I am pretty new to cadet programs. I have been doing mostly ES thus far. I am looking for a guideline or manual which states when it is a good idea to go from 1 flight to 2. We had 11 cadets remaining after resuming in-person meetings. Now in a rebuilding time, the have about 13 with about 6 prospective members and more recruiting events planned.
I read through the drill and ceremonies manual and saw that "The flight is composed of at least two, but not more than four, elements." I didn't find anything which said how many can be in an element, or on a more practical level how should you organize your flights. All new cadets in one flight? A mixture?
Thanks in advance and allow me to duck before you starting lobbing anything my way!
edit:
the make-up is
1- C/2dLt
1-C/CMSgt
1-C/SMS
1-C/TSgt
4-C/Sgt
6-8 Cadet basic-C/SrAmn
Following recommended grade/duty assignment:
Flt/cc - C/2d lt
Flt/sgt - C/CMSgt
ELdr1 - C/SMSgt
ELdr2 - C/TSgt
ELdr3 - C/SSgt
Assign remaining C/SSgt one per element as asst. leader.
Assign remaining cadets to each element
EL1 - 3
EL2 - 3
EL3 - 2
Just my thoughts on this issue.
From the glossary...
Element—The basic formation; that is, the smallest drill unit comprised of at least 3, but usually
8 to 12 individuals, one of whom is designated the element leader.
So minimum flight size... 7.
At least 2 elements, with at least 3 airmen each... (plus a guide)(guide does not equal guidon bearer)
Maximum size, not defined... but "usually 8-12"
So "usually" a maximum size would be 4 elements of 12 each (plus a guide)
or 49.
Not including Flight Sergeant, Flight Commander.
Quote from: umpirecali on September 15, 2021, 03:30:56 AMthe make-up is
1- C/2dLt
1-C/CMSgt
1-C/SMS
1-C/TSgt
4-C/Sgt
6-8 Cadet basic-C/SrAmn
In my opinion... right now:
C/2dLt Flt/CC
C/TSgt Flt/Sgt
C/Sgt #1 Guide
C/Sgt #2-4 Elements 1-3 EL
6-8 cadet basic - sra = element members
C/CMSgt = get your mitchell yesterday... take over as Flight/CC
C/SMSgt = get your mitchell tomorrow... be the first shirt in the meantime. (no role in flight formation... it diverges from the manual but i'd have him stand behind the last person in the last element of the flight)
Go cohort recruit a dozen new cadets.
Roll them all into elements 1-3.
---
Over the next several months...
Advance your 2Lt to Captain... SQCC
Your current Chief and SMS should be LT's by then. A FLT CC / B FLT CC
Your current NCO's should be SNCO's by then (TSgt -> First Sergeant) A FLT SGT // B FLT SGT
Your current SrA's should be NCO's by then (Guides, Element Leaders)
The cadets you pick up in this cohort move up to asst. EL's and EL's.
Now go recruit another cohort of cadets... and file them into the six elements of your two flights.
---
rinse and repeat... add fourth elements when it becomes necessary
Also -
Download a copy of CAPP 60-31 Cadet Staff Handbook (https://www.gocivilairpatrol.com/media/cms/Cadet_Staff_Handbook__Nov_16__Web_47474DD79B032.pdf)
Lots of really useful information in there, specifically Appendix 2 deals with how to set up the Cadet side of a Squadron, adjusting for how many cadets, and what grades are available. You'll see something almost exactly like what coudano posted.
Quote from: coudano on September 15, 2021, 04:04:39 AMFrom the glossary...
Element—The basic formation; that is, the smallest drill unit comprised of at least 3, but usually
8 to 12 individuals, one of whom is designated the element leader.
So minimum flight size... 7.
At least 2 elements, with at least 3 airmen each... (plus a guide)(guide does not equal guidon bearer)
Maximum size, not defined... but "usually 8-12"
So "usually" a maximum size would be 4 elements of 12 each (plus a guide)
or 49.
Not including Flight Sergeant, Flight Commander.
An Element is 4 airmen, whereas the flight would be 4 elements.
How many flights can a squadron have?
Quote from: JohhnyD on September 16, 2021, 09:15:22 AMHow many flights can a squadron have?
In CAP? 100.
In practicality, a squadron would be 3-6 flights.
Remember that CAP squadrons are basically structured using a Wing or group organization. A cadet component for the Air Force, such as an ROTC unit at a university, would normally be referred to as a detachment, not a squadron. That detachment is broken down into flights with a similar command/duty hierarchy as a squadron.
Keep in mind that squadrons are normally part of a much larger organization, and a single squadron may oversee communications operations, or operations planning, or logistics. In CAP, we free-flow that concept, and we combine it all into whatever the CAP squadron
wants to do as part of its mission capabilities/structure.
I always err on the side of smaller elements of 1 element leader & 3 members max for a couple of reasons:
- smaller span of control is a good thing for cadets who are in the crawl/walk stage of learning direct leadership
- smaller elements creates more elements as you grow, which opens up more element leader positions to get more cadets hands-on leadership experience at the entry level
Of course you have to balance this with the amount of cadet NCOs, SNCOs, and officers you have to staff out the flight leadership positions. To maintain span of control you want about 3-4 elements in a flight. If you don't have enough faces to fill the flight commander/flight sergeant spaces, you gotta adjust.
Quote from: Jester on September 16, 2021, 02:40:11 PMOf course you have to balance this with the amount of cadet NCOs, SNCOs, and officers you have to staff out the flight leadership positions. To maintain span of control you want about 3-4 elements in a flight. If you don't have enough faces to fill the flight commander/flight sergeant spaces, you gotta adjust.
Something to keep in mind as well is that you need to plan to mentor those airmen and junior NCOs to become senior NCOs, and later officers.
What tends to happen is people say "Well, they're just an airmen right now." They don't work with them. They don't give them any leadership responsibilities. Then, when they promote to Cadet Staff Sergeant, they're thrown into a leadership position and absolutely fail at it, or take a very long time to "get it" because they have no experience prior to being expected to actually lead/mentor subordinates.
Need someone to take on the responsibility of preparing award or promotion certificates? Give it to an Airman First Class. Have someone work with the senior staff to go get the insignia and prepare the "awards table." Have a couple of cadets whose job is to show up early and set up the room before the meeting.
Not everything is a job for an NCO. In fact, the NCO should be the one making sure that the airmen are performing those functions, and performing them well because that NCO once was the one who was doing in "back in their day."
Quote from: JohhnyD on September 16, 2021, 09:15:22 AMHow many flights can a squadron have?
How big do you want your flights? For example in BMT and at Tech School in the Air Force the flights have 49 in a flight. (48 in 4 elements of 12 plus the guide.)
Biggest flights I've seen at a CAP activity was 35. But that was at an encampment.
Quote from: PHall on September 16, 2021, 05:15:53 PMQuote from: JohhnyD on September 16, 2021, 09:15:22 AMHow many flights can a squadron have?
How big do you want your flights? For example in BMT and at Tech School in the Air Force the flights have 49 in a flight. (48 in 4 elements of 12 plus the guide.)
Biggest flights I've seen at a CAP activity was 35. But that was at an encampment.
Guideline these days is "12-20", and we've found 13-15 to be the sweet spot with much
more then that exceed reasonable span of control.
I can't image a Cadet Flight Commander (themselves never dealing with numbers that large)
being able to herd that many cats, let alone being able to provide the mentoring expected these days to 35 students, many with wet Currys.
Quote from: Eclipse on September 16, 2021, 05:57:08 PMQuote from: PHall on September 16, 2021, 05:15:53 PMQuote from: JohhnyD on September 16, 2021, 09:15:22 AMHow many flights can a squadron have?
How big do you want your flights? For example in BMT and at Tech School in the Air Force the flights have 49 in a flight. (48 in 4 elements of 12 plus the guide.)
Biggest flights I've seen at a CAP activity was 35. But that was at an encampment.
Guideline these days is "12-20", and we've found 13-15 to be the sweet spot with much
more then that exceed reasonable span of control.
I can't image a Cadet Flight Commander (themselves never dealing with numbers that large)
being able to herd that many cats, let alone being able to provide the mentoring expected these days to 35 students, many with wet Currys.
But somehow we managed to do it. Doesn't mean the flight cadre wasn't challenged, but it did happen.
Quote from: Eclipse on September 16, 2021, 05:57:08 PMQuote from: PHall on September 16, 2021, 05:15:53 PMQuote from: JohhnyD on September 16, 2021, 09:15:22 AMHow many flights can a squadron have?
How big do you want your flights? For example in BMT and at Tech School in the Air Force the flights have 49 in a flight. (48 in 4 elements of 12 plus the guide.)
Biggest flights I've seen at a CAP activity was 35. But that was at an encampment.
Guideline these days is "12-20", and we've found 13-15 to be the sweet spot with much
more then that exceed reasonable span of control.
I can't image a Cadet Flight Commander (themselves never dealing with numbers that large)
being able to herd that many cats, let alone being able to provide the mentoring expected these days to 35 students, many with wet Currys.
So with 80 cadets, we ought to have four flights. Since we are growing rapidly, maybe 5 by year-end?
If you have the space, five flights provides more leadership opportunities. Sixteens vs. twenties.
More flights equals more Flight Commander and Flight Sargent positions which means more training opportunities for your existing cadets.