physical aspect of the program become more important than the intangible things, like leadership by example.

Oh, and when I speak of wannabes, I'm not talking solely about non-military veterans.  What's worse is coming across a REMF guy who pushed papers or turned a wrench, showing up acting like a drill sergeant, some snake eating ninja, or the be all - end all to your squadron's need for military leadership.  Yes, these folks can be worse than anyone out there.  Even something as drill and ceremonies.  It's not like the whole military practices D&C regularly after basic training.  So if some dude that served a 4 year enlistment as a chaplains assistant shows up saying that he'll bring your drill team to national, watch him like a hawk.  NOTE: this is not a slam on non-combat MOS's or AFSC, I'm just saying, I've met a ton of non-combat job types who come across as snake eating woodsmen.

And of course, there is the guy that shows up wearing a ton of bling he didn't earn.  That's a wannabe.  A wannabe IS NOT the CAP senior member wearing 16 CAP ribbons correctly who earned them.  No, it's the guy wearing the crapola that he didn't earn who is the wannabe.

Like I said, nothing wrong with being motivated as long as you can recognize the difference between real life and fantasy.  As long as you understand that you are not a Tier 1 SOCOM asset, or that you really do not need a kaybar knife taped upside down on your LBE.  And no, it is not cool to deck your Ford Focus out with $2,500 worth of emergency lights and sirens.

Bravo. I have seen these guys as well.

But about your statement about non combat MOS folks acting like Drill Sergeants. Remember each MOS has rill Sergeants in that MOS. I am a grunt LT but I realize that ther eare 63B Drills, 71L Drills' and 92A Drill Sergeants as well. not just 11B (although that the only real MOS) 

[JohnKachenmeister]

Somebody at Fort Sill stole that sign.  It belongs in front of Ft. Sam Houston.  Please make sure it is returned.

[flyguy06]

We are not the USAF, many parallels do not work...we are CAP, and have been since 1942 (1941 for the rest of the Non-CORPUS CHRISTI audience) .

True words.

I joined CAP because it offered a good mission and looked like more fun than other volunteer organizations.  I like what CAP does and like supporting the mission.  If I had wanted a more military or paramilitary organization, I would have looked for one and joined it.    CAP is CAP.

I wanted to join the USAF and be a pilot but couldn't because of my vision

So you became an Officer in the Army.  Well my friend, that is exactly the same story here.  I wanted to be a pilot, but navigator would have been the closest to it, and that was not for me.  Then the Army had me talked into flying for them (just not flying as the pilot in charge).  So I said well lets move on, and I now have a rewarding Field artillery Career.  Besides, whats better than blowing crap up 3 to 7 miles away?  I get to be a technical expert, and say that I attended one of the most difficult (physical and technical) and longest Officer BASIC Courses in the Army.  Now, Officer Advanced is not nearly as long, but close.  Plus, I am a "King of Battle", and Fort Sill is by far one of the best military posts in the continental US.  At least thats what the sign there says "Best military installation-1988"

For me, since I couldnt fly inthe military period, I had went to an Army military college and isaw al the upperclassmen waling around with Airborne wings and being the young impressionable 18 year old I was, I decided to do that. I knew I wanted to be a high ranking officer and I had always heard thatin order to make General youhad to be combat arms. So I went into the Infantry. However now atthe age of 39, i am tired of the Infantry and am thinking of branch transferring to Quartermaster. Plus I have my civilian career to focus on

[mikeylikey]

Somebody at Fort Sill stole that sign.  It belongs in front of Ft. Sam Houston.  Please make sure it is returned.

Well Sir, many trips to Sam Houston to visit the girlfriend when we were both Lt's going through our OBC's!  I have to say the San Antonio experience was AWESOME!  I would much rather been at FSH than SILL!  In fact, I almost married that woman so that I could live there on post with her.  But things work out for varied reasons.  

I am debating where I will preference my next assignment.  I would love to go to West Point, but would not mind a stint in Texas or Oklahoma again.  But if things go right, it may be back to the -Stan or raq for this guy after the ROTC duty is done.

[mikeylikey]

We are not the USAF, many parallels do not work...we are CAP, and have been since 1942 (1941 for the rest of the Non-CORPUS CHRISTI audience) .

True words.

I joined CAP because it offered a good mission and looked like more fun than other volunteer organizations.  I like what CAP does and like supporting the mission.  If I had wanted a more military or paramilitary organization, I would have looked for one and joined it.    CAP is CAP.

I wanted to join the USAF and be a pilot but couldn't because of my vision

So you became an Officer in the Army.  Well my friend, that is exactly the same story here.  I wanted to be a pilot, but navigator would have been the closest to it, and that was not for me.  Then the Army had me talked into flying for them (just not flying as the pilot in charge).  So I said well lets move on, and I now have a rewarding Field artillery Career.  Besides, whats better than blowing crap up 3 to 7 miles away?  I get to be a technical expert, and say that I attended one of the most difficult (physical and technical) and longest Officer BASIC Courses in the Army.  Now, Officer Advanced is not nearly as long, but close.  Plus, I am a "King of Battle", and Fort Sill is by far one of the best military posts in the continental US.  At least thats what the sign there says "Best military installation-1988"

For me, since I couldnt fly inthe military period, I had went to an Army military college and isaw al the upperclassmen waling around with Airborne wings and being the young impressionable 18 year old I was, I decided to do that. I knew I wanted to be a high ranking officer and I had always heard thatin order to make General youhad to be combat arms. So I went into the Infantry. However now atthe age of 39, i am tired of the Infantry and am thinking of branch transferring to Quartermaster. Plus I have my civilian career to focus on

NOOOO!  The new Officer Branch of Logistics just opened up.  That is where you want to go.  That will produce more LTC's and COL's than the other branches, because they will be the ones running the Army.  They are taking Quartermaster, Transpo and Ordinance.  Basically you will be the Officer everyone wants around and comes to for help. 

However you cant Branch Transfer to it until you make CPT or CPT (P).

[ddelaney103]

Stonewall has a comprehensive list, but there are a few types of wannabes that he missed.  These are the types you see usually on-line.  They're rare on CAPTalk: if you wanted to see them in their glory you had to be on Auxiliary Power back in the day.

Forum wannabes spent a lot of time dreaming up ways of getting more legitimacy.  Again, "just being CAP" wasn't enough.  They would want to get commissions or status similar to the Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve (Training) officers used by Air Training Corps in the UK.  It was a deep seated need for recognition of how awesome they were.

A variant on this is the "tightening standards" crowd.  Now, there's nothing wrong with having standards and enforcing them.  However, the wannabe strain of this would come in two flavors.  

The first type was marked by a desire to adopt more military standards, such as hewing more closely to AF PME standards.  There was often an undercurrent of "if we act more like the AF, they'll have to respect us!"

The second one was adoption of a standard of making officership or grade harder to get.  Again, not a bad idea.  The mark of the wannabe was the desire to exclude other people from officership or grade by recommending stuff he had (like a college degree or AF PME) as the gatekeeper to keep out the riff-raff.

In summary, there is nothing wrong in standards or in improving our organization.  However, unless a person can accept and approve of what they actually are, wannabe-ism will continue to plague them, and us.