Cadets in Oct.-Dec. 2010 "Volunteer"

[EMT-83]

Not to mention that parents do not "determine what is or isn't a CAP activity".

it either is, or it isn't.  A distracted/confused/misinformed parent's understanding isn't really relevant.

That had me a little confused as well.

Locally, we have no problem with figuring out if an activity is CAP or not. Any activity other than a regular squadron meeting requires a permission slip signed by the parent, or the cadet doesn't attend.

[C/MSgt Lunsford]

Hey cadets, are kids that want to play army, so why not let them paint their faces, etc -- No real harm done!
RM

Respectfully, I don't know what your ultimate impression of why Cadets join CAP, but I joined Civil Air Patrol to be of civilian service to my country. Not to play army.

Just to put my two cents in, If a Cadet decides to put camouflage facepaint during an exercise, so be it. They are not breaking any uniform regulations.

[manfredvonrichthofen]

Hey cadets, are kids that want to play army, so why not let them paint their faces, etc -- No real harm done!
RM

Respectfully, I don't know what your ultimate impression of why Cadets join CAP, but I joined Civil Air Patrol to be of civilian service to my country. Not to play army.

Just to put my two cents in, If a Cadet decides to put camouflage facepaint during an exercise, so be it. They are not breaking any uniform regulations.

Besides isn't there a stipulation in the regulations that says that an activity director can modify the uniform for the activity? So long as no one wears the paint out side of the activity then nothing is wrong at all.

Also, Radioman, were you a cadet?

[C/MSgt Lunsford]

Hey cadets, are kids that want to play army, so why not let them paint their faces, etc -- No real harm done!
RM

Respectfully, I don't know what your ultimate impression of why Cadets join CAP, but I joined Civil Air Patrol to be of civilian service to my country. Not to play army.

Just to put my two cents in, If a Cadet decides to put camouflage facepaint during an exercise, so be it. They are not breaking any uniform regulations.

Besides isn't there a stipulation in the regulations that says that an activity director can modify the uniform for the activity? So long as no one wears the paint out side of the activity then nothing is wrong at all.

Also, Radioman, were you a cadet?

I am not exactly sure, since it has be about 6 months since I have read the dreaded 39-1, but I think you are correct. But don't quote me on that.

[Eclipse]

Besides isn't there a stipulation in the regulations that says that an activity director can modify the uniform for the activity?

No, there is not.

[manfredvonrichthofen]

Besides isn't there a stipulation in the regulations that says that an activity director can modify the uniform for the activity?

No, there is not.

Oh, ok, then I guess the orange tshirt during ES operations isn't allowed, nor is CAWG requiring that anyone participating in ES Operations must wear the BBDU is against regulation then.

Also if wearing a bright orange cap for the headgear instead of the BDU cap is ok every week, then why not a little face paint for a couple hours in the middle of the field or woods?

[Eclipse]

Oh, ok, then I guess the orange tshirt during ES operations isn't allowed, nor is CAWG requiring that anyone participating in ES Operations must wear the BBDU is against regulation then.

What orange T-Shirt?  There's nothing like that which is prescribed or even approved at the national level.

For any uniform change to be "legal", it has to be incorporated in a supplement approved by NHQ, not simply dictated by a local CC or activity director.  The CAWG supplement was at one point rescinded - no idea what it's status iis today.

Hats are more gray because there is some allowance as to local squadron hats, etc.

[manfredvonrichthofen]

Hats are more gray because there is some allowance as to local squadron hats, etc.

That is my biggest peeve, why in the world would a bright orange hat with big shiny black numbers ironed on (poorly) be allowed? Yet a small thing such as face paint at a unit activity throws up a red flag and everyone goes nutso. Is there a regulation against facepaint?

Also, I hope that CAWG regulation is gone, I was thinking of moving to CA but that was one of my biggest turn offs for moving out there.

[Ned]

Also, I hope that CAWG regulation is gone, I was thinking of moving to CA but that was one of my biggest turn offs for moving out there.

Uniforms are a tool to help us get our missions done.

Nothing more, nothing less.

The incredibly professional volunteers in CAWG consistently put up some of the best ES numbers, aircraft utilization rates, and CP statistics in the country.

If your choice of real-world living arrangements revolve around CAP uniform choices, I am just . . . speechless.

Ned Lee

[manfredvonrichthofen]

Also, I hope that CAWG regulation is gone, I was thinking of moving to CA but that was one of my biggest turn offs for moving out there.

Uniforms are a tool to help us get our missions done.

Nothing more, nothing less.

The incredibly professional volunteers in CAWG consistently put up some of the best ES numbers, aircraft utilization rates, and CP statistics in the country.

If your choice of real-world living arrangements revolve around CAP uniform choices, I am just . . . speechless.

Ned Lee

It doesn't, I am more interested in the program and missions, but the BBDU IMHO looks rather unprofessional. The nametapes don't match the uniform color, and I can't seem to find one that doesn't fade extremely fast.

[JohnKachenmeister]

Hats are more gray because there is some allowance as to local squadron hats, etc.

That is my biggest peeve, why in the world would a bright orange hat with big shiny black numbers ironed on (poorly) be allowed? Yet a small thing such as face paint at a unit activity throws up a red flag and everyone goes nutso. Is there a regulation against facepaint?

Also, I hope that CAWG regulation is gone, I was thinking of moving to CA but that was one of my biggest turn offs for moving out there.

CA is not allowed to wear AF uniforms on SAR missions.  The presence of military uniforms offends Code Pink.

[manfredvonrichthofen]

Let it be known that I have nothing against those who their uniform allowed is BBDU, I just have an issue with the uniform itself. There are a few different things that could have been done to make the uniform better and more professional.

[Eclipse]

It doesn't, I am more interested in the program and missions, but the BBDU IMHO looks rather unprofessional. The nametapes don't match the uniform color, and I can't seem to find one that doesn't fade extremely fast.

So the BDU looks better in that regard?

The color issue is a product of who makes them and how you wash them.  Sending them to the cleaners maintains the color.

[manfredvonrichthofen]

It doesn't, I am more interested in the program and missions, but the BBDU IMHO looks rather unprofessional. The nametapes don't match the uniform color, and I can't seem to find one that doesn't fade extremely fast.

So the BDU looks better in that regard?

The color issue is a product of who makes them and how you wash them.  Sending them to the cleaners maintains the color.

Sure, the blue nametapes and rank stand out on the BDU... alot. But the thing about the BBDU is that if the uniform is going to blue, and the nametapes are blue, shouldn't they be the same blue? I don't use dry cleaners because around here where there is no active duty military population they don't know how to press a military uniform. They more often than not get the creases wrong, mash up the pockets and press the pocket flaps so the buttons wear into the pocket flap. I find that laundering my own uniforms is much easier and more professional looking when you stand next to someone who sends theirs to the cleaners. Especially since no one has their ACU pressed, and around here all it is is ACU.

[JohnKachenmeister]

Using ultramarine blue nametapes with the dark blue BDU makes the nametapes look faded even when brand new.  This issue was addressed at the National Board with a suggestion to use dark blue nametapes on the BBDU, but the NB didn't care and the uniform change resolution failed.

[manfredvonrichthofen]

Using ultramarine blue nametapes with the dark blue BDU makes the nametapes look faded even when brand new.  This issue was addressed at the National Board with a suggestion to use dark blue nametapes on the BBDU, but the NB didn't care and the uniform change resolution failed.

Exactly, the uniform in its current state looks unprofessional. If someone were to come in with BDUs that were faded badly we may not say anything but we would expect them to be replaced.

[SarDragon]

There is a new, NHQ approved, supplement on the street.

[arajca]

Using ultramarine blue nametapes with the dark blue BDU makes the nametapes look faded even when brand new.  This issue was addressed at the National Board with a suggestion to use dark blue nametapes on the BBDU, but the NB didn't care and the uniform change resolution failed.

Exactly, the uniform in its current state looks unprofessional. If someone were to come in with BDUs that were faded badly we may not say anything but we would expect them to be replaced.

Generally, a well keep, used uniform will fade somewhat. My bbdus look no worse, fading wise, than my bdus in the Army looked after a month. Also, consider this - if you don't tell someone their uniform looks substandard, why would you expect it to be replaced?

[DakRadz]

I don't think it's a good idea to encourage cadets to do anything on their own.  They are likely to tell their parents they are going with some other CAP cadets to a paint ball activity.  IF an injury occurs you likely are going to be getting the call since in the parents mind in is a CAP activity.

It's not really encouraging, it's "Hey, that doesn't happen as a part of CAP or on CAP time. Take it elsewhere if you want."

Specifically in response to that which I bolded:
So... I should only do SDAs when I'm at a squadron meeting? I should never make plans for classes I am supposed to teach? Will you come over to my house to make sure I am supervised while browsing CAP-based forums? Oh wait- SMs in a cadet's room... Yeah, that could cause problems...
I guess I'll never promote, then. And not prepare my uniforms to wear. Oh, wait- I shouldn't wear military style uniforms anyway..