How does CAPRAP work

[Tubacap]

I have been searching around to see how CAP Reserve Assistance Program works, with little success.  I was wondering if the membership at large has any experience with it?  Here are some specific questions.

1.  Can an ANG member be eligible?
2.  If they are already filling a duty slot with a reserve or ANG unit, can they do both?
3.  Who is generally the POC?
4.  Is there a limited amount of CAPRAP NCO's per Wing/Region?
5.  Are CAPRAP's CAP members assigned to squadrons as well?
6.  If above is true, do they pay dues?

Thanks!

Will

[arajca]

1. Not sure
2. No
3. The Region Liasion Officer
4. Yes, but it varies
5. CAPRAP's are not CAP members. Their oversight function prohibits this.
6. No.

[RogueLeader]

Not sure about most questions, IIRC but Caprap's are AF-R and are paid by the AF in 4hr blocks.  As to my understanding, they are not CAP members.

[RogueLeader]

CAPRAPS are usually assigned to a wing or region, and have the responsibility to visit all of the squadrons under their "area" in a year.  Does not always happen, from what I have heard.  When I was at in IA043, our area's CapRap lived close by, so he was at our sqdrn almost every week.

[PHall]

I have been searching around to see how CAP Reserve Assistance Program works, with little success.  I was wondering if the membership at large has any experience with it?  Here are some specific questions.

1.  Can an ANG member be eligible?
2.  If they are already filling a duty slot with a reserve or ANG unit, can they do both?
3.  Who is generally the POC?
4.  Is there a limited amount of CAPRAP NCO's per Wing/Region?
5.  Are CAPRAP's CAP members assigned to squadrons as well?
6.  If above is true, do they pay dues?

Thanks!

Will

1. No, it's an Air Force Reserve program.

2. You can do CAPRAP as an additional duty to your normal Reserve duties. You'll just get a few more retirement points.

3. Your Wing's State Director is a good place to start. They can put into contact with your wing's CAPRAP people.

4. They have a manning document just like everybody else.

5. You can not do CAPRAP and be an active CAP member at the same time. You would have to transfer to Patron status.

6. See above.

[mikeylikey]

There is a CAPRAP woman at CAP-USAF HQ.  It is in the directory. 

[Tubacap]

I originally thought it was only a AFRC program as well, but when I looked at the Pacific Region CAPRAP website it includes Guardsmen as well.  http://www.plr.theairbase.com/whatis5.html  It has some interesting information, but I don't know how current it is.

[JCJ]

I have been searching around to see how CAP Reserve Assistance Program works, with little success.  I was wondering if the membership at large has any experience with it?  Here are some specific questions.

1.  Can an ANG member be eligible?
2.  If they are already filling a duty slot with a reserve or ANG unit, can they do both?
3.  Who is generally the POC?
4.  Is there a limited amount of CAPRAP NCO's per Wing/Region?
5.  Are CAPRAP's CAP members assigned to squadrons as well?
6.  If above is true, do they pay dues?

Thanks!

Will

Arkansas Wing has a traditional guardsman AR ANG NCO who does CAPRAP as an additional duty (points only).  It required some coordination between AR ANG, CAP/USAF and AFRC (becasue as noted above it is an AFRC program) but it is possible.  He's a great guy to have around, by the way.  You could call the AR Wing HQ and ask to speak to the state director.  I'm sure he'd give you the blueprint they followed to get it approved.

CAPRAP members cannot be active CAP members.  If you are a CAP member at time of CAPRAP affiliation, you must transfer your CAP membership to patron status until you are no longer a CAPRAPper.  No one really cared about this until someone asked about it, at which time it was determined that simultaneous active membership in CAP and CAPRAP status could be a conflict of interest (due to the oversight responsibiity of CAPRAPpers)

[mikeylikey]

WHAT exactly has a CAPRAP person done for you Squadron lately?  I am just asking because I have only run into 3 of these people in my 15 years in CAP.  They were all driving busses at the Encampments.  How can they help my unit out?  Is it worth tracking them down for things??

[flyguy06]

They are your linkage tothe AIr Force. If you need to visit an Air Force base for a tour the BAse is going to respond to them better than to us. If you need an Orientation flight in an Air Force aircraft like a C-130, they are the goto people.

[Tubacap]

The particular gentelman I have been working with has been outstanding at liasoning between his unit (AFRC) and our unit (CAP) in getting equipment for us.  I would love to return the favor.  He has also offered assistance at the squadron level in whatever he can possibly help in.

[O-Rex]

The purpose of CAPRAPs is to ensure that USAF dollars are being spent properly and safely.  A good one can be a boon to a unit, "greasing the skids" for things like base access, airlifts and USAF assistance to Cadets, etc. 

More importantly, they have an excellent opportunity to 'bring the Air Force' to units that may not be close to a military installation, not to mention bridge the gap between CAP and USAF, which has been perceived by many as widening of-late.

We had a USAFR E-6 some years back that would threaten to shut down training for things like uniform violations, and once made a big scene when there was a delay on a mission takeoff time (pilot needed clarification on an acf logbook discrepancy.)  He got spanked, dissappeared and then briefly resurfaced as a CAP senior member.

Perhaps it's a manpower $$funding$$ issue, but we need more of them: good ones, please.

[RiverAux]

I haven't been terribly impressed by the program.  They seem to occassionally conduct unit visits and tend to play the "Op-for" during some SAREXs, but generally don't seem to do much helpful.  I don't really know how useful they are to the AF on overseeing CAP.  Individually, they are good guys and some of them have even been around long enough to get a good idea of what CAP is and how it works, but thats about it.

As to greasing skids with the AF...thats the job of the State Director. 

[jimmydeanno]

They are your linkage tothe AIr Force. If you need to visit an Air Force base for a tour the BAse is going to respond to them better than to us. If you need an Orientation flight in an Air Force aircraft like a C-130, they are the goto people.

IME this isn't always true...I have had numerous occassions where the CAPRAPs were unable (told no) to get something for us, but on our own we found the channels to go through and got what we wanted (told sure, we can do that for you).  In our area, right now, we will be going on a military orientation flight - the AF Liason for our wing has been uable to get one in years.  We asked the local guard what we needed to do to get one and she said - "how's this date, see you then." That simple.

[Conical]

Tubacap,

  Most of your questions have been answered already, but to confirm them:
1.  ANG members can be attached to CAPRAP for points only, as can members of other reserve units.  If an ANG or Reserve member decides to go that route they must coordinate their activity in CAPRAP with their supervisor/unit commander.
2. See above.
3. The SD or the Region Liaison Office are good first points to ask for the Wing POC (officially known as the WRC, Wing Reserve Coordinator)
4.  In the past there have been no limits on the numbers of CAPRAP members that could be in a wing or region.  The rule of thumb was that they needed to be productive.  That was defined as assisting at meetings, encampments SAR-Ex's etc.  There were promotion limits on the NCO's in that until a few years ago they could not be promoted to E7, 8, or 9.  I understand that has changed and several have made Master or Senior.  The officers didn't have as many restrictions, but very few were ever promoted past Col.. 
5. A CAPRAP member is assigned to a wing through AF channels, they are generally given a list of squadrons in their area to visit and assist.  The number of times they are to visit varies from region to region (or did a while back).  As stated they cannot be active CAP members due to any conflict of intest issues that may arise.
6. No dues

  I've been in four wings and two regions that had CAPRAP.  The support given by these ladies and gentlemen varied for various reasons.  I saw many who, like CAP members, did excellent work at the squadron level.  I have seen several who did exceptional jobs all the way up their ladder, two even sat as Liaison Region Commander when the Air Force could not find replacements for the previous active duty commander when retirement or reassignment rolled around.  I have also seen some clinkers/stinkers who thought the regs were for others.  One of the reasons so few are seen, is that they are required to maintain the same fitness, medical and PME standards, etc as other ANG and Reserve members have to, for no pay, only points.  The points only translate into money at retirement which isn't collectable until age 60.

Hope that helps.

Conical

[Dustoff]

My $0.02 worth

[/quote]

1. No, it's an Air Force Reserve program.

>>>It is part of the Individual Ready Reserve (not Guard)<<<

2. You can do CAPRAP as an additional duty to your normal Reserve duties. You'll just get a few more retirement points.

>>>I've known a few folks who have done just that<<<

3. Your Wing's State Director is a good place to start. They can put into contact with your wing's CAPRAP people.

>>>Or try the Region Liaison Office<<<<

4. They have a manning document just like everybody else.

>>>Actually I'm told that we don't.  If we did, CAP-RAP would be a career field.  It's not, just a duty assignment.<<<

5. You can not do CAPRAP and be an active CAP member at the same time. You would have to transfer to Patron status.

>>>Being anything but a Patron member while in CAP-RAP is prohibited by AFI.  I'm told that there were some serious problems in the past with some folks abusing their power when they were duel-hatted.  Hence the rule.<<<

6. See above.
[/quote]

And part of the reason why you don't see many CAP-RAP folks is that the last I heard, there were only 300 of us total!!  Like CAP units, there seem to be more of us on the east, west, and gulf coasts.  Not so many in the middle.  I am one of two CAP-RAP members for the entire state of Kansas.  The other guy lives about 10 miles from me, so it's hard for us to visit the entire state.  (Drive west for 5 hours Dorothy, and you're still in Kansas)

BTW, my supervisor is female.  She lives about 250 miles away, so if we see each other face-to-face more that twice a year, it's unusual.

Enlisted promotion is capped at Master Sergeant from within.  You can transfer into the program at a higher rank, you just can't promoted higher than Master if you are in the program.

TSgt Jim Laning, CAP-RAP
North Central Liaison Region w/attachment to the Kansas Wing

[Tubacap]

Are you category I or E?  This gentleman would do it as a category E.

[Dustoff]

There are only 2 Reserve categories available in the CAP-RAP program.  CAT B and CAT E.  Most of the CAT B slots are converting to CAT E slots in FY2008.  The AF is slotting the CAT B positions for "critical" AFSC's.  Most of CAP-RAP doesn't qualify. 

Not sure what a CAT I is....

On a related note, I looked back over some of the other discussions in this thread.  It appears to me that some folks are confusion the role of the CAP-RAP reservists with the Liaison Region staff. 

Each Liaison Region has a small active duty component (CC, DO, DT, & LG) along with some civilian support staff and the State Directors.

The reserve side of the house has a senior AF officer as the Reserve Forces director (RF), a deputy RF, and Wing Reserve Coordinators (WRC's) - one for each state. (Though KS and MO both share the same WRC, they also share the same SD)

The CAP-RAP reservists work directly for the WRC's, though they coordinate with the acitve duty and civilian side of the house, and sometimes get taskings directly from them.  We are all one big happy family, though sometimes the lines of authority get a little fuzzy.  My WRC writes my EPR.

Our duties (a quoted from AFI 10-2701)

3.1.2.4. Category E, Participating Individual Ready Reservists (PIRR). These reservists
assist the CAP-USAF liaison offices in advising, assisting and motivating CAP personnel in the
CAP mission to include instruction, speaking to civic groups, assisting inspection of various CAP
activities and resources, assisting in the formulation of various operational plans, supporting CAP
Cadet events, and other duties as directed by CAP-USAF.

I hope this clarifies some things.

TSgt Laning

[Tubacap]

Outstanding, Thanks a lot!

[Skyray]

This thread has brought up more questions for me than it has answered.  Unfortunately, the one person who could answer them definitively has passed on.  He was a retired Air Force Captain who retired with twenty with substantial enlisted service.  He served as CAP-RAP in my area, and was extremely helpful.  Since he was already retired, I just postulated that he was not working for points, but was really interested in the program.  The other mystery was that he wore three stripes (no rocker) and not the Captain Bars that he should have been entitled to.  After I got canned from CAP, I ran into him frequently at the Coast Guard Station, since his real life job was with ICE and he was one of the original RIVER RATS.  I was not a river rat, but a great deal of my efforts with the Coast Guard Auxiliary after I crossed over involved Marine Safety Patrols on the Miami River so we ran into each other frequently.