What sort of vehicle should we be driving?

[321EOD]

Ok, so what process do you go through to request a vehicle? I submitted a CAPF175 last year and it doesnt seem to be making much progress

[mikeylikey]

^ Um ya.....unless the Wing King needs a new expidetion good luck! 

[afgeo4]

I think full-size crew cab pick-ups with regular beds should work quite well. They tend to fit up to 6 adults and lots of gear of whatever kind in the back. They tow well if needed and come with 4wd as an option.

[afgeo4]

The turbo-diesel, passenger version of the Dodge Sprinter 3500.  Durable, multi-purpose and holds plenty.

And imagine that vehicle set up with 4 seats (driver + 3 pax) up front, commo gear on walls in back, flat panel tv, and a couple of laptops with wireless connection. Add DF antennae and 2 more seats in the back for operators. You'll have a mobile command post, ES van and transport, all in one!

[badger bob]

Up here in snow country, I would like to see some 4x4 Suburbans.

Good all weather and all road capabilities, good interior room, capacity for 8 with a radio console up front, and much better for towing trailers when needed then the 15 pax vans.

[SAR-EMT1]

I am slightly unnerved by the sprinters.. I use one as an ambulance at one of my stations and though there isnt anything I can put my finger on... anytime it gets above 50 I get nervous.

As for ground trans: CAP should get rid of its minivans (personnal opinion)
Stick with the box 15 pax. and SUV 4x4s. I WILL say that every effort should be made to go to hybrid fuel.  The overall savings would be significant.

[afgeo4]

Good point, but what hybrid vans/4x4 are out there?

[SarDragon]

Good point, but what hybrid vans/4x4 are out there?

4WD SUVs -
2007 Ford Escape Hybrid   
2007 Lexus RX 400h
2007 Mercury Mariner Hybrid   
2007 Toyota Highlander Hybrid

Vans -
Scion xB
Dodge Caravan
The eBox
Mercury Meta One
Toyota Sienna Hybrid

That's what's out there. I am making NO claims regarding their usefulness to CAP.

[adamblank]

The problem I have seen at least on the Air Force side of the house is that they will only go with American made products.  For the nice Montana winters a Subaru outback might be the best choice but since its not American it will never be considered.

On another note, I work logistics and our wing needed a new vehicle I completed a CAPF 175 and sent it off to the wing/cc.  The key is look in the regulation for justification.  You can use hours, times, or miles.  The region/cc to my understanding will at least consider it if it is reasonable and can be justified, but in CAP you never know!

[badger bob]

Good point, but what hybrid vans/4x4 are out there?

4WD SUVs -
2007 Ford Escape Hybrid   
2007 Lexus RX 400h
2007 Mercury Mariner Hybrid   
2007 Toyota Highlander Hybrid

Vans -
Scion xB
Dodge Caravan
The eBox
Mercury Meta One
Toyota Sienna Hybrid

That's what's out there. I am making NO claims regarding their usefulness to CAP.

The Dodge Caravan has a E85 option, not hybrid.

The Hybrid Chevrolet Tahoe/ GMC Yukon Hybrids are being shipped now -We have 4 availalbe at our GM store.
The 2009 Dodge Durango/ Chrysler Aspen Hybrid will start shipping in June

[afgeo4]

Good point, but what hybrid vans/4x4 are out there?

4WD SUVs -
2007 Ford Escape Hybrid   
2007 Lexus RX 400h
2007 Mercury Mariner Hybrid   
2007 Toyota Highlander Hybrid

Vans -
Scion xB
Dodge Caravan
The eBox
Mercury Meta One
Toyota Sienna Hybrid

That's what's out there. I am making NO claims regarding their usefulness to CAP.

The Dodge Caravan has a E85 option, not hybrid.

The Hybrid Chevrolet Tahoe/ GMC Yukon Hybrids are being shipped now -We have 4 availalbe at our GM store.
The 2009 Dodge Durango/ Chrysler Aspen Hybrid will start shipping in June

E-85... what a useless thing. It is so inefficient to produce that more carbon is used to make it (plant usually use coal and electricity to produce this) than is offset by reduction in oil consumption. In addition, the fuel is only about 82% as efficient as gasoline, which means that more of the blend is needed to run the same amount of miles on the same vehicle which means you actually end up not saving almost any gas/oil. It also costs the same as gas.

[A.Member]

Good point, but what hybrid vans/4x4 are out there?

4WD SUVs -
2007 Ford Escape Hybrid   
2007 Lexus RX 400h
2007 Mercury Mariner Hybrid   
2007 Toyota Highlander Hybrid

Vans -
Scion xB
Dodge Caravan
The eBox
Mercury Meta One
Toyota Sienna Hybrid

That's what's out there. I am making NO claims regarding their usefulness to CAP.

The Dodge Caravan has a E85 option, not hybrid.

The Hybrid Chevrolet Tahoe/ GMC Yukon Hybrids are being shipped now -We have 4 availalbe at our GM store.
The 2009 Dodge Durango/ Chrysler Aspen Hybrid will start shipping in June

E-85... what a useless thing. It is so inefficient to produce that more carbon is used to make it (plant usually use coal and electricity to produce this) than is offset by reduction in oil consumption. In addition, the fuel is only about 82% as efficient as gasoline, which means that more of the blend is needed to run the same amount of miles on the same vehicle which means you actually end up not saving almost any gas/oil. It also costs the same as gas.

Hybrids are just as useless.  Diesel (bio-diesel) is the best of the current offerings in terms of fuel efficiency (which is most important right now) and overall impact.

BTW, non of the vehicles listed above would be very effective at meeting our needs.

[mynetdude]

Good point, but what hybrid vans/4x4 are out there?

4WD SUVs -
2007 Ford Escape Hybrid   
2007 Lexus RX 400h
2007 Mercury Mariner Hybrid   
2007 Toyota Highlander Hybrid

Vans -
Scion xB
Dodge Caravan
The eBox
Mercury Meta One
Toyota Sienna Hybrid

That's what's out there. I am making NO claims regarding their usefulness to CAP.

The Dodge Caravan has a E85 option, not hybrid.

The Hybrid Chevrolet Tahoe/ GMC Yukon Hybrids are being shipped now -We have 4 availalbe at our GM store.
The 2009 Dodge Durango/ Chrysler Aspen Hybrid will start shipping in June

E-85... what a useless thing. It is so inefficient to produce that more carbon is used to make it (plant usually use coal and electricity to produce this) than is offset by reduction in oil consumption. In addition, the fuel is only about 82% as efficient as gasoline, which means that more of the blend is needed to run the same amount of miles on the same vehicle which means you actually end up not saving almost any gas/oil. It also costs the same as gas.

Hybrids are just as useless.  Diesel (bio-diesel) is the best of the current offerings in terms of fuel efficiency (which is most important right now) and overall impact.

BTW, non of the vehicles listed above would be very effective at meeting our needs.

So which ones do you think would meet the needs?

[A.Member]

Up here in snow country, I would like to see some 4x4 Suburbans.

Good all weather and all road capabilities, good interior room, capacity for 8 with a radio console up front, and much better for towing trailers when needed then the 15 pax vans.

I also am in a cold, heavy snow weather climate.  How many times have you actually needed all-wheel drive for your CAP vehicle?  I've never needed it.  Tough to justify the extra cost.  Have you ever tried to put 8 full size people in a Suburban?  And what exactly do you need to tow?  All the gear could fit in the back of a Sprinter.  Having a couple in the Wing might be OK but they aren't anything that should be purchased at squadron levels.

[A.Member]

Hybrids are just as useless.  Diesel (bio-diesel) is the best of the current offerings in terms of fuel efficiency (which is most important right now) and overall impact.

BTW, non of the vehicles listed above would be very effective at meeting our needs.

So which ones do you think would meet the needs?

I threw out my suggestion earlier.   If we sat down with a list of requirements, I'd guess that the Sprinter would best meet the overall needs/mission requirements.  It's base price is the same or less than that of most configurations of the aformentioned Chevrolet Suburban.  Stardard (and realistic) seating for 12 (plus still some room for gear).  Standard safety features include ABS, traction and stability control.  As for fuel efficiency, supposedly 22 city/24 highway.  Not at all bad for the size and type of vehicle.

[afgeo4]

As far as 4x4 is concerned... I used our wing's 2x4 GMC Sierra pickup... crew cab with long bed and a single set-up in back (not dually) and that thing is HORRIFIC in any type snow/ice. I mean it just won't go anywhere. I got stuck in 1/2 inch of snow in NYC one day. The next day there was a small patch of ice under one of the rear wheels an the thing wouldn't move a millimeter. Thank god for the sanitation front loader whose daughter turned out to be an AF Captain. He hooked up a chain and pulled me out. Otherwise it would probably still be in that parking space. I really recommend 4WD on vehicles like that.

[SarDragon]

You didn't need 4WD, you needed a limited-slip (locking) differential.

[davidsinn]

You didn't need 4WD, you needed a limited-slip (locking) differential.

Or some proper ballast.

[c/A1C Johnson]

we should get hummers millitary kind so we can take them off road for es and we can pull peoples cars or people out of floods

[JayT]

we should get hummers millitary kind so we can take them off road for es and we can pull peoples cars or people out of floods

We're prohibited from using them.