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 1 
 on: Today at 10:21:57 AM 
Started by TheSkyHornet - Last post by Майор Хаткевич
I've terminated several cadets over attendance over the last year. It's not that big a deal...

Your opinion differs from the organization's:

https://capnhq.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/2704/

Quote
Commanders do have the ability to terminate a cadet's membership if they fail to "progress satisfactorily" in the program. This should be a highly unusual situation and under normal leadership it would only take place as a last resort after an escalating series of mentoring conversations, formal contracts and lesser consequences proved ineffective. As a rule, we want young people to join our program and we believe that they will benefit from the lessons they learn. It's counterproductive to remove this positive influence from a cadet who could benefit from it. Of course, if there are disruptive behaviors or other factors involved, those should be addressed proactively. We would discourage termination in the face of a simple failure to promote on the part of an otherwise motivated cadet.


That's spectacular and all, but these vaunted mentoring sessions can't happen if you can't get them to come back in the first place. Trust me, I'm not cutting them willy-nilly, but I don't have the time to go tracking them down like they went AWOL or something.

Also, I don't work for the help desk. The reg is the governing document here.

I respect the nuanced difference between non-progression and non-attendance; I'm simply suggesting that if you don't have the time to keep track of your people, you might as well leave them as members. Certainly terminating their membership isn't going to inspire them to return, right? My argument is that doing nothing would be preferable to a membership action.

And to your second point, the help desk answer doesn't contradict the regulation. It gives insight that (to me) is more valuable than my own opinion regarding how to conduct the corporation's business.


Quote
CAPR 52-16 a. Expectations of Cadets. Cadets are required to participate actively in their local unit if they are to progress in the Cadet Program. Excessive, unexcused absences may be cause for termination from CAP (see CAPR 35-3, Membership Termination). Any school-related activity is considered an excused absence. Cadets are responsible for informing their leaders in advance if they expect to be absent. School-related absences do not excuse cadets from promotion requirements.


Quote
CAPR 35-3 c. Lack of interest demonstrated by failure to attend three successive regular meetings without an acceptable excuse.

 2 
 on: Today at 10:21:51 AM 
Started by TheSkyHornet - Last post by Jester
The way I look at it: I juggle a full-time course load, a part-time job, a wife and 2 kids, and a leadership position in CAP. I'm there 99.9% of the meetings and probably half of the extra activities if not more. I go to encampment.

If Cadet Snuffy just decides he doesn't want to do CAP anymore and decides to use his crushing varsity kickball schedule as justification, I'll talk to him about it and help him try to figure it out.   I'll work with him as much as I can because I know that like most coaches, Coach Kickball thinks the world revolves around him and his epic contest of skill and guts. I really try, and I do my best.

But if they just stop coming, I'm pretty limited in what I can do. Initially I have the cadet's first line supervisor attempt contact, since they need to learn to get accountability of their people. Then I'll get involved. I never cut them at 3, so technically I'm more lenient than the regulation. Maybe I should get a job at the help desk.

My last step is an email to every address I can associate with that cadet advising them of their status and giving them 30 days to think about it and contact me. I include references to the regulation, and make sure they know that they can contact me at any time and we'll figure out how they can continue if they want to contribute. At the end of the 30 days I make the decision for them. 

They're dragging down the unit with metrics. They're dragging down the cadet leaders who are struggling to keep track of them and the ones who show up. And they're dragging down their teammates who contribute.  The juice isn't worth the squeeze. It's an easy decision at that point.

They get more than enough rope. We have another thread about demotion and how it doesn't really work.  So what's the answer?

 3 
 on: Today at 10:10:14 AM 
Started by Mordecai - Last post by Майор Хаткевич

I think it is still going on, but is more restrictive. There is an age limit (18, I think), so that might have been the issue for the chiropractor.

Personal experience suggests that the age limit might be as low as 14.  That's the age at which you have to provide a full set of fingerprints for green card applications.

Reading the thread confirms my own experience: it's almost always 'individual experiences may vary' depending on when, where and the exact circumstances.


IIRC, 18 is the age cut off for getting citizenship by way of parents. Once a person isn't a minor, they need to do their own process. My mother and I became citizens on the same day, but had to do the paperwork separately due to me being 19 at the time.

 4 
 on: Today at 09:22:57 AM 
Started by TheSkyHornet - Last post by Blanding
I've terminated several cadets over attendance over the last year. It's not that big a deal...

Your opinion differs from the organization's:

https://capnhq.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/2704/

Quote
Commanders do have the ability to terminate a cadet's membership if they fail to "progress satisfactorily" in the program. This should be a highly unusual situation and under normal leadership it would only take place as a last resort after an escalating series of mentoring conversations, formal contracts and lesser consequences proved ineffective. As a rule, we want young people to join our program and we believe that they will benefit from the lessons they learn. It's counterproductive to remove this positive influence from a cadet who could benefit from it. Of course, if there are disruptive behaviors or other factors involved, those should be addressed proactively. We would discourage termination in the face of a simple failure to promote on the part of an otherwise motivated cadet.


That's spectacular and all, but these vaunted mentoring sessions can't happen if you can't get them to come back in the first place. Trust me, I'm not cutting them willy-nilly, but I don't have the time to go tracking them down like they went AWOL or something.

Also, I don't work for the help desk. The reg is the governing document here.

I respect the nuanced difference between non-progression and non-attendance; I'm simply suggesting that if you don't have the time to keep track of your people, you might as well leave them as members. Certainly terminating their membership isn't going to inspire them to return, right? My argument is that doing nothing would be preferable to a membership action.

And to your second point, the help desk answer doesn't contradict the regulation. It gives insight that (to me) is more valuable than my own opinion regarding how to conduct the corporation's business.

 5 
 on: Today at 09:04:31 AM 
Started by TheSkyHornet - Last post by Eclipse
We're also not, or you weren't, talking about non-progression , which is always on the table.

You were discussing not showing up, which the 2b clearly defines as 3 meetings with no valid excuse.

It's difficult to mentor people who don't come to meetings and / or don't respond to their last contact information.

 6 
 on: Today at 08:59:45 AM 
Started by Mordecai - Last post by Brit_in_CAP

I think it is still going on, but is more restrictive. There is an age limit (18, I think), so that might have been the issue for the chiropractor.

Personal experience suggests that the age limit might be as low as 14.  That's the age at which you have to provide a full set of fingerprints for green card applications.

Reading the thread confirms my own experience: it's almost always 'individual experiences may vary' depending on when, where and the exact circumstances.

 7 
 on: Today at 08:43:23 AM 
Started by TheSkyHornet - Last post by Jester
I've terminated several cadets over attendance over the last year. It's not that big a deal...

Your opinion differs from the organization's:

https://capnhq.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/2704/

Quote
Commanders do have the ability to terminate a cadet's membership if they fail to "progress satisfactorily" in the program. This should be a highly unusual situation and under normal leadership it would only take place as a last resort after an escalating series of mentoring conversations, formal contracts and lesser consequences proved ineffective. As a rule, we want young people to join our program and we believe that they will benefit from the lessons they learn. It's counterproductive to remove this positive influence from a cadet who could benefit from it. Of course, if there are disruptive behaviors or other factors involved, those should be addressed proactively. We would discourage termination in the face of a simple failure to promote on the part of an otherwise motivated cadet.


That's spectacular and all, but these vaunted mentoring sessions can't happen if you can't get them to come back in the first place. Trust me, I'm not cutting them willy-nilly, but I don't have the time to go tracking them down like they went AWOL or something.

Also, I don't work for the help desk. The reg is the governing document here.

 8 
 on: Today at 08:14:48 AM 
Started by Mordecai - Last post by coudano
Flown over?

er, flown over and photographed?

Flown over during a general assembly of employee/students?



The answers will dictate things like whether you can get approval.


Ultimately, it will probably be a call to the National Operations Center, but I agree use your wing ops as a first stop.

 9 
 on: Today at 08:06:36 AM 
Started by kcarlson - Last post by Paul Creed III
The National Cadet Cyber Programs team is releasing the CyberPatriot Playbook to help new coaches get started with the program. You can check it out at the link below and feedback is encouraged via the contact information in the document.

http://cap-cyber.org/index.php/resources

 10 
 on: Today at 07:42:23 AM 
Started by TheSkyHornet - Last post by Blanding
I've terminated several cadets over attendance over the last year. It's not that big a deal...

Your opinion differs from the organization's:

https://capnhq.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/2704/

Quote
Commanders do have the ability to terminate a cadet's membership if they fail to "progress satisfactorily" in the program. This should be a highly unusual situation and under normal leadership it would only take place as a last resort after an escalating series of mentoring conversations, formal contracts and lesser consequences proved ineffective. As a rule, we want young people to join our program and we believe that they will benefit from the lessons they learn. It's counterproductive to remove this positive influence from a cadet who could benefit from it. Of course, if there are disruptive behaviors or other factors involved, those should be addressed proactively. We would discourage termination in the face of a simple failure to promote on the part of an otherwise motivated cadet.

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