Common Access Cards (CAC)

[desertengineer1]

Hmm.  lot's of misconceptions floating around here on this one....

First,  Burger King employees are NOT issued CAC cards because they do not have access to the base NIPRNET.  Only military members, DoD employees, and contractors requiring access to base NIPRNET or DoD PKI encryption, as a function of thier duties, will be issued CAC cards - and it must be clearly marked in the contract and approved individually by the contracting officer.  CAC cards and the man hour cost of issuance highly exceeds the utility in this case.  They get a MAJCOM ID card only.

Second, CAP members can still be granted network access as login only, known as a "LIMITED" account - basic web access only - no email, or server drives.   You must have unit commander and Comm Squadron approval, and complete Information Assurance training like everyone else.  I arrange this for several key members at my CAP unit as an ANG member and it works well for briefings and real-time eservices needs.

Third - there are no more AF vehicle stickers.

Hope this helps.

Umm, no.  They will get a 387 card to get access to the base.  Only a DoD employee or contractor that requires network (or controlled area) access will get a CAC. 

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Funny, that the crack smoking kid working the burger king French fry fryer on an AF installation can get a CAC, but hard working, non paid patriots serving their communities State and Nation, can't get that benefit.   

Anyway...... here is a link     http://www.cac.mil/index.html

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Ya....I have seen AAFES employees walking around with CAC's.  Last time I checked, AAFES runs the BK's on post. 

[desertengineer1]

If you have the funding, you can pay for an indepenant phone line.  The base Comm Squadron might agree to give you a telephone pair into the building if you pay the phone company for the service (MOA).  After that, as long as you don't cause problems with any EMSEC or TEMPEST rules, you should be good to put a DSL modem with a wireless router in.  This is a pretty common thing for offices like family support or MWR.  As long as you're not accessing the NIPRNET, violating someone's classified zone (TEMPEST), and have someone's approval i.e. completely independant - it's not a problem.

All of the things are on the table at this point and I am starting with a clean slate trying to think through this with them for our other issue.

For your issue TubaCAP.   One solution might be to approach the Guard in your area and see if they will provision a device like a Cisco ATA-100.   This is a device that grabs an IP based phone trunk and then terminates it out as an analog port.    In network land this is called a FXS port.  That shouldn't be too hard for your J-6 guys to get their mind around.  This allows tight security for them and you at least get the ability to get 56K dial-out to the internet in the mean time.

The other solution is that your guys have to implement the Guest access VLAN.   That's an engineering task that has to be implemented and most places "are" because of the guests that they "don't want" on their LANs.    In today's environment just because your in the same copper wiring infrastructure doesn't mean that you're in the same LAN at the transport layers.

[mikeylikey]

First,  Burger King employees are NOT issued CAC cards because they do not have access to the base NIPRNET.

That is really strange.  I just today walked into the PX and the woman checking ID cards at the door had a CAC hanging from her pocket.  She is an AAFES employee.  The registers at the Exchange have a cac reader where the checker actually has to insert his or her card to get the register to work, and I assume to track shift hours.  They are AAFES employees.  Then I have seen the Manager of the AAFES Burger King wearing his CAC as well. 

Finally, those AAFES employees working the BK in Saudi Arabia have CAC's as well.  As does everyone else in country.  I have seen them with my own eyes. 

Not sure where you are at, or if you are AD, Guard, or Reserve......but in my AD travels over the past 8 years this has been the norm. 

The CAC is not just for accessing computer systems.  That is a relatively new idea.  It's primary purpose is for identification, privilege granting, and access.  It also seconds as the Geneva Conventions card.  Just like the cards before them were used for.   

[md132]

All AAFES employees overseas gets issues a CAC card.  For CONUS most used them for identification only.  Certain employees use them to out-process a Soldier/Marine/Airmen/Sailor when they are PCS/graduating.  Which PX did you see CAC reards at the registers.  We don't have that here in APG or Ft Meade.

[mikeylikey]

^ Both Knox and Leonard Wood. 

[PHall]

Were they really CAC's or just AAFES ID cards that have the same format?

Do they have the data chip in them?

Do they have the magnetic stripe?

[CadetProgramGuy]

Heck, when I did basic contracting work for the Army, I was issued a CAC card.

I never had access to a computer system the while time I was there.

[md132]

Yes they are CAC cards.  They have a data chips and magnetic strip.  Also we have a PIN number associated with it.  I only use it for work when I'm coming on base.  I don't have any reason to use is for internet access.  I have an AAFES LAN ID for that.  As well as a separate login for it.  Passwords are just as long and difficult as AKO/DKO/GKO.  I use it at home however to do my MDDF work or at my HQ to do my admin work. (We use CAC's to login the system.  No internet access.  Plus it's easier to carry then the old AAFES ID (Big tan card they used to issue 20 years ago.)  And easier to get through the gate.  Most DoD police don't know what the old ID's look like.

Civilian contractors working for a branch of the military are issued CAC's as well.  Some work at secure buildings some do not. 

[fireplug]

My Wing Hq is on an Air Force base. We use cellphone "air cards" for internet access.

[desertengineer1]

Umm.  AAFES employees in the BX are far removed from BK.  Again, if he/she requires NIPRNET access as part of their duties, they will be issued a CAC.  Not everybody gets them.

SWA is a much different story.  Everybody gets a CAC as a requirement of the base.  I think it's a CENTAF/CENTOM requirement.  I know it's per CENTAF.  (Had enough of those tours  )

First,  Burger King employees are NOT issued CAC cards because they do not have access to the base NIPRNET.

That is really strange.  I just today walked into the PX and the woman checking ID cards at the door had a CAC hanging from her pocket.  She is an AAFES employee.  The registers at the Exchange have a cac reader where the checker actually has to insert his or her card to get the register to work, and I assume to track shift hours.  They are AAFES employees.  Then I have seen the Manager of the AAFES Burger King wearing his CAC as well. 

Finally, those AAFES employees working the BK in Saudi Arabia have CAC's as well.  As does everyone else in country.  I have seen them with my own eyes. 

Not sure where you are at, or if you are AD, Guard, or Reserve......but in my AD travels over the past 8 years this has been the norm. 

The CAC is not just for accessing computer systems.  That is a relatively new idea.  It's primary purpose is for identification, privilege granting, and access.  It also seconds as the Geneva Conventions card.  Just like the cards before them were used for.   

[PhoenixRisen]

Were they really CAC's or just AAFES ID cards that have the same format?

The guys I see down here at the MCAS Miramar MCX have 'em.  They're the same CAC that the defense contractors that work with my dad have (my dad's a Navy Civilian, GS-13 type).

The one's that I know are contractor CAC's have a green stripe going down the right side of the card.



Same idea as the newer generation cards - but the stripe's thicker, and in a different postion (as described before).

[Tim Medeiros]

Third - there are no more AF vehicle stickers.

Umm, just to let you know, this must not have been implemented at all bases yet, I have a friend who just recently had to get a base sticker for her car she just bought.

[mikeylikey]

Third - there are no more AF vehicle stickers.

Umm, just to let you know, this must not have been implemented at all bases yet, I have a friend who just recently had to get a base sticker for her car she just bought.

.............And Air National Guard bases are still issuing them as well.  In actuality, the AF only stopped producing the little date sticker that goes along with the DOD Decal.  Without going to look at mine, I cant tell you what AF form it is, sorry.  Some Army/Marine/Naval Posts/bases/installations used the AF date sticker, but now have to manufacture and provide their own.  That is the only "cost saving" measure the AF is undertaking (not printing the date sticker) by stopping issue of the decals, as the DOD decal is produced by a contractor for the DOD to issue to all Services.   

[skymaster]

Now, as per an Executive Order signed two years ago, the "next generation" CAC and FED ID card, may be an option, if NHQ gets its act together and presents it correctly.  Especially with future missions for DHS and other FED agencies looming on the horizon.  We could easily get a CAC FED ID CARD that says "Civilian", and "Civil Air Patrol" in the department field.

Funny thing is, I heard a rumor that the AF actually brought the issue of the CAC to CAPNHQ, who turned it down.  My sources are from the CAP-USAF side, so I trust them greatly. 
[/quote]

Well, my sources in AETC elaborated on this a bit more.  The AF was more than willing to issue CAC cards to CAP members, and originally planned to implement such a thing.  What the Air Force had in mind, and what was presented to NHQ, was that the CAC card would in fact REPLACE the CAP ID card with a generic Air Force CAC card that would explicitly have had the individual members submit a "passport type" photo of the member in CIVILIAN clothes (no uniform), and ONLY the grade of "Civilian" on the card.  Some National Board members (at the time) countered with their own design that had a uniform photo and the member's CAP grade, in the colours of the old style CAP ID card.  AETC shot that down, and we ended up with the cards we have now.

[AngelWings]

Now, as per an Executive Order signed two years ago, the "next generation" CAC and FED ID card, may be an option, if NHQ gets its act together and presents it correctly.  Especially with future missions for DHS and other FED agencies looming on the horizon.  We could easily get a CAC FED ID CARD that says "Civilian", and "Civil Air Patrol" in the department field.

Funny thing is, I heard a rumor that the AF actually brought the issue of the CAC to CAPNHQ, who turned it down.  My sources are from the CAP-USAF side, so I trust them greatly. 

Well, my sources in AETC elaborated on this a bit more.  The AF was more than willing to issue CAC cards to CAP members, and originally planned to implement such a thing.  What the Air Force had in mind, and what was presented to NHQ, was that the CAC card would in fact REPLACE the CAP ID card with a generic Air Force CAC card that would explicitly have had the individual members submit a "passport type" photo of the member in CIVILIAN clothes (no uniform), and ONLY the grade of "Civilian" on the card.  Some National Board members (at the time) countered with their own design that had a uniform photo and the member's CAP grade, in the colours of the old style CAP ID card.  AETC shot that down, and we ended up with the cards we have now.
[/quote]
Why, leadership, why??? We could of actually had decent look ID cards and not get hassled when we need to go to on AFB's.

[RiverAux]

If that account is true, our leadership made a good call.  I'm normally a strong proponent of closer AF-CAP ties, but this was just as bad as having the people participating in the short-lived VSAF program not wearing CAP uniforms. 

[abdsp51]

First the decal is a DDForm 2220.

Second depending on branch and installation will determine the process for Non DoD personnel outside of retirees, dependents, contractors etc.  Most AAFES employees such as at BK, Popeyes etc have an AAFES ID card issued to allow them to work on base etc, or a local long term badge issued.

Third most AAFES employees overseas are TCNs and will not have a CAC issued to them but a badge issued indicating they are cleared to be on the yard on what days and for what hours.  This badge may look like a CAC but is in fact not a CAC.

Every installation commander dictates IAW established branch regs installation entry policy.  Not every base has an automated system, I can not speak for any other branch but every AF installation I have been on lately has still had the Mk 0 Mod 0 defender augmented by technology.  And anyone being issued a CAC in association with their duties has gone through a background check. 

[rmutchler]

Looking at the CAC website, I don't see why it would be an issue to use the Command Patch as the logo, put USAF-Civil Air Patrol as the agency, omit the pay grade, but keep the rank.

That should be good for both sides of the fence.

The only complication I see would revolve around renewals.  CAC replacing membership cards would require CAP to shift to a multi year renewal structure.  I highly doubt the DoD would want to do annual CAC issuance to CAP.

[PA Guy]

I just spent the last 3 days on an AFB that is home to a major command HQ.  Mult. trips in and out the gate manned by both civ. and sec. police.  Used my CAP ID card and no one batted an eye.  If the card works who cares what it looks like.  YMMV.

[PA Guy]

Looking at the CAC website, I don't see why it would be an issue to use the Command Patch as the logo, put USAF-Civil Air Patrol as the agency, omit the pay grade, but keep the rank.

That should be good for both sides of the fence.

The only complication I see would revolve around renewals.  CAC replacing membership cards would require CAP to shift to a multi year renewal structure.  I highly doubt the DoD would want to do annual CAC issuance to CAP.

People already complain about the cost of dues.  How much is having a CAC going to drive that up?  Who is going to pay for the background checks?
I had to have one to even get a VOLAC (Volunteer Acess Card, may not be used for ID purposes). for another service I do work for that requires network acess.