Civil Air Patrol access to Air Force (and perhaps all DoD) bases

[Nick]

PREFACE DISCLAIMER: This is not a continuation of the "Base Security" topic, nor is it a forum for tossing out hairbrained ideas or arguing about what CAP "should" get with respect to base access. This is intended as a factual report of an actually happening issue and for realistic discussion.

This story hit the news a couple weeks ago:

12/16/2009 - LACKLAND AIR FORCE BASE, Texas -- The registration process for an enhanced Department of Defense identity authentication and force protection system starts Jan. 11 at Lackland.

Following squadron registration, which could take several months, Department of Defense employees, long-term contractors and retirees will register. Registering the base populous will last four to six months.

To register in DBIDS, a Common Access Card or other DoD-issued identification card is scanned into the system. The cardholder's information is verified and an electronic fingerprint is taken. SFS officials expect the process to take about five minutes a person, the time dependent on how much information has to be entered.

All active duty, family members, DoD contractors and retirees - anyone with permanent base access - will have to register into the Lackland DBIDS system. DBIDS will also require a criminal history check on personnel entering military installations. In the coming months, DBIDS will be installed at all visitor gates and contractor passes will require registration into the system.

DBIDS enhances installation security and improves force protection. It allows a gate guard to use a hand-held wireless scanner on the bar codes of CACs and DBIDS issued credentials. The scanners will instantly identify who the person is and whether or not they're allowed on base.

In addition to providing personal information at the point of entry, DBIDS will notify guards about lost or stolen ID cards, persons barred from the base, or persons being sought by their commander for an emergency or key response notification.

So, what is this doing for Civil Air Patrol members?  They are, for lack of a better term, categorized as "long-term visitors" on military installations for as long as their CAP membership remains current.  The CAP ID card is unsatisfactory for base access because 1) it's not DoD issued, and 2) the bar codes on military IDs is a base-24 conversion of the member's EDIPI, which CAP members do not have, so the cards can't be scanned ... which means they will need a visitor's pass issued.  How are they going to be vetted, because right now CAP member access is a local base policy, and DBIDS requires DoD-wide standardization of authenticating the person and validating their access... a lot like what DMDC did when CAC cards started getting issued.  Worse yet, how about visiting CAP members that show up at a new base at 7:00pm on a meeting night to get to that base's squadron ... is a CAP member going to be permitted to sponsor that visiting member?

Now, Lackland is just starting to go live with DBIDS... but other installations have been using it for up to and over a year now.  Has anyone had experience with this?  How was the experience?  What has the arrangement been between the tenant squadron and host base for processing its members?  Bueler?

[Rotorhead]

Peterson AFB in Colorado's had DBIDS for something like a year. Yes, you need it for access.

I have a CAP-authorized DBIDS card myself. No big deal. Took 10 mins to get it and it works just fine.

Visitors need prior authorization.

[Spike]

Sounds like CAP-USAF needs to do thier job.  Time for a determination on what CAP is, how we are used, what access we have, what our ID Cards need to be and what support the Air Force will provide to CAP members.

Fort Dix scans CAC's.  For those without a CAC or "entry card", you wait in line at the visitor center and have to be sponsored through.  Fort Knox is in the process of rolling this out, as well as other Army installations.  This is the future......and I beleive that CAP will be left behind and eventaully forced off military installations all together. 

[Nick]

I agree about CAP-USAF.

Wow, that must be new -- I was at Dix in December and they hadn't started yet.  Fortunately, from what I've seen, visitor centers will issue CAP members a long-term visitor pass through their CAP ID expiration date... so once you get one pass issued (with the barcode), you'll be good each time after.  But, getting through the first time is the trick -- gotta have a sponsor, and who will that be: the member's ID card, a trusted CAP agent, an EAL furnished by the local squadron and authenticated by SFS, the base CAP liaison, wing LO.  That's my concern.

[sarmed1]

Ft Dix uses the handheld scanner...McGuire does not, still MK I eyeball verification by SFS.

mk

[CASH172]

I just went through less than a week ago and McGuire was guarded by DoD police without a scanner.  I understand the duty switches between SFS and DoD police depending on the time of day now.  I haven't used the Dix gate in a while, but I've never had to go get a visitor's pass.  They did scan CACs for those who had them, but they also scanned my driver's license and CAPID. 

[Nick]

Yeah, I deployed with a guy who's a DoD police officer (not guard) there and I had a chance to talk with him while I was there last month.  It's one massive Joint Base Dix-McGuire-Lakehurst security forces division (McGuire's SFS inherited the personnel and resources from Dix and Lakehurst), the civilian PO/SF/MP/MAs get intermingled in all the posts, and then the guards man the gates... so what they're doing on one side of the base should be identical to what's happening on the other side of the base.

[CAPSGT]

Andrews has had handheld scanners for a while now.  When I go I still just show my CAPID and Driver's License.  Sometimes they scan the driver's license, sometimes they don't.  I've never had to get any sort of visitor's pass or anything.

[Stonewall]

I wonder if anything discussed in this thread could be considered an OPSEC violation.

How easy/difficult it is to get on [insert base here] and what is needed.

Just sayin',

[Eclipse]

I wonder if anything discussed in this thread could be considered an OPSEC violation.

How easy/difficult it is to get on [insert base here] and what is needed.

Just sayin',

We keep saying that, and people keep making these threads.

General interest aside, few, if anyone on CAP-Talk is going to be able to do anything other than gnash teeth about issues, and in all cases the local SD is going to be the first, best, place to ask for help.

[Spike]

^ It is not an OPSEC issue at all.  It is common knowledge anyone can get from visiting most installations public websites.  They usually give day/time info on gates open/closed and what gate visitors enter and what you need to get on an installation.

[Eclipse]

^ Great, then people can get the info off the gates or other more direct sources.

No one here can influence or change the situation, regardless of what it is.

This isn't a discussion board directly related to the military, per se.

CAP access to military resources is a benevolent situation that is precarious enough without these discussions making it worse.

99.9% of the people who talk about this stuff are also posting on forums directly related to the military, so why bring it here?

[Spike]

^ What?!?!

Please provide a list of what issues we are allowed to discuss on CAPTALK.  This topic may have no relevance to you, but to others it does. 

[NCRblues]

I agree with eclipse on this one (which is so very rare! )

Each and every base gets too decided how why and who enters their base, and cap just does not have the pull or power to change any of it. It is pretty simple (almost too imho) to get on a base as it is; it just takes a little planning ahead with the right people like your SD's.

Saying I was taught in tech school, "prior planning prevents poor performance for both parties"

[desertengineer1]

As I've posted in similar threads....  This has nothing really to do with CAP at all.  We are guests on installations as approved by the installation commanders.  Procedures for access to military installations by our members is really slightly higher than local members of 4H clubs coming on base to do fundraisers.  You still have to get approved per established procedures.  Yes, you have MCSS priviledges, but that is by the grace of the installation commander.  They have final say.

Government issued ID cards are a completely different category.  They are issued to individuals who have a mission (you work there) or entitlement (retiree/dependant) status.

Again....  We are guests on military installations as volunteers, and whatever level of access we are blessed to have will always be determined by mission relevance.  Beyond that, it is essentially kindness.

[desertengineer1]

I've seen nothing posted on this forum that isn't available through af.mil public web sites, AF regulations, or something that any pass and ID or SFS squadron will tell you by phone.

You do not obtain access on an installation without approval by the installation commander.  If you need or desire access, refer to the local procedures of that installation.  Some are strict.  Others are lenient (example: Pensacola NAS).  All have openly published access procedures.

[desertengineer1]

Just read the recent locked thread on basic access. 

All I see is someone posting some story about some guy somewhere, and the story is questionable at best. 

The base I work on has civilian guards.  They are respectful and courtious. 

But whether you are an officer or an airman, to demand a certain level of treatment to a civilian because of your military status is crossing a line.  YOU are the one in uniform that everyone sees first, and therefore establish the judged standard of conduct by your actions, and most importantly, your reactons.

I am saddened when I see such posts.  Whether they are true or not, they do not help the perception of CAP by those whom we have pledged to serve, and give us resources to execute the missions that we do well.

Rest assured, complaints of improper conduct by members in our squadron and wing are taken seriously.

When I was a squadron commander, I would have not hesitated to recommend a 2B for someone who "just didn't get it" with respect to such conduct.  We do not have latitude for loose cannons.  I can think of few incidents with worse long term damage than these (other than the obvious ones like cadet protection or overt criminal acts)

[flyguy06]

Idont think anyOPSEC issues are being violated here. All this is common and public knowledge.

[Rotorhead]

I wonder if anything discussed in this thread could be considered an OPSEC violation.

How easy/difficult it is to get on [insert base here] and what is needed.

Just sayin',

No. As usual, there's nothing OPSEC-sensitive here, despite the standard hopefullness that we might be that important.

[Nick]

Actually, I believe my initial direct question was "how has this affected various CAP members' access to their bases", and since installation access controls are being "standardized" across the DoD through DBIDS, I wanted to see what the "on-the-streets" implications have been.