Stolen Valor

[Stonewall]

Man, Stonewall, you have busted a lot of people huh?

Busted a lot of people?  No. 

I have personally "busted" 3.  Met and called out several, maybe as many as 10.  But I have only played a role in busting 3 phonies.

By "busting", I mean they were confronted by real deal people and possibly put on one of those "wall of shame" websites with their story.

1.  Phony SEAL neighbor in DC.
2.  Phony CAP SEAL dude pictured in this discussion.
3.  I know there was one more but can't remember right now.

[NIN]

Man, Stonewall, you have busted a lot of people huh?

They seem to flock to him. He's the "Phoney Whisperer"

[Stonewall]

Man, Stonewall, you have busted a lot of people huh?

They seem to flock to him. He's the "Phoney Whisperer"

Yeah, NIN, do you remember anyone else that I've busted.  Someone else that you helped out with or someone else that I told you about.  Not sure why I can't think of any right now besides the two I already mentioned.

[NIN]

There was our friend from Pennsylvania right here on CAP-Talk, and then a certain "Secret Squirrel from the Great White North"...

There have been others, I'm sure.

[Stonewall]

There was our friend from Pennsylvania right here on CAP-Talk, and then a certain "Secret Squirrel from the Great White North"...

Oh yeah, our "captain" friend who claimed a lot of Army Artillery Officer Stuff as well as ROTC instructor and future deployments back to Afghanistan....yet he worked at Radio Shack, didn't he? 

And for the Great White North guy, I just never liked the guy and had a gut feeling, but you did 90% of the work on that one.  Busting phonies went international...awesome.

[NIN]

In my time as a unit commander in two wings, I had more than my fair share of flako-whackos come thru the door.

Few years back, had a guy show up to my CAP unit (IIRC, it was just after 9/11) and he wanted to join. Claimed all kinds of neato sneaky-pete stuff, went on at length about how many kills he had, etc.

Finally, I said "OK, that's great.  BTW, before I can submit this paperwork to NHQ, I need a copy of your DD-214, and you need to get those fingerprints completed.."

There were 2-3 weeks of hemming and hawing, and at one point he told me that he called NHQ and they told him that it was "A-OK to send his paperwork down without a fingerprint card or the -214." 

I said "Yeah, uh, no.  Doesn't work that way. All senior membership packets that go downrange do so with fingerprint cards. Period.  Nobody at NHQ would tell you that.  And, in any event, where's your DD-214?"  (mind you: at the time my unit wasn't overprinting senior applications yet, and I noticed that he left the "arrests" block empty on the CAPF12.  Red flags and warning bells!  I already had one problem with that a year or so earlier, so I *always* confirm that box is covered.  This was clearly missed, and I guarantee I knew the reason why..)

He stammered that his -214 was "classified."  I stood there right in our admin room of the armory and said "Buddy, you're so full of {word redacted} that my boots are turning brown.  You better get your happy ass out of here before I call the cops on you.  Don't come back."  And I put him on the "don't let this dillhole back on the reservation" list at the gate.

He beat a hasty retreat and we never saw him again.

Then there were the two guys in my wing who claimed to be Vietnam vets and had these crazy-ass stories. 

One claimed to have been "one of the last guys out" in Frequent Wind, while at the same time claiming to have been an AC-130 gunner and having participated in the Mayaguez incident.  He got busted for arson on a federal installation,  got tossed out of the Air Guard for lying about some things and theft of government property, lost his job as a firefighter, and subsequently left town.   Last I heard, he was living someplace in the mid-south and claiming to be a retired CMSgt (I'm pretty sure if you get hucked out of the Air Guard for stealing equipment, you don't get to retire at your earned grade, let along go UP two grades afterwards).

The other claimed to be an Air Force cop involved in the Mayaguez incident.  While I know there were SPs involved, his claim always seemed a little... thin.  Especially in light of his good buddy at the unit further south claiming to have been involved in the same action.

I also had an officer in my unit who, while being a Vietnam-era veteran, I don't believe was actually a "Vietnam Vet."  He talked like he was, and he was a member of the local VVA, and he rides at Rolling Thunder every year, but I'm pretty sure he never spent any time "in theater."   He doesn't stand there and say things like "yeah, I helped repel sappers at Bien Hoa.." or anything like that, and he's a [darn] fine officer in CAP, so I'm sort of like "yeah, there are far bigger fish to fry" and let it go. He does great work and his did serve during the Vietnam War, and maybe he was in Vietnam at some point, so IMHO, it really wasn't worth bothering with pursuing.  Could have just been an inconsistency. Could have been my crappy hearing malfunctioning again.. <GRIN>

[flyguy06]

Man, Stonewall, you have busted a lot of people huh?

They seem to flock to him. He's the "Phoney Whisperer"

Yeah, NIN, do you remember anyone else that I've busted.  Someone else that you helped out with or someone else that I told you about.  Not sure why I can't think of any right now besides the two I already mentioned.

So, do you guys go looking for people to bust?

[Stonewall]

So, do you guys go looking for people to bust? You actually take time out of your life to seek out people whp perpetrate?  WOW. Wish I had that kind of time on my hands.

If you responded to this discussion with that post, you most certainly do have "that kind of time" on your hands.

Read what NIN said above, although in jest, he said "they seem to flock to him".  Meaning, some how in my 37 years I've managed to come across a small number of knuckleheads who portray themselves as something they're not.

In case you don't get it, the answer is "NO", we do not seek out people who are bogus heroes.  These people pop up on CAP Talk, CadetStuff and at CAP squadrons all the time.  You just have to be a little brighter than the next guy to catch'em.

So, do you guys go looking for people to bust?

Second thoughts on your original post?  Just a little too slow.

[flyguy06]

So, do you guys go looking for people to bust? You actually take time out of your life to seek out people whp perpetrate?  WOW. Wish I had that kind of time on my hands.

If you responded to this discussion with that post, you most certainly do have "that kind of time" on your hands.

Read what NIN said above, although in jest, he said "they seem to flock to him".  Meaning, some how in my 37 years I've managed to come across a small number of knuckleheads who portray themselves as something they're not.

In case you don't get it, the answer is "NO", we do not seek out people who are bogus heroes.  These people pop up on CAP Talk, CadetStuff and at CAP squadrons all the time.  You just have to be a little brighter than the next guy to catch'em.

So, do you guys go looking for people to bust?

Second thoughts on your original post?  Just a little too slow.

I guess my point is I am not looking to catch them. Iam not looking. I work a full time job plus I am a Commander in the Guard. I dont have the free time to worry about those things.

Why you always bustin my chops dude. relax and breathe. 

[flyguy06]

So, do you guys go looking for people to bust? You actually take time out of your life to seek out people whp perpetrate?  WOW. Wish I had that kind of time on my hands.

If you responded to this discussion with that post, you most certainly do have "that kind of time" on your hands.

Read what NIN said above, although in jest, he said "they seem to flock to him".  Meaning, some how in my 37 years I've managed to come across a small number of knuckleheads who portray themselves as something they're not.

In case you don't get it, the answer is "NO", we do not seek out people who are bogus heroes.  These people pop up on CAP Talk, CadetStuff and at CAP squadrons all the time.  You just have to be a little brighter than the next guy to catch'em.

So, do you guys go looking for people to bust?

Second thoughts on your original post?  Just a little too slow.

I did have second thoughts on my original post because Ididnt want to sound mean.i am actually a nice guy. I dont know why you give me grief. maybe when you get my age youwill see thatsome things just arent that serious and you have to pick your battles. i have nothing against anyone on this board.

[Stonewall]

I guess my point is I am not looking to catch them. Iam not looking. I work a full time job plus I am a Commander in the Guard. I dont have the free time to worry about those things.

It isn't that hard.  Some folks can multi-task; I'm one of them I guess.  It's not like it takes more than 2 minutes to figure it out, so no, it's not a "job" or a hobby.  When a guy shows up on CAP Talk with the screen name "USNSEALVET" and then posts his full name in the signature block, it's just that easy.  One email or phone call (less than 2 minutes of time) and it's over.  I could do it from my blackberry while exercising on the elliptical.

Why you always bustin my chops dude. relax and breathe. 

Because you make it so easy.

[N Harmon]

Has anyone confronted someone they believed was a phony, but turned out to be legit?

[Short Field]

I pulled the string on a couple in CAP and several that are just local guys trying to impress others.  Their biggest problem is they are use to dealing with people that don't really know the military culture and get carried away with their stories.   You just start to hear things that don't track with your own reality of how the world was back then.  So you start to pay a little more attention to the details.   It is hard to define but the wannabees start to say things that just don't sound right.   

[Stonewall]

I did have second thoughts on my original post because Ididnt want to sound mean.i am actually a nice guy. I dont know why you give me grief. maybe when you get my age youwill see thatsome things just arent that serious and you have to pick your battles. i have nothing against anyone on this board.

I know you're a nice guy.

Your age?  You're like 2 1/2 years older than me.

It's not a battle and it's not serious.

[Stonewall]

Has anyone confronted someone they believed was a phony, but turned out to be legit?

No, because my gut is usually right and they're usually that bad at trying to pull it off.

I pulled the string on a couple in CAP and several that are just local guys trying to impress others.  Their biggest problem is they are use to dealing with people that don't really know the military culture and get carried away with their stories.   You just start to hear things that don't track with your own reality of how the world was back then.  So you start to pay a little more attention to the details.   It is hard to define but the wannabees start to say things that just don't sound right.   

That's pretty much it right there.

[flyguy06]

cool

[flyboy53]

Yes, and the general rule of thumb is that the guy or gal who really did it, is less likely to talk about it...either because of what they went through or what they can't talk about and never will.

I know a female Air Force SP who was trained as a sniper, you'd never know it to talk to her.

[Stonewall]

It is an unfortunate, but true fact that some people you meet in life are not what they claim to be. Quite a few people who claim to be SEALs/MOH Recipients/Marines/ F-22 pilots/etc. aren't.

Organizations like CAP tend to attract false heroes. You could write a sociology thesis on why it happens, but all you really need to know is that it happens. Senior members should be the ones identifying, confronting, and solving these problems, but this also affects cadets- which is why I present this here.

Choose your mentors and heroes carefully. Not everyone is who or what they say they are.

Be careful that you are not misleading people yourself.  There are several people in CAP who use screen names or email addresses that could mislead someone into thinking you're something you aren't. Email addresses like "IAMANF22DRVR@wannabe.com" are lame at best, and misleading at worst.  A couple years ago, there was a cadet posting on CadetStuff claiming to be an Air Force Flight Surgeon.

Here are a few resources to make you a more critical consumer of information:

Veri-SEAL

MOAA Fake Heroes Article

List of every MOH ever

Website for Exposing Military Frauds

[Stonewall]

I know a female Air Force SP who was trained as a sniper, you'd never know it to talk to her.

Jennifer Donaldson in 2001....More info on this lady here.

[CAP Producer]

So, do you guys go looking for people to bust? You actually take time out of your life to seek out people whp perpetrate?  WOW. Wish I had that kind of time on my hands.

If you responded to this discussion with that post, you most certainly do have "that kind of time" on your hands.

Read what NIN said above, although in jest, he said "they seem to flock to him".  Meaning, some how in my 37 years I've managed to come across a small number of knuckleheads who portray themselves as something they're not.

In case you don't get it, the answer is "NO", we do not seek out people who are bogus heroes.  These people pop up on CAP Talk, CadetStuff and at CAP squadrons all the time.  You just have to be a little brighter than the next guy to catch'em.

So, do you guys go looking for people to bust?

Second thoughts on your original post?  Just a little too slow.

Kirt,

the technical term (for you and NIN) is "flypaper for wierdos." They just seem attracted to you guys.