Airborne Radiological Monitoring

Started by FlyingPig, December 11, 2022, 07:07:40 PM

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SarDragon

Sure. Fly your drone into a contaminated area, and what do you do with a contaminated $1000+ asset? That's a hard nope from me.
Dave Bowles
Maj, CAP
AT1, USN Retired
50 Year Member
Mitchell Award (unnumbered)
C/WO, CAP, Ret

FlyingPig

In 2023, I dont see volunteers being called in to test an area for radiation.  Even when CAP had a mission, I dont think they had a mission.  They got some old 1970s equipment and created a program that was probably obsolete before it ever got off the ground.
Robert Steht, Capt.
Mission Pilot/CD Pilot
CFI Airplane / CFI Helicopter
Former Sq. Commander

Eclipse

Quote from: FlyingPig on January 31, 2023, 02:42:36 PMIn 2023, I dont see volunteers being called in to test an area for radiation.  Even when CAP had a mission, I dont think they had a mission.  They got some old 1970s equipment and created a program that was probably obsolete before it ever got off the ground.

More like the '50s:
https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipOY5WU0Qous4apKnaPL9NOvDNUnGHWsQ0MNsGEBFyY35GDTvaQp3Ns0CyRp54Z8yQ?key=Tlg5a1Npci1nOXpQWXBNVTZMXzEzZk9GR2x1MGdB



I'm reasonably sure the obsolete equipment I sent to another member downstate back in 2010 was the actual
gear in this photo.

As ridiculous as it was to even pretend members would be flying into potentially radioactive areas, and
then decontaminating aircraft afterwards with a garden hose, it's 10-times that today, not to mention that radiation can now be detected from space.

One of the major reasons CAP has zero traction in ES anymore is that its members and leadership are wholly
unrealistic about CAP's place in the universe, its real capabilities, or where it might actually be able to
provide assistance.

"That Others May Zoom"


etodd

Quote from: Eclipse on January 31, 2023, 04:46:20 PMOne of the major reasons CAP has zero traction in ES anymore is that its members and leadership are wholly
unrealistic about CAP's place in the universe, its real capabilities, or where it might actually be able to
provide assistance.

Worth repeating for the folks in the back that didn't see your post.
"Don't try to explain it, just bow your head
Breathe in, breathe out, move on ..."

FlyingPig

Quote from: Eclipse on January 31, 2023, 04:46:20 PM
Quote from: FlyingPig on January 31, 2023, 02:42:36 PMIn 2023, I dont see volunteers being called in to test an area for radiation.  Even when CAP had a mission, I dont think they had a mission.  They got some old 1970s equipment and created a program that was probably obsolete before it ever got off the ground.

More like the '50s:
https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipOY5WU0Qous4apKnaPL9NOvDNUnGHWsQ0MNsGEBFyY35GDTvaQp3Ns0CyRp54Z8yQ?key=Tlg5a1Npci1nOXpQWXBNVTZMXzEzZk9GR2x1MGdB



I'm reasonably sure the obsolete equipment I sent to another member downstate back in 2010 was the actual
gear in this photo.

As ridiculous as it was to even pretend members would be flying into potentially radioactive areas, and
then decontaminating aircraft afterwards with a garden hose, it's 10-times that today, not to mention that radiation can now be detected from space.

One of the major reasons CAP has zero traction in ES anymore is that its members and leadership are wholly
unrealistic about CAP's place in the universe, its real capabilities, or where it might actually be able to
provide assistance.

I wonder if that's a cadet under the wing with the radioactive water pouring down on his head?  Clearly pre-Cadet Protection.
Robert Steht, Capt.
Mission Pilot/CD Pilot
CFI Airplane / CFI Helicopter
Former Sq. Commander

NIN

Quote from: FlyingPig on February 01, 2023, 01:18:36 PMI wonder if that's a cadet under the wing with the radioactive water pouring down on his head?  Clearly pre-Cadet Protection.

When we did CD training as cadets, we poured radioactive water on our heads and liked it!  <harrumph>  Kids these days.

More to the original point, some CAP wings with nuclear power plants in their state have been engaged by their emergency management agency to provide input into their Radiological Emergency Plan.

Speaking for my wing, we suggested 2-3 ways we could assist the state today, with the training and equipment we have, that would result in supporting the ESFs engaged in a response under the REP with minimal exposure (ie. "Not flying right over the site going 'wow, cool glow'."). None of the areas that we'd be assisting in during an incident would be locations that would require dosimetry or KI kits.

We also suggested that we *might* be able to provide some form of aerial radiological monitoring *if* we could get appropriate training and equipment. That would be a much larger conversation around things like the extent of the mission, "carry-aboard" vs specifically equipped aircraft, training from FEMA, etc. That was not very high on the list of things that were likely to happen, though.

But remembering back to my days of CD (*cough* Cold War), even aerial radiological monitoring then wasn't "Welp, lets fly right over 3 Mile Island, see what we can pickup..."  It was flying surveys with sensitive equipment where you could ascertain where radiation levels might be increasing. No need for lead-lined Cessnas...
Darin Ninness, Col, CAP
I have no responsibilities whatsoever
I like to have Difficult Adult Conversations™
The contents of this post are Copyright © 2007-2024 by NIN. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.

Eclipse

Quote from: NIN on February 02, 2023, 09:22:30 PMsome CAP wings with nuclear power plants in their state have been engaged by their emergency management agency to provide input into their Radiological Emergency Plan.

BTDT - Interestingly, my state historically refused to sign the "required" MOU, (every CI there was a note to that effect)  but the state's nuclear agency has a couple pages dedicated to CAP assistance, and regularly would invite CAP to both update the documents as well as participate in table-top exercises. 

They are eye openers if nothing else.

CAP's involvement was limited primarily to airborne support in the OTHER DIRECTION of contamination - checking the evacuation routes from
an effected area. On the CAP side there was zero doctrine about how this would actually work, or what to do with an aircraft after it was involved.

As this was an actual mission with a real agency and legitimate scenarios, the interest from CAP, generally, would make
crickets deafening.  Not once was this sort of response ever incorporated into Evals, and I would be surprised if CAP-USAF was even aware of the connections.

"That Others May Zoom"

etodd

Quote from: Eclipse on February 02, 2023, 10:26:35 PM- checking the evacuation routes from
an effected area.


As we have done recently taking photos of hurricane evac routes.  Well away from the danger. Just checking traffic flows.

But no.  If nukes ever hit the U.S., it would be every man for himself trying to take care of his family. Few "volunteers" would show up.
"Don't try to explain it, just bow your head
Breathe in, breathe out, move on ..."

Fubar

Came across this:

QuoteOver the past several days, the DoE has been flying their rotary wing Aerial Measuring System to scan the metro Phoenix area for background radiation prior to the NFL championship game.

The helicopter, N411DE, is a Bell 412 modified to support the radiological survey, search, and mitigation tasks.

The mission has been completed and the aircraft is back at Nellis AFB.


Holding Pattern

Quote from: PHall on January 27, 2023, 06:40:10 PM
Quote from: Holding Pattern on January 27, 2023, 05:23:29 PMI've had discussions of bringing it back and a radresponder alignment but my last wing commander was the Department of No on so many other things I backburnered it.

I may have to bring that up again soon...


Well before you go to the trouble of bringing it up again you might ask yourself is this a task that CAP can realistically be asked to do and by what agency?


Already done. But right now the only barrier is that all the squadrons in my area are in the midst of Reconstitution. We lost A LOT of qualifications over the COVID period.