Alt color tapes fr BDU/ABU

[Hawk200]

Over the course of my time in CAP, I've made it a point to stop and inform soldiers, sailors, airman and Marines that they are not required to salute CAP officers.

I see this as just as bad as the officer who demands salutes.  Return the salute smartly with a cheerful greeting and drive on.

I never realized it as a bad thing. But, I'll adopt your suggestion in the future.

[arajca]

I find it humorous to see sailors/soldier/etc as they attempt to determine if the guy in the blue bdu uniform wearing captain's bars (me) needs to be saluted. I carefully do not let the humor show, but I enjoy the looks on their faces. They usually fall back on "When in doubt, Whip it out". I return the salute smartly and carry on. On a rare occasion, the service member will ask about it, usually after rendering a salute. Then I will explain it to them, otherwise, it makes them look foolish. Most of the time, they will politely thank me, then salute and carry on.

I have never concerned myself with whether a service member should salute me or not. I do salute those officers who are higher than I in grade, regardless of the service. And I do follow the "When in doubt" rule as needed.

[DNall]

Well an officer should demand a salute, along with respect, trust, followership, etc in their actions & command presence, not ever in word. Now if it's a case of it being required & you teaching attention to detail or good order & discipline to someone otherwise lacking that skill or upon whom their & your life may depend on constant vigilance of that skill, then it may be appropriate. But don't be acting a fool cause you think you're important, leaving that impression will lose you respect & ability to command effectively.

[flyboy90]

When the ABU's come out, will we be able to buy them from an Air Force base? I'm asking this because I live close to MacDill AFB and I heard you are allowed to buy stuff from their clothing store? If yes, I want to snatch up a pair right when they come out.

[arajca]

1. Yes, CAP members can purchase items (officially, uniform items) at the MCSS on AF and USA bases.

2. You may be able to buy a set of ABU's, but you CANNOT wear them in CAP when they initially come out.

3. By the time CAP members are authorized to wear them, the pair you bought initially will probably not fit.

4. Expect anywhere from three to six years before CAP is authorized to wear the ABU. Might be more, might be less.

[Hawk200]

3. By the time CAP members are authorized to wear them, the pair you bought initially will probably not fit.

Hey! I resemble resent that remark! 

[Smokey]

As far as the tapes go...we do need to loose the ultramarine blue, for the same reason we dumped the smurf suit....it looks stooopid.  Kinda like having an advocado refrigerator anytime after 1980 or orange shag carpets.  I'm not saying we need camo style but white on navy blue is fine, or something else on the darker shade. We can be different from the regular AF without looking like Bozo the clown.

Professionalism is also the key....always ask  "Does my appearance command respect?"   If not....time to change something about yourself.

As for the issue of mistaking us for regular AF...Anyone in CAP who dares give an order to AF personnel should be drop kicked out of the organization.  We may ask someone to do soemthing, but to have the nerve to give an order to real AF should be a capitol offense.

I return all salutes smartly...remember those rendering it are doing so based on your rank.   And never ever demand a salute , it makes you look petty and arrogant not to mention making the organization look bad.

[afgeo4]

What about Ultramarine Blue on either subdued green/abu tiger stripe?  The Ultramarine will stand out more than any other color and will allow for easy identification. I think it would also allow for cheaper production of the tapes given most manufactureres already have green tape background and will or already have ABU tape background. Could someone do a photoshop of that?

Also, given that the ABU is a garrison pattern and is useless out in the field as far as camouflage goes, does it mean we can stop wearing orange vests when on mission? Seems like everyone will be able to see us coming anyway.

On the same note, anyone know why given the Air Force mandate on the uniform being simply a garrison pattern, why the AFSOC airmen will be issued 4 ABU sets and nothing else for the next 2 AEF rotations while everyone else will get 2 ABU and 2 DCU?  Given that the ACU is available with Air Force name and branch tapes and Air Force insignia, will they actually use that?  Will they actually use the DCU's even though they aren't issued?  Why will we have to spend $100 on a pair of green boots for ABU's when green isn't even in the pattern???    Anyone else perplexed?

...sorry, had to vent

[DNall]

Ask the guy that works for them on your second question. Doubt he knows either. My experience is folks w/ special in their name get what they need & most of what they want too.

Here's quick & dirty on ur pic. obviously the second one isn't meant to be two tone. I just didn't want to do multiple copies. If you're going to go w/ a distinctive shade of blue on issue backgrounds, I prefer that flat sky-steal blue color as seen on the OD. The badges really look good in white or silver & of course the grade would be better in white/silver/gold.

[Hawk200]

Also, given that the ABU is a garrison pattern and is useless out in the field as far as camouflage goes, does it mean we can stop wearing orange vests when on mission? Seems like everyone will be able to see us coming anyway.

Most likely, but probably not for reasons of visibility. The manual just won't change for a few more years.

On the same note, anyone know why given the Air Force mandate on the uniform being simply a garrison pattern, why the AFSOC airmen will be issued 4 ABU sets and nothing else for the next 2 AEF rotations while everyone else will get 2 ABU and 2 DCU?  Given that the ACU is available with Air Force name and branch tapes and Air Force insignia, will they actually use that?  Will they actually use the DCU's even though they aren't issued?  Why will we have to spend $100 on a pair of green boots for ABU's when green isn't even in the pattern???    Anyone else perplexed?

...sorry, had to vent

As far as the ABU being used as a field pattern, it boils down to someone in the Air Force saying: "This is an excellent camouflage pattern, it will work! Because I said so!".

It's not that it's actually effective, someone thinks that they can call it effective and it will be. (Kind of like the Emporors new clothes?) Remember the previous blue tiger stripe pattern? The one where the Cheif Master Sergeant related: "I was standing next to a blue spruce tree, and it works great!"

Green boots are another example of intentionally engineering a difference between the Air Force and other branches. Even the Marine Corps was more of a team player. When they came out with their new utilities, they offered the design for use to the Army. Army turned it down, had the ACU instead. Everybody has to be different lately.

[MIKE]

What about Ultramarine Blue on either subdued green/abu tiger stripe?  The Ultramarine will stand out more than any other color and will allow for easy identification. I think it would also allow for cheaper production of the tapes given most manufactureres already have green tape background and will or already have ABU tape background. Could someone do a photoshop of that?

I thought of it first... 

How about Ultramarine on OD for BDUs and Ultramarine on ABU for ABUs?  The USAF uses Flag Blue IIRC, which is darker. 

Here's quick & dirty on ur pic. obviously the second one isn't meant to be two tone. I just didn't want to do multiple copies. If you're going to go w/ a distinctive shade of blue on issue backgrounds, I prefer that flat sky-steal blue color as seen on the OD. The badges really look good in white or silver & of course the grade would be better in white/silver/gold.

If you are gonna subdue the tapes, you should make the badges and grade match.

[DNall]

If you are gonna subdue the tapes, you should make the badges and grade match.

Oh God! I mean I agree with you in theory, but ultramarine blue Lt bars on an OD background is far too much for me. I'm really good with white, or a Lt Gray (in honor of our grade slides), on OD, silver badges & grade. If not that then white/gray on dark blue. What'd look best is dark blue on BBDU & OD on BDU, but I can't bring myself to propose such a lack of standardization, which just proves why I'll never be in charge...

Everybody has to be different lately.

On the other side either. Give it 10-15 years & we'll be back to standardized field uniforms. Boots will happen sooner then that. Probably in goofy navy/marine looking hats too. Given enough time, common sense tends to prevail.

[Hawk200]

On the other side either. Give it 10-15 years & we'll be back to standardized field uniforms. Boots will happen sooner then that. Probably in goofy navy/marine looking hats too. Given enough time, common sense tends to prevail.

10 - 15 years you reckon? That'll work, I should be close to retiring about then. Unless I do the State Guard thing. Either way, I'll have less required annoyance, and more volunteer annoyance.

[DNall]

I figure 10 before it's politically correct to complain about it, and five more to make something hapepn, but we'll see - remember Truman.