I believe CAP members ARE covered by the Public Safety Officers Benefit Act

[wingnut55]

New Mexico

SB 148

Law enforcement, officer's, fireman's,rescue squad workers, and civil air patrol members death benefit Act.

[NCRblues]

wingnut55 thank you for doing the research its nice to see someone who knows what their doing :clap:. I also really appreciate all those "experts" out their who "know" how federal judges and other elected officials see cap!! i love captalk's "experts"! facts? who needs facts when we have mid- level volunteer officers opinions. 

[wingnut55]

IN THE SENATE OF THE UNITED STATES

March 17, 2005

Mr. ALLARD introduced the following bill; which was read twice and referred to the Committee on the Judiciary

A BILL

To amend the Omnibus Crime Control and Safe Streets Act of 1968 to make volunteer members of the Civil Air Patrol eligible for Public Safety Officer death benefits.

      Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,

SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE.

      This Act may be cited as the `Civil Air Patrol Homeland Security Benefits Act of 2005'.

SEC. 2. ELIGIBILITY OF CIVIL AIR PATROL FOR PUBLIC SAFETY OFFICER DEATH BENEFITS.

      (a) In General- Section 1204( of the Omnibus Crime Control and Safe Streets Act of 1968 (42 U.S.C. 3796b() is amended--

            (1) by striking `or' at the end of subparagraph (B);

            (2) by striking the period at the end of subparagraph (C) and inserting `; or'; and

            (3) by adding at the end the following:

                  `(C) a volunteer civilian member of the Civil Air Patrol who is engaged in--

                        `(i) active service, if such service is--

                              `(I) rendered in performance or support of operational missions of the Civil Air Patrol under the direction of the Department of the Air Force; and

                              `(II) pursuant to, and is performed consistent with, written authorization from competent authority that specifies a finite assignment and a finite period of time for such assignment; or

                        `(ii) travel to or from such service.'.

      (b) Consultation- Section 1205 of the Omnibus Crime Control and Safe Streets Act of 1968 (42 U.S.C. 3796c) is amended by adding at the end the following:

      `(d) Consultation- In making determinations under section 1201 with respect to the eligibility of a volunteer civilian member of the Civil Air Patrol, the Bureau may consult with the Secretary of the Air Force and, if consulted, the Secretary of the Air Force shall provide to the Bureau such assistance and information as the Bureau considers necessary.'.

[wingnut55]

Can't sleep

1:00am. need to install 5 more computers at the Sqdn, fix a GPS, send flowers to mom

The research was for me too

All MEMBERS MAKE SURE YOU HAVE YOUR SURVIVOR INFORMATION ON FILE!!!!

i SUSPECT THAT IF YOUR FAMILY DOES NOT ASK FOR BENEFITS IF YOUR KILLED

no one in cap will tell them or help them

[biomed441]

Can't sleep and its only 1 am? I've been having issues going to sleep earlier than 4am for the last 5 weeks.  Yeah I've got some issues. 

I concur with the others that your research, regardless of the time of day/evening it occured is certainly helpful. Sure hope RiverAux isn't planning on going down in the line of duty though 

My cousin is an attorney. I've been trying to get him involved with CAP as a legal officer. Not sure if my attempts are working though...

[JoeTomasone]

My "barracks lawyer" interpretation:


The OP stretches by making USAF a "Public Agency" on whose behalf we operate.   USAF is not (and has never been considered) a "Public Agency" -- it is a branch of the military.   Therefore, USAF (and by extension, CAP) are not Public Agencies and thus do not qualify.

The PSO Death Benefit act had to be amended to specifically include CAP -- meaning that CAP was EXCLUDED before  -  and thus logically would have to be ADDED to the Benefit Act to be covered.

[JohnKachenmeister]

The Air Force is not a "Public Agency?  Then what is it?  Private?

Screw up your accounting in the USAF and see how quickly you are reminded that the USAF is a Public Agency using Public Funds.

Personally, I think that River's analysis is correct.  Since the definition of "Rescue or Ambulance Squad Member" includes persons who perform SAR, since the USAF is a "Public Agency" under the definition, and since we are "Employees, with OR WITHOUT compensation," if you die, your family can get whatever Obama has left after he pays his debts to Acorn for registering dead Democrats to vote.

[heliodoc]

I can stand corrected now....

But then it is NOT wll advertised and mentioned thru CAP circles.

But after reading these posts...it is up to States interp of the OCC Act  of 1968 and how it is applied.

But again CAP like other isn't going to look out for anybody unless the family(ies) ask

I will stand corrected....I don't have the time to look ALL this up and I will admit my own ignorance.

Then Hooray for CAP  Why then bring up anymore posts on this???

[JoeTomasone]

The Air Force is not a "Public Agency?  Then what is it?  Private?

Actually, I had figured that the military would not be legally considered an agency (along the lines of the DOD not being an agency but a Department, perhaps), but subsequent research says otherwise.   

[Flying Pig]

Well, someone needs to figure it out because its not something that should be open for interpretation.  This is something national should be able to answer.

[caplegalnc]

If you read both the PSOB in the United States Code (42 USC 3796) AND in the implementing Code of Federal Regulations (28 CFR 32.3) you find that CAP in not likely to be covered as "Rescue Squad".  If you go to the BJA webpage on River Aux's first post you can read the US Code and travel the hyperlink the the CFR and find the Rescue Squad definition.  It deals with medical treatment providers. 

[RiverAux]

Wingnut, although you seem to have been trying to support me (and we're rarely on the same page), you got it wrong. The 2005 bill that would have specifically added CAP to the PSOB was not actually approved. 

I was also not talking about FECA benefits.  Those clearly already apply to CAP and there is specific federal legislation for that. 

You are also right that some states provide coverage for CAP in various circumstances. 

The PSOB Act is something totally different and actually would provide significantly more benefits than we get under FECA. 

Heliodoc makes a significant point in that the agency overseeing PSOB claims has made some extremely weird decisions and if they have denied coverage to people who died while flying airtankers on wildlife fire missions, they've apparently got a very big stick in a place where the sun rarely shines.  I did a little research and found another case where they managed to come up with some slick reasoning to deny coverage to a lady who was a deputiezed law enforcement officer for the slimmest of reasons. 

If they can get away with that, I would have to admit that the chances of a CAP member getting covered could be slim. 

The OP stretches by making USAF a "Public Agency" on whose behalf we operate.   USAF is not (and has never been considered) a "Public Agency" -- it is a branch of the military.   Therefore, USAF (and by extension, CAP) are not Public Agencies and thus do not qualify.

While the assertion that the USAF wouldn't be considered a public agency is absurd, there is other language in the act that make a point of talking about people acting in a civilian capacity.  And while we are of course civilians, perhaps the same legal geniuses who think that posse comitatus applies can apply to us even though the act is specific to the Army and Navy (and by implication the Air Force and Marines) even though we're civilians might make that same argument in this case. 

If you go to the BJA webpage on River Aux's first post you can read the US Code and travel the hyperlink the the CFR and find the Rescue Squad definition.  It deals with medical treatment providers. 

I provided the relevant quote in the first post.  Let me remind you:

Rescue squad or ambulance crew means a squad or crew whose members are rescue workers, ambulance drivers, paramedics, health-care responders, emergency medical technicians, or other similar workers, who—
(1)  Are trained in rescue activity or the provision of emergency medical services; and
(2)  As such members, have the legal authority and ‑responsibility to—
(i)     Engage in rescue activity; or
(ii)    Provide emergency medical services.

And what is rescue activity?

Rescue activity means search or rescue assistance in locating or extracting from danger persons lost, missing, or in imminent danger of serious bodily harm.

We provide both search and rescue assistance in locating or extracting from danger persons lost, missing, or in imminent danger of serious bodily harm.  The clause about providing medical care is not linked to the above with an AND, but with an OR.  So, you can either do what we do or provide medical care to be covered.

[RiverAux]

Sure hope RiverAux isn't planning on going down in the line of duty though 

Jeez, I hope not, though I've always had a nagging suspicion that I may be tempting fate in bringing up issues like this. 

Incidentally, I brought this up because I came across it while researching some issues regarding volunteer fire departments and CAP.  I didn't make the CAP connection right away, but when I came across the PSOB I realized that some people I work with in my real life job probably would meet the criteria were they to be injured while performing certain duties (wouldn't include me at this point, by the way).  I was pretty sure my bosses probably hadn't thought about it, so after bringing this to the attention of the powers that be, it then occurred to me that CAP should already be covered for the reasons I've explained above. 

By the way, the only way anyone will ever know for sure is to try to file a claim for a CAP member and see what happens.  I would fully expect the agency that oversees it to reject such an application based on some of the issues wingnut and I discussed above, but it would ultimately be up to the courts to decide if that would be a correct decision.   

[wingnut55]

River AUX you're right it seems that our fate is left to the courts in many cases, I know of several cases where the pilot screwed the pooch and the family had to sue for coverage. In CA the workers comp covers CAP along with FECA, however the FICA is a difficult bureaucratic organization. Workers comp pays more money and the death Benefits are much better. I am not sure at what pay scale worker comp pays, the maximum is $860.00 per week that is not enough if you are a Dr. or Lawyer or ??
Most insurance company's will not cover any military activity and several that I have talked to consider CAP as Military Activity.

I talked to the Pilot's insurance company and they told me that flying for CAP requires a rider and so a higher rate because we fly at 1,000 feet for extended periods of time??? that was interesting.

I have to say that this is really NHQs responsibility, however it is clear NHQ is just as bureaucratic and keeping this subject cloudy is in their best interest.

It is hard to recruit young family Men/Women if they find out that should they die on a Mission or Training flight their family could end up on welfare.

[es_g0d]

Can someone kindly outline what the benefit of being part of the PSOB would be?

FWIW, I do believe that CAP needs to legally pursue the "volunteer firefighter" model for our status.   All too often we're left in limbo as to whether we're a local, state, or federal agency.

[JohnKachenmeister]

Can someone kindly outline what the benefit of being part of the PSOB would be?

FWIW, I do believe that CAP needs to legally pursue the "volunteer firefighter" model for our status.   All too often we're left in limbo as to whether we're a local, state, or federal agency.

The Public Safety Officers' Benefit Act is a Federal law that pays a cash settlement of (Last I heard but subject to change) $50,000 to the surviving next of kin of any policeman, fireman, or other public safety professional killed in the line of duty.  I believe that CAP members on an AFAM SAR mission would be covered in the event of such a death.  I also believe that, DEPENDING ON THE NATURE OF THE MISSION, missions other than AFAM's would be included.  Of course, Drug Interdiction missions are a no-brainer, the CAP is acting in direct support of LE.  Search missions called by local sheriffs would also extend PSOB coverage to CAP, I think.  Counting wildlife for the Department of Wildlife Counting, no.

[RiverAux]

Actually, the PSOB death benefit is now $315,000.  There is also a disability benefit available. 

Of course, Drug Interdiction missions are a no-brainer, the CAP is acting in direct support of LE.

Here is how this law defines law enforcement officer:

(6) "law enforcement officer" means an individual involved in crime and juvenile delinquency control or reduction, or enforcement of the criminal laws (including juvenile delinquency), including, but not limited to, police, corrections, probation, parole, and judicial officers;

On the face of it, you might think a CAP member might have a chance of being coverred since it doesn't limit it to just police and we are helping to enforce criminal law in those situations.

But the court decision I came across and mentioned above would very strongly indicate that CAP members on CD missions wouldn't be covered since we actually aren't authorized to enforce criminal laws (by being deputized, for example). 

However, if someone had the money to afford the lawyers that would eventually be necessary, the family of a CAP member could try. 

There is one other thing that could throw a kink in the works for covering CAP under the rescue squad provision of the act -- the legislative history associated with the act.  For example, when Congress was debating the bill they might have gone into more detail about what they meant by rescue squad.  Heck, somone might even have asked the sponsor -- "Do you intend this to cover the Civil Air Patrol? and the sponsor might have said, "No".  If that was the case, we'd have no chance.  Howevever, I don't know how to research the legislative history to see if that could be a problem. 

[bosshawk]

Why not consult a few members of CAPtalk who happen to be lawyers?  Ned, Alice and SocalCapOfficer are all attorneys in CA and I happen to know that Alice has direct experience in dealing with the deaths of several CAP members on AFAMs.

Hey, guys we could use your expertise.

[RiverAux]

There is another scenario where CAP members could potentially make a claim for coverage under this act -- firefighting.

CAP members in several wings do provide aerial observation and imagery to assist in fighting wildfires.  I don't know the specifics of these arrangements, but I could see a possibility for a claim if the mission was being done in a state that provides some sort of state coverage for CAP members while performing those missions.  For example, some states provide workers comp.  However, if the firefighting was being done as an entirely corporate mission then I don't think we would be covered by PSOB. 

Of course, if wingnut is right that people actually dropping water or fire suppressent on wildfires are getting denied coverage, then a CAP member would have little chance either. 

[JayT]

There is another scenario where CAP members could potentially make a claim for coverage under this act -- firefighting.

CAP members in several wings do provide aerial observation and imagery to assist in fighting wildfires.  I don't know the specifics of these arrangements, but I could see a possibility for a claim if the mission was being done in a state that provides some sort of state coverage for CAP members while performing those missions.  For example, some states provide workers comp.  However, if the firefighting was being done as an entirely corporate mission then I don't think we would be covered by PSOB. 

Of course, if wingnut is right that people actually dropping water or fire suppressent on wildfires are getting denied coverage, then a CAP member would have little chance either.

I think you guys are really over thinking this.

In no way is CAP a "firefighting" agency.

Also, Rescue Squad, to me at least, plainly refers to ambulance units or heavy rescue (car accident) units. I have never seen any CAP documentation labeling us a "rescue squad," but I see it written on fire trucks and ambulances all the time.

Of course, this could just be because our last president started a war in a foreign country which caused us to squander trillions which could be spent on providing insurance to CAPers.