Special Appointments for Advanced Grade Question.

[Eclipse]

If at any point a member feels he is being discriminated against, or otherwise treated inappropriately he can file a complaint.

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

If at any point a member feels he is being discriminated against, or otherwise treated inappropriately he can file a complaint.

Someone not liking you and someone actively being discriminated against can be very different, and hard to prove.

[Eclipse]

If at any point a member feels he is being discriminated against, or otherwise treated inappropriately he can file a complaint.

Someone not liking you and someone actively being discriminated against can be very different, and hard to prove.

Agreed, however regardless, there is a process in these situations, and if one decides not to avail themselves,
for whatever reason, then the situation will stand.

Dwelling on it, or wearing on your sleeve, won't change anything.

We all live and die at the pleasure of our CAP commanders - those people change over time, as
are we also able to change where we serve, so nothing is permanent, I would guess most
people active in CAP have either bumped heads with, or otherwise displeased someone
in the chain along the way, usually to a delayed something or other missed opportunities.

[brackins23]

LOL still no resolution. Looking to transfer to a new SQ later on.  OH YEAH THE SKY IS NOT BLUE ITS A CYAN  COLOR..

[brackins23]

You guys will find this funny!!!! I asked again about the situation. First I was told I was wrong that it was 6 months and there were not any special promotions, etc. Then I was told I have sent emails to higher leadership and which no one has replied after 5 weeks. Then I was told the program does exist but I do not know how to do the paper work for the promotion, but I have emails out and no one has replied to them. I'm not to concerned about the promotion ahead of time as I did not know it existed until someone pointed it out to me. I'm just happy to be doing this with my wife and two kids, but at least be competent and spend 5 minutes or less and read the the section in the CAPR that I just printed and gave you before making up crap. Now to top it off I was told that my youngest kids paperwork for his AMN stripe has been misplaced within 30 seconds of being told he had not completed his PT test nor drill test, which myself and cadet program officer informed the cc that was not correct and he had completed all requirements, however the other cadet that completed all his requirements along with my son was just promoted last night which is outstanding for the young man as he has worked hard to quickly complete his requirements.  Now I have a very ANGRY 12 year old that was excited about CAP and now wants to quit and never return. This is a very small squadron with only two cadets that normally show for meetings, all though we have missed some since march.  I have been told going outside of the squadron for a complaint on a subject like this is like making a pit-bull angry at you in a confined space. I am highly considering going all active duty SNCO Flight Engineer kind of off, but don't want to cause a major uproar since we have only been in CAP since March. Any Ideas how to proceed?

[Eclipse]

Take a breath, it's just CAP...

...I was told that my youngest kids paperwork for his AMN stripe has been misplaced within 30 seconds of being told he had not completed his PT test nor drill test, which myself and cadet program officer informed the cc that was not correct and he had completed all requirements, however the other cadet that completed all his requirements along with my son was just promoted last night which is outstanding for the young man as he has worked hard to quickly complete his requirements.  Now I have a very ANGRY 12 year old that was excited about CAP and now wants to quit and never return.

He can be promoted online in a couple of clicks, there's really no "paperwork" other then what they may be using to track things until it is entered.

This is a very small squadron with only two cadets that normally show for meetings,

This is probably the core of the problem - people disconnected from the CAP mainstream, minsinformed and just walking the same circle they always have.

all though we have missed some since march.  I have been told going outside of the squadron for a complaint on a subject like this is like making a pit-bull angry at you in a confined space.

It's really not, other then the people locally getting their noses out of joint because they will be shown to have no clue what they are doing.

I am highly considering going all active duty SNCO Flight Engineer kind of off, but don't want to cause a major uproar since we have only been in CAP since March. Any Ideas how to proceed?

Why not?  If you're ready to quit, what have you got to lose.

Be professional, arm yourself with the regs, and have at it.

Time.
To.
Shake.
Things.
Up.

(However in keeping with CAP tradition, don't be surprised if you're asked to wear the CC badge at the end of the "discussion".)

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

(However in keeping with CAP tradition, don't be surprised if you're asked to wear the CC badge at the end of the "discussion".)

Not just CAP tradition, sir.  This reminds me of a time when I was a Boy Scout.  It was the 1970s and I was probably 11 years old.  I was in a troop that rapidly became known for "playing favourites," especially where the Scoutmaster's son was concerned.  It was no secret he had the rails greased for him to become Eagle Scout and reach the highest level of Order of the Arrow.

One night at a Court of Honour (BSA awards ceremony) the Troop Committee were singing the praises of this kid and other "favoured sons" in the troop, of which I was not one (surprise! ).  My dad, who was not known for his subtlety (he'd been a railway worker, soldier, long-haul trucker, heavy construction equipment operator and diesel mechanic) was sitting there listening to all this, and I knew he was getting angrier with each word.

Finally, he stood up and said "Just wait a minute..."  I won't go into the details of what he said, mostly because the censor won't allow them, but he made it clear that during the times he had helped the troop out that he had noticed the favouritism, whereas those who were on the "good" list basically stood around and let the younger kids do all the work.  He said, "I'm [darn]ed sick and tired of this bull[mess]."

You could have heard a pin drop in that room.

Afterward the Scoutmaster asked my dad if he wanted to be Chairman of the Troop Committee!  Again, I won't repeat what my dad said.

I was later basically kicked out of the troop; or, rather, they made it so miserable for me that I didn't even want to go.

Justice eventually came, though: about 10 years after that the local Scout council ejected both the Scoutmaster and his wife for "corrupt actions," as I understand it.

I wonder how many parents of Cadets have experienced a similar way that their kids have been treated by CAP squadrons with "leaders" who couldn't find their backsides with GPS and a compass, and if powers-that-be up the chain helped them.

[gshayd]

I am also a new member who is eligible for a special promotion. Based on the facts presented and the regulations I would say that you have no basis to file a complaint.

1.  The special promotion is not mandatory or automatic
2.  It is at the commanders discretion
3.  It also says that the promotion should be for exemplary performance to merit the promotion.

If you can make the argument and have valid examples of your exemplary performance you may have an argument. If you have just attended the meetings, have your uniforms squared away and have completed Level 1.  I would say you have met the minimum requirements. Even if you have been an exemplary member see #1 and #2. Which gives you no complaint to file unless you have specific proof that the commander has committed a violation of the regulations due to personal bias.  You will probably lose on that too in a complaint.

As a leader and mentor in my opinion I would sit down with the individual and explain why I was delaying or not giving the special promotion. However, the commander is not required to do that.

My advice would be to wait the 6 months and revisit the issue then.

[brackins23]

I could care less about the early promotion as I did not know it existed until another member pointed it out to me. However telling me a different story every week about it is what the issues is here. I only bring it up as when I first inquired I was told I was wrong that there was not a program for this and then when I showed the CAPR reference I was told the CAPR reference was not valid any longer even though it is a newly updated CAPR.  The emails are out but no one replies. So I hope you see my frustration here. And as far as just showing up to meetings, I am very far past just completing level 1 as I have already completed the basic O course and all the general ES requirements, AE test one, instructor course, communications, etc...  But Like I said I could care less about the early promtion. Perhaps I just don't like made up answers that totally contradict regs.

I am also a new member who is eligible for a special promotion. Based on the facts presented and the regulations I would say that you have no basis to file a complaint.

1.  The special promotion is not mandatory or automatic
2.  It is at the commanders discretion
3.  It also says that the promotion should be for exemplary performance to merit the promotion.

If you can make the argument and have valid examples of your exemplary performance you may have an argument. If you have just attended the meetings, have your uniforms squared away and have completed Level 1.  I would say you have met the minimum requirements. Even if you have been an exemplary member see #1 and #2. Which gives you no complaint to file unless you have specific proof that the commander has committed a violation of the regulations due to personal bias.  You will probably lose on that too in a complaint.

As a leader and mentor in my opinion I would sit down with the individual and explain why I was delaying or not giving the special promotion. However, the commander is not required to do that.

My advice would be to wait the 6 months and revisit the issue then.

[Eclipse]

I could care less about the early promotion as I did not know it existed until another member pointed it out to me. However telling me a different story every week about it is what the issues is here. I only bring it up as when I first inquired I was told I was wrong that there was not a program for this and then when I showed the CAPR reference I was told the CAPR reference was not valid any longer even though it is a newly updated CAPR.  The emails are out but no one replies. So I hope you see my frustration here. And as far as just showing up to meetings, I am very far past just completing level 1 as I have already completed the basic O course and all the general ES requirements, AE test one, instructor course, communications, etc...  But Like I said I could care less about the early promtion. Perhaps I just don't like made up answers that totally contradict regs.

Your frustration is fair, and sadly not atypical.

[Cliff_Chambliss]

I could care less about the early promotion as I did not know it existed until another member pointed it out to me. However telling me a different story every week about it is what the issues is here. I only bring it up as when I first inquired I was told I was wrong that there was not a program for this and then when I showed the CAPR reference I was told the CAPR reference was not valid any longer even though it is a newly updated CAPR.  The emails are out but no one replies. So I hope you see my frustration here. And as far as just showing up to meetings, I am very far past just completing level 1 as I have already completed the basic O course and all the general ES requirements, AE test one, instructor course, communications, etc...  But Like I said I could care less about the early promtion. Perhaps I just don't like made up answers that totally contradict regs.

Your frustration is fair, and sadly not atypical.

1.  Welcome to the Good Ol Boyz Club,
2.  Not Invented Here.

Reasons why at the end of next month I will be an ex-member.

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

Again, I am reminded of the guy that joined my first squadron.

He was a brainiac - pilot's qualifications up the wazoo and a gold-plated degree from Embry-Riddle, and an aeronautical engineer in his day job.  I think he helped somehow with the design of the Taiwanese (Republic of China) Air Force's Ching-Kuo fighter (kind of a cross between an F-16 and F-18), but I'm not exactly sure how.



He insisted on coming in as an SMWOG and working up the ladder, and wearing the uniform properly.

I liked and respected him very much and was always glad to fly with him.

[Garibaldi]

Again, I am reminded of the guy that joined my first squadron.

He was a brainiac - pilot's qualifications up the wazoo and a gold-plated degree from Embry-Riddle, and an aeronautical engineer in his day job.  I think he helped somehow with the design of the Taiwanese (Republic of China) Air Force's Ching-Kuo fighter (kind of a cross between an F-16 and F-18), but I'm not exactly sure how.



He insisted on coming in as an SMWOG and working up the ladder, and wearing the uniform properly.

I liked and respected him very much and was always glad to fly with him.

I remember a similar story that a former commander in Wisconsin told me once. A gentleman came into CAP with a LOT of AE experience, so they pushed and pushed and got him a special promotion to LTC. He was in the program for a little while when he finally said "You know, for a lieutenant colonel, I don't know enough about the program. Take it away and give me something a bit more suited to me."

Then there was my former commander in Arkansas who was a Commander in the Navy when he retired, and was flying a Saudi prince around for a while, and when he finally came back to the states he decided to join and fly. He insisted he start at 2nd Lt and work his way up. That lasted about...oh, I'm gonna say a year before he became squadron commander, and finally gave in to peer pressure and became a LTC.

Then, there is me, who rejoined after 6 years and made such a stink about getting my rank back that I made enemies at Wing.

[brackins23]

Totally understandable Cyborg as that's what I planned and still plan. That's why did not ask for a waiver for the BOC nor SLS as those courses are CAP specific. I only ask about the special promotion to hear the latest weekly story on it. ( I am still waiting to hear the old joke, well my brothers sisters cousin BFF's friend said) I think if a person were there in person to see this and it's not only myself seeing it nor saying anything about it. Yes I have a nice gold plated degree from Embry-Riddle also and fly and maintain some things for my day job. Honestly after 22 years active duty I just expect a major to not make up crap as we go along as I hear weekly how the Military is (CC never been in mil). As from my previous post about my kid completing all his requirements for his AMN stripe and then seeing firsthand how that just went down with him not being promoted along with the other cadet that completed his requirements at the same time with my son put a really really bad taste in my mouth. Same rule of thought logic applied here also as within 30 seconds, the conversation went from he has not completed all his requirements for promotion to I have misplaced his records and well he may have to re complete some of the requirements to be promoted. Funny how they both completed those at the same time but one is lost . But I am just a little aggravated. So I probably will not make any more post about it here as I don't want this to go the wrong direction on postings. This is a super great forum for info. And I have changed my mind the sky is dark blue not cyan.

Again, I am reminded of the guy that joined my first squadron.

He was a brainiac - pilot's qualifications up the wazoo and a gold-plated degree from Embry-Riddle, and an aeronautical engineer in his day job.  I think he helped somehow with the design of the Taiwanese (Republic of China) Air Force's Ching-Kuo fighter (kind of a cross between an F-16 and F-18), but I'm not exactly sure how.



He insisted on coming in as an SMWOG and working up the ladder, and wearing the uniform properly.

I liked and respected him very much and was always glad to fly with him.

[gshayd]

I could care less about the early promotion as I did not know it existed until another member pointed it out to me. However telling me a different story every week about it is what the issues is here. I only bring it up as when I first inquired I was told I was wrong that there was not a program for this and then when I showed the CAPR reference I was told the CAPR reference was not valid any longer even though it is a newly updated CAPR.  The emails are out but no one replies. So I hope you see my frustration here. And as far as just showing up to meetings, I am very far past just completing level 1 as I have already completed the basic O course and all the general ES requirements, AE test one, instructor course, communications, etc...  But Like I said I could care less about the early promtion. Perhaps I just don't like made up answers that totally contradict regs.

Your frustration is fair, and sadly not atypical.

I understand your frustration. I am a Human Resources person for the military.  If I had a $1.00 for every circular chase and wrong answer I got since 1986 I would be on the beach under an umbrella drinking cold brews. I have had to learn to pick the battles I can win and not the ones were commanders discretion is a phrase.

[SARDOC]

I know that my wing has a promotion board that covers anything not a duty related promotion.  The Committee would also want to see what the member was doing to earn that grade as all professional appointments and the like are actually approved at the Wing Commander level.  The Committee makes it's recommendation to the Wing King.

[CAPAPRN]

Actually I am on that board and the "Wing King" has to submit his/ her approvals for "Region Demi-god" approval

[BHartman007]

...I also have a B.S. Aviation Degree...

Aren't they all these days...