Conferences

[Cecil DP]

It's aboutthat time when we start getting information about the National Conference, this year it's in Kissimmee, FL. When can someone plan a conference that doesn't cost an arm and leg to attend?  This year's rates are $134/night. This doesn't include $90 for the conference and $70 for the banquet. So if you arrive on Thursday and depart sunday. It's about $600, not including airfare. 
Has anyone ever considered using a college facilities during the summer break. They obviously would have conference facilities, dorm rooms, and anything else needed.   

[Eclipse]

When you're trying to look like a professional organization, soliciting donations from national charities, and "competing" with agencies that have very deep pockets, cheaping out on the venue is a bad idea.

A lot of people use the conference as their annual vacation destination, so it just becomes an extension of costs already scheduled.

While $600 is nothing to sneeze at, in this day and age, its not really a lot for what is really a business trip.

I'll spend at least 1/2 that in two weeks for our guided training event, and will get nothing but the warm glow of success and some receipts for my 2009 tax return.

Sharing a room is a good way to cut your costs in half.

[FW]

^So true.  I went to my Professional Association's annual Conf. in San Fransico last year.  Not counting the continuing education courses I attended (at $150-300/course), it cost me $1800 for transportation, lodging and food.  Registration was $100.  BUT, my annual dues are $1450.  And, all I get for that is a magazine, newsletter and free registration to a few state and local conferences. 

So, considering those prices.  The CAP conference is cheap.

[badger bob]

It's aboutthat time when we start getting information about the National Conference, this year it's in Kissimmee, FL. When can someone plan a conference that doesn't cost an arm and leg to attend?  This year's rates are $134/night.

I will be at the same hotel next week for a buisness conference. The conference rate is $189 per night for a group expecting a 1000 or so hotel rooms for 3 or 4 nights. A very nice hotel, but to close to Disney to get the really cheap corporate/government rates.  A $55 discount from the hotels going convention  rate seems like the CAP staff did a good job of keeping the room rates down. Could also be that the buisness conference planners are getting a lot more bennies then CAP is.

[SDF_Specialist]

Yep, couldn't agree more with this one. The conferences are so expensive. Why is that? Why can't CAP set something up that is affordable for all members rather than those who are financially privilaged? I personally would never even consider spending $100 a night because that's simply money I don't have.


Anyone out there in NHQ land? Please arrange conferences that are more affordable!! Help everyone who wants to attend, but can't due to financial reasons!!

[sardak]

For comparison:
National Association for Search and Rescue (NASAR) 2008 Conference (Colorado Springs)
4 days long, so need 5 nights @ $89/night (excluding taxes)
Conference fees
members $195 to $265 (early to late registration)
non-members $245 to $315
Included in fees - snack break x2 each day
So for a member who registers early, base cost is $640.

International Technical Rescue Symposium (ITRS) 2008 Conference (Albuquerque)
2 1/2 days long, so need 3 nights @ $92/night (excluding taxes)
Conference fees
members of sponsoring groups* - $235 to $280 (early to late registration)
non-members - $300 to $345
Included in fees - hot breakfast buffet x3 days, snack break x2 each day, dinner one night
So for a member who registers early, base cost is $511.
*Sponsors are the Mountain Rescue Association, American Alpine Club, National Cave Rescue Commission, Society for Professional Rope Access Technicians, NASAR.

So the CAP conference is "reasonable" by comparison, but $70 for the banquet?!
Are any of these inexpensive? No way.  It's a fact of life that conferences are going to price themselves out of existence.  Volunteers can't afford them.

The shameless plug for a less expensive option, with national instructors, Colorado SAR Conference in Gunnison. (http://www.sarcon.org)
2 1/2 days long, so need 3 nights
Conference fee - $60
Full up package including conference fee, 3 nights lodging, 7 hot meals - $259 single occupancy,  $199 double occupancy.  Add $75 for late registration.  RV and tent camping available on campus.
The conference is held on the campus of Western State College.  Lodging is in the dorms, meals in the school cafeteria.  Several national chain motels and airport (KGUC) within waaaalking distance.

Mike

[SDF_Specialist]

My complaint is a lot of the big events for CAP such as Encampments, NESA, National Conferences and other things are expensive to attend for some members. I've always wondered why CAP doesn't pick up some of the tab, but I've had many explanations about that. I understand that we are a non-profit organizations, but what is NHQ doing with the membership dues we send each year (or two or three years)? These things would be a blow out if they were more affordable.

[SarDragon]

The money has to come from somewhere, and it's not going to be the AF. Dues go to NHQ, your region and your wing to fund the cost of operation. I'm not very inclined to pay more dues for subsidizing conferences. You want to go, budget for it through the year so you have the funds available.

[jb512]

My wife and I are dropping about $300 for the TXWG conference this weekend, but are using it as a mini vacation.  The kids are going to be dropped off with friends, and we're staying at the host hotel from Friday to Sunday.  We'll spend both evenings in the bar and she'll get to lounge in the room all day Saturday while I rub elbows.

[FW]

My complaint is a lot of the big events for CAP such as Encampments, NESA, National Conferences and other things are expensive to attend for some members. I've always wondered why CAP doesn't pick up some of the tab, but I've had many explanations about that. I understand that we are a non-profit organizations, but what is NHQ doing with the membership dues we send each year (or two or three years)? These things would be a blow out if they were more affordable.

Actually, we do budget some money for the annual conference which keeps the costs down a little.   We also get a fee from our exhibitors which helps too.  

Our membership dues ($45 seniors/$35 cadets) goes for seed money to NCSAs, scholarships to cadets, and programs not paid for from our grant.  

Yes, we pay more to attend these events.  And, yes, they aren't cheap.  But, they are enjoyable, educational and a great experience for those who take advantage of them.

IMHO, they are well worth the cash.

Shameless plug for the '09 annual conference:  San Antonio, TX.  Riverwalk Marriott.

[SDF_Specialist]

Maybe the wife and I have to talk about a rainy day fund for CAP conferences.

[jimmydeanno]

As with most things in CAP the COs usually miss the whole point of a conference/banquet for a non-profit organization.  That is to invite leaders of other groups, grant organizations, local government leaders, etc to drum up more business and funding, etc.

Most non-profits use their conferences and banquets as fund raising events - so after the fee to attend they hit you up for/expect more money to roll in after the event.

I really don't care what the fee is, what drives me crazy is that we are subsidizing it and losing money on them with our membership dues.  Once you get the "high profile" people to get in the habit of supporting your organization, you can drop the conference fee a bit because you'll know you will get it back in donations.

Heck, if the conference isn't going to be used as a fund raising event, hold another event prior to it for the purpose of helping fund the conference.  Many smaller non-profits (and some larger) hold a single fundraising event throughout the year and raise anywhere from 1/3 to all of the annual operating budget.

EXAMPLE 1 - Golf Tournament
EXAMPLE 2 - Dance (BTW someone also won $10K at this fund raising event)
EXAMPLE 3 - Banquet
EXAMPLE 4 - Dance Competition
EXAMPLE 5 - Banquet

[FW]

I really don't care what the fee is, what drives me crazy is that we are subsidizing it and losing money on them with our membership dues.  Once you get the "high profile" people to get in the habit of supporting your organization, you can drop the conference fee a bit because you'll know you will get it back in donations.

Heck, if the conference isn't going to be used as a fund raising event, hold another event prior to it for the purpose of helping fund the conference.  Many smaller non-profits (and some larger) hold a single fundraising event throughout the year and raise anywhere from 1/3 to all of the annual operating budget.




The main purpose of the annual conference is the meeting of the National Board and for the education and get together of the members  for the purpose of the advancement of the membership.  Our profile, not as high as we would like, still is high enough for some "heavy hitters" to support us.

Our annual conference breaks even when all things are counted up.  We do receive money from other sources than dues.   

[Pylon]

$70 for a formal banquet is not much in comparison.

Later this month, I'm going to a formal dinner ball where the seats cost $350 each.  I help put together an awards dinner for the organization I work for where seats are $125 each (and it's not a "black tie" event, either).   And that's about the average range for banquets/galas/dinner functions in our area and we're a third-tier city.


So $70?  Not bad by comparison.

[O-Rex]

My complaint is a lot of the big events for CAP such as Encampments, NESA, National Conferences and other things are expensive to attend for some members. I've always wondered why CAP doesn't pick up some of the tab, but I've had many explanations about that. I understand that we are a non-profit organizations, but what is NHQ doing with the membership dues we send each year (or two or three years)? These things would be a blow out if they were more affordable.

NESA and special acts are relatively inexpensive: where else can you go and get lodging, food and valuable training for a couple of hundred bucks?

Sending a Cadet to special acts for a week costs less than what I pay to take my family to Disney World for a day.

Have you ever seen the cost of sending a kid to a sleep-away camp?  Talk about sticker shock!

conferences: When I go to a three-day annual conference for my day-job, it costs my company about $2K, including airfare.

CAP activities are still quite a bang for the buck.

[SDF_Specialist]

Oh I believe that they are a bang for my buck. Training like that? Why not? All I'm saying is that for those who do want to attend, but can't due to financial reasons, why can't something be done to help reduce teh cost?

[stillamarine]

conferences: When I go to a three-day annual conference for my day-job, it costs my company about $2K, including airfare.

Here's the point. I imagine you also get paid during that time. For me I have to take 3-4 days off work to attend national conference. Plus paying for it. Let's hope I have vacation time saved up. If not add the loss of pay to the accumulated cost. Many many Americans are lucky if they get 1 week (40) hours of vacation. So let me go ahead and use that little bit of time I get and spend it sitting in seminars.

This goes for any national activity.

Encampment this year. 14-21 June. 9 days I'll take off work. Unpaid. My vacation doesn't reset until September. I made a commitment to my cadets though. On top of that the encampment fee is $150. (I have heard a rumor that it will be half that for staff but have had no confirmation....) Not sure about food, I ASSUME it is included. Transportation there...car pool with other members. The whole reason I am going to AL/MS Wings encampment, the added cost for me to make it to Gainsville for FL's is not worth it. Not in today's time with fuel prices what they are.

One day I'd like to go to some of the other activities such as NBB, NESA, heck even Hawk but gotta win the lotto first lol.

[BigMojo]

Has anyone ever considered using a college facilities during the summer break. They obviously would have conference facilities, dorm rooms, and anything else needed.   

Embry-Riddle in Daytona would be the perfect choice...
http://flwg.us/database/database/news.asp?action=print&article=521&category=

[davedove]

conferences: When I go to a three-day annual conference for my day-job, it costs my company about $2K, including airfare.

Here's the point. I imagine you also get paid during that time.

Unfortunately, all those who provide conference facilities are set up for the business conferences, that are paid for by the businesses.  That's who the prices are set for, and CAP has to compete with that.

[O-Rex]

Sorry, my post 'timed out'

My comment regarding my work conference was really about cost: yes, I get paid regardless as a salaried employee.

Dealing with folks at different echelons of CAP, I know that they try to leverage relationships and numbers of attendees when planning and negotiating conferences.

[FW]

The conference planners at NHQ, when selecting a venue for the annual conference, look for convenience to transportation, downtown area, and outside activities.  Of course they look for the best value and price.  This is why most of our conferences are held in airline transport hubs, vacation destinations, and large cities.  In Reno, we kept the cost of registration and banquet to $95 and only 700 members attended.  The year before, in St. Louis, we had more than 850 and it cost  about $50 more.  At the '02 Conf. in Phila. it cost about $140 for both and over 1200 showed up.  It's hard to explain the numbers and it's hard to figure out who's going to attend.

Disney World isn't a bad place to take the family and the costs are comparable to any other area vacation.

[cnitas]

So, as the conference moves west the numbers fall off.
Perhaps it is a function of population/membership density of the chosen areas?

[FW]

I think that's true.  However, when we have a conf. in Las Vegas, the numbers are high also.  One of the main factors limiting our attendance, IMHO, is lack of airlift.  When we were able to arrange for AF flights, numbers improve greatly.

[davedove]

So, as the conference moves west the numbers fall off.
Perhaps it is a function of population/membership density of the chosen areas?

I think that's true.  However, when we have a conf. in Las Vegas, the numbers are high also.  One of the main factors limiting our attendance, IMHO, is lack of airlift.  When we were able to arrange for AF flights, numbers improve greatly.

I think that's true as well.  The center of population in the US is either in Missouri or Indiana, depending on whether you use the mean or the median, but either is in the eastern half of the US.

Las Vegas could be an anomaly because you can generally get cheap flights there (they want your money ).

[badger bob]

Just back from 3 days at the Gaylord Palms at a buisness conference.

Nice convention venue. Huge convention space- CAP will probably only use half of the available space.

Nice sized rooms, very quite. All of the expected room amenities for this price range including a guest computer in each room , plus both wired and wireless internet.

Good space design to handle large groups of people. I used to be in the hotel buisness in a prior life.

[Duke Dillio]

My only point would be to make it a more central location.  How about Denver or Colorado Springs?  That way you don't stiff people on one coast to have your conference on the far side of the country.  Hold it in Kansas City.  Why is it always like Florida or Las Vegas?

[SarDragon]

My only point would be to make it a more central location.  How about Denver or Colorado Springs?  That way you don't stiff people on one coast to have your conference on the far side of the country.  Hold it in Kansas City.  Why is it always like Florida or Las Vegas?

They cater to tourists, and give better "deals".

[FW]

My only point would be to make it a more central location.  How about Denver or Colorado Springs?  That way you don't stiff people on one coast to have your conference on the far side of the country.  Hold it in Kansas City.  Why is it always like Florida or Las Vegas?

We've had conferences in Denver, Cincinnati, San Antonio and St. Louis;  all more geographically central locations.  Denver, if I remember correctly, had great participation.  San Antonio has been a good draw too.  That's why we've had it there a few times over the last 10 years or so.

[Chappie]

The conference planners at NHQ, when selecting a venue for the annual conference, look for convenience to transportation, downtown area, and outside activities.  Of course they look for the best value and price.  This is why most of our conferences are held in airline transport hubs, vacation destinations, and large cities.  In Reno, we kept the cost of registration and banquet to $95 and only 700 members attended.  The year before, in St. Louis, we had more than 850 and it cost  about $50 more.  At the '02 Conf. in Phila. it cost about $140 for both and over 1200 showed up.  It's hard to explain the numbers and it's hard to figure out who's going to attend.

Disney World isn't a bad place to take the family and the costs are comparable to any other area vacation.

IMHO the low attendance at Reno was an anomaly....there were many (including myself) who were sick of the shenanigans at the National Level and stayed home.  Reno is in my region...and I had initially planned to go...however, prior to the Conference there were events that took place that left a sour taste in my mouth.  Rather than spend $ and burn vacation time on the books to attend the National Conference, my wife and I had enjoyed a wonderful weekend getaway.   What do you know? There is life outside CAP 

[RiverAux]

As someone who attends lots of conferences for work, I would advise anyone on a budget to NOT stay at the conference hotel.  Chances are that you can find a relatively inexpensive national chain motel not fair away for half the price or less.  You may have to get up a bit earlier to have to drive to where the conference is and it is definetely less convenient, but it can save you a lot of bucks. 

[BillB]

In late February, a Reunion of former Florida Wing cadets from the 1940's to 1990 was held in Kissimmee. On the balcany of the hospitality room we could see the Conference hotel just a mile or less away. The Reunion was set up by a foirmer cadet who is now trying to organize a Squadron which will hold meetings the The Kissimmee Airport just a couple of miles from the Hotel. She operates a business that includes travel agent. The Holiday Inn Main enterence West was the site of the reunion and the rate was about $30 a night lower than the conference hotel willbe

[TexasBubba]

National Conferences rotate to the 8 Regions. This is by design. Since it does rotate, it garantees that a member will at least have a conference in their region once every 8 years. Transportation costs will always be an issue for a National Conference unless you're within driving distance for the location.

I've been to Reno, San Antonio, St Louis, and Philly National Conferences. All were professionally run, provided excellent information, and were a great opporuntiy to meet other members of CAP. Are they expensive? Yes. Are the worth the money spent? Yes. If money is an issue, then wait a few years and go to a National Conference when it's hosted by your Region.

The 2009 conference will be hosted by SWR and will be held in San Antonio. Save your nickels and dimes and travel to "God's Country" in 2009.

Best Regards,

TexasBubba

[FW]

^For some reason, we don't rotate around the regions anymore. SER was host for '04, 07, 08.  Maybe the rotation will begin with '09.  That would be a good thing. 
Anyway, I do plan to be sipping Margarita's on the River Walk in '09.

[Chappie]

^For some reason, we don't rotate around the regions anymore. SER was host for '04, 07, 08.  Maybe the rotation will begin with '09.  That would be a good thing. 
Anyway, I do plan to be sipping Margarita's on the River Walk in '09.

PCR was host in '03 (Las Vegas) and '06 (Reno)...what are the odds that '10 or '11 might be in PCR??? 

[davidsinn]

When was the last time that it was in GLR?

[SAR-EMT1]

 May I ask why they arent just held in either the Washington DC area or at
Maxwell-Gunter  each year?

[Cecil DP]

May I ask why they arent just held in either the Washington DC area or at
Maxwell-Gunter  each year?

The last time they had it in DC they had a problem at the last minute with the hotel union. Seems everything that comes in or out of the hotels had to be done by the local union and it cost the conference a lot of money at the last minute. BTW they had several  in DC in the 80's and 90's

National Conferences rotate to the 8 Regions. This is by design. Since it does rotate, it garantees that a member will at least have a conference in their region once every 8 years. Transportation costs will always be an issue for a National Conference unless you're within driving distance for the location.

NER has had only two in the last 30 years. 1976 and 2004, Both in Philly. 

[FW]

When was the last time that it was in GLR?

Cincinnati was in '01.

We hold the winter NB in Washington D.C. every March to coincide with CAP legislative day and anual Spaatz Association banquet.

Maxwell isn't easy to get to.  We don't even use it for NEC meetings anymore.

Maybe back to Denver in '10?

[mikeylikey]

Perhaps the Air Force could host these things.  You know at a super huge Air Force Base.