Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
April 28, 2017, 07:49:06 PM
Home Help Login Register
News:

CAP Talk  |  Recent Posts
CAP Talk  |  Recent Posts
Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 10

 1 
 on: Today at 07:14:17 PM 
Started by MSG Mac - Last post by Alaric
^^^Great let's invoke, "This is how we have always done it". That is the knee jerk reaction of an ineffective leader, Learn to Lead, Chapter two or three, not sure which, I dont have a copy in front of me.

That will be the epitaph on the tombstone of Civil Air Patrol in about 20 years when all assets are being liquidated. That whole thought process and  the dinosaurs, are killing this program. Combine that with General Lack of Integrity and people just caring about the numbers game.


Oh well the wake should be great!

So there isn't a valid reason for our leadership to get a travel allowance to attend?


In my opinion, no there is not, if the leadership had to pay their own way perhaps they'd be a little more concerned about the cost of this event and work to minimize it so who knows, more people could afford to come.

 2 
 on: Today at 07:12:11 PM 
Started by MSG Mac - Last post by Alaric

That's a little disingenuous a very small minority of the rank and file support the conferences by attending.

Really?  "disingenuous"? 

This is a thread about conferences.

Specifically, the CAP summer conference.  When hundreds of members get together for multiple purposes.  I suggest it is a little "disingenuous" to suggest that it is somehow invalid because only a small percentage of the membership attends.  Because that is the norm, not the exception.  The president is speaking at the NRA convention today.  What percentage of NRA members go to their national convention?  (Hint:  less than the percentage of CAP members attending our conference.)  My church meets biennially in a General Assembly.  What percentage of church members do you suppose attend the General Assembly?  (Hint: less than the percentage of CAP members attending our conference.)  Twice in her 35 year career in tech, my wife has been rewarded with a trip to CES in Las Vegas.  What percentage of tech employees do you suppose get to go to CES?  (etc., etc., etc.)

Literally hundreds of our "rank and file members" find enough value to spend thousands of dollars to attend.  Obviously, you and others don't want to go.  Again, it just seems a little mean-spirited that you would tell them they can't go.  Simply because you disagree about how they should spend their own money.  My suggestion is to "let it go," and let your colleagues make their own choices about their money and value received.

It sounds like what you really want to argue about is whether or not the Command Council, BoG, and CSAG should have their meetings at or near the same time as the conference.  That is certainly a worthy discussion, but probably deserves it's own thread.  As I mentioned, both the BoG and CSAG regularly meet by teleconference and, rarely, so does the Command Council.  And they also meet in person.  For which they have a travel budget, pretty much like every other major corporation in the world, including 501C3s like the Red Cross, Scouting, and the Salvation Army.  Reasonable minds can certainly differ about how often governing bodies should meet in person, but ultimately, it is their decision to make.  Ultimately the BoG decides budget items, and so far they see value in funding occasional in-person meetings.  Your disagreement notwithstanding.

Ned, you keep putting words in my mouth.  I have no problem with the conferences or people attending them as long as they are paying their own way.  Our leadership does not, we the members pay for them.  That was the thrust of my original post and no matter how you try to twist it, is still the thrust of my argument. 

 3 
 on: Today at 07:03:38 PM 
Started by MSG Mac - Last post by EMT-83
... Membership feels disconnected from their wing and region membership...

If only there was a way to meet other members and those in leadership positions. Perhaps attend some seminars together, or sit together at a meal, or maybe belly up to the bar. Too bad there's nothing in place that allows that to happen.

 4 
 on: Today at 06:12:39 PM 
Started by MSG Mac - Last post by SarDragon
^^^^ If I have to pay for, my room, meal, transportation, and cost for the event, they can as well.

Lead by example. If money is that tight at the Wing level and Squadron level, that we keep hearing about budget cuts for Programs. Then yes, divert their transportation budget and put it back in the Air or on Cadets.

I see no value in sitting and hearing the "Little Yellow Plane Story" for the umpteenth time. Give me real training or real education.

We bring things up and the "leadership" smiles, nods, and tells us how valuable we are. Then back to business as usual.

CAP is 15 years behind in technology, communications, and we wonder why other agencies won't work with us. That is what needs to be spent on, not a travel budget.

You are not required, by nature of your position, required to attend. The folks that get the free ride are. This no different that other corporations.

Have you ever been to a National Conference? I attended the on in San Diego, in 2010. It was local for me, so it was easy to attend. I commuted every day, but I spent almost as much in gas and parking as the hotel room would have cost, so I'll consider that as a wash.

It was very worthwhile. There was real training and real education. I got to meet the folks you call "Ivory Tower members". Guess what? They are real people, just like you and me. I also got to put faces with a bunch of the folks who post on here.

They move it around the country, so it's in someone's regional area every year. Here's the list of locations back to 2002:

2016     Nashville, TN
2015     Orlando, FL
2014     Las Vegas, NV
2013    Denver, CO
2012     Baltimore, MD
2011     Louisville, KY
2010     San Diego, CA
2009     San Antonio, TX
2008     Kissimmee, FL
2007     Atlanta, GA
2006     Reno, NV
2005     St. Louis, MO
2004     Tampa, FL
2003     Las Vegas, NV
2002     Philadelphia, PA

As noted elsewhere, this year is back in San Antonio, and next year will be in Los Angeles. I'm going.

Also of note is that each of these locations is in, or close to, what's called a destination city. They have airports directly accessible (n0n-stop flights) from most other large and medium cities. They have hotels big enough to support the event and the guest load.

 5 
 on: Today at 03:52:55 PM 
Started by taylor914 - Last post by Jaison009
BWAHAHA

I bet the Rangers bought them and then went on a mission.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 6 
 on: Today at 03:03:58 PM 
Started by MSG Mac - Last post by CAPDCCMOM
^^^^ If I have to pay for, my room, meal, transportation, and cost for the event, they can as well.

Lead by example. If money is that tight at the Wing level and Squadron level, that we keep hearing about budget cuts for Programs. Then yes, divert their transportation budget and put it back in the Air or on Cadets.

I see no value in sitting and hearing the "Little Yellow Plane Story" for the umpteenth time. Give me real training or real education.

We bring things up and the "leadership" smiles, nods, and tells us how valuable we are. Then back to business as usual.

CAP is 15 years behind in technology, communcations, and we wonder why other agencies won't work with us. That is what needs to be spent on, not a travel budget.

 7 
 on: Today at 02:32:22 PM 
Started by MSG Mac - Last post by FW
^^^Great let's invoke, "This is how we have always done it". That is the knee jerk reaction of an ineffective leader, Learn to Lead, Chapter two or three, not sure which, I dont have a copy in front of me.

That will be the epitaph on the tombstone of Civil Air Patrol in about 20 years when all assets are being liquidated. That whole thought process and  the dinosaurs, are killing this program. Combine that with General Lack of Integrity and people just caring about the numbers game.


Oh well the wake should be great!

So there isn't a valid reason for our leadership to get a travel allowance to attend?

Actually, until the Air Force could no longer provide airlift to our membership, attendance to National Conferences went well over 1000 members.  Some years, closer to 2000 came to enjoy the event.  It would be nice if the BoG and CAP-USAF could find some way of making this happen again; then, maybe more could find "value" in it.  There is value in coming together face to face.  Would there be more value to the membership if CAP made it easier and more affordable to attend?

 8 
 on: Today at 01:31:07 PM 
Started by MSG Mac - Last post by Ned

That's a little disingenuous a very small minority of the rank and file support the conferences by attending.

Really?  "disingenuous"? 

This is a thread about conferences.

Specifically, the CAP summer conference.  When hundreds of members get together for multiple purposes.  I suggest it is a little "disingenuous" to suggest that it is somehow invalid because only a small percentage of the membership attends.  Because that is the norm, not the exception.  The president is speaking at the NRA convention today.  What percentage of NRA members go to their national convention?  (Hint:  less than the percentage of CAP members attending our conference.)  My church meets biennially in a General Assembly.  What percentage of church members do you suppose attend the General Assembly?  (Hint: less than the percentage of CAP members attending our conference.)  Twice in her 35 year career in tech, my wife has been rewarded with a trip to CES in Las Vegas.  What percentage of tech employees do you suppose get to go to CES?  (etc., etc., etc.)

Literally hundreds of our "rank and file members" find enough value to spend thousands of dollars to attend.  Obviously, you and others don't want to go.  Again, it just seems a little mean-spirited that you would tell them they can't go.  Simply because you disagree about how they should spend their own money.  My suggestion is to "let it go," and let your colleagues make their own choices about their money and value received.

It sounds like what you really want to argue about is whether or not the Command Council, BoG, and CSAG should have their meetings at or near the same time as the conference.  That is certainly a worthy discussion, but probably deserves it's own thread.  As I mentioned, both the BoG and CSAG regularly meet by teleconference and, rarely, so does the Command Council.  And they also meet in person.  For which they have a travel budget, pretty much like every other major corporation in the world, including 501C3s like the Red Cross, Scouting, and the Salvation Army.  Reasonable minds can certainly differ about how often governing bodies should meet in person, but ultimately, it is their decision to make.  Ultimately the BoG decides budget items, and so far they see value in funding occasional in-person meetings.  Your disagreement notwithstanding.


 

 9 
 on: Today at 12:52:04 PM 
Started by MSG Mac - Last post by Alaric
We are the rank and file, we should have the say in how our Ivory Tower members use our money, and resources and assets.


Exactly.  The only reason we have conferences is because the rank and file support them by attending.  Literally.  If the "average member" didn't support them, they would not exist.  The "Ivory Tower Leadership" (which I suppose includes me, although I was a squadron-level guy for over 30 years) does not expend resources or assets on conferences.  The membership does.

It just seems a little mean-spirited to suggest that other members who find value in conferences should not be allowed to attend because some members question the value. 

FWIW, I'm headed up to the Pacific Region Conference this evening.  Happy to pay my own expenses, including my hotel, transportation, and meals.  Come by and say hi.

That's a little disingenuous a very small minority of the rank and file support the conferences by attending. Also how can you say the leadership is not expending resources or assets when they are either being paid for or reimbursed for their travel. That money comes from dues and are indeed CAP assets. Once again speaking for myself I don't care how people choose to spend their own money but if the rank and file can pay for their own conferences so can everyone in command. After all they have value right?

 10 
 on: Today at 12:08:45 PM 
Started by MSG Mac - Last post by Ned
We are the rank and file, we should have the say in how our Ivory Tower members use our money, and resources and assets.


Exactly.  The only reason we have conferences is because the rank and file support them by attending.  Literally.  If the "average member" didn't support them, they would not exist.  The "Ivory Tower Leadership" (which I suppose includes me, although I was a squadron-level guy for over 30 years) does not expend resources or assets on conferences.  The membership does.

It just seems a little mean-spirited to suggest that other members who find value in conferences should not be allowed to attend because some members question the value. 

FWIW, I'm headed up to the Pacific Region Conference this evening.  Happy to pay my own expenses, including my hotel, transportation, and meals.  Come by and say hi.

Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 10
CAP Talk  |  Recent Posts


Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP SMF 2.0.13 | SMF © 2016, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.317 seconds with 13 queries.
click here to email me