Upset by How People Treat Us

[2ltAlexD]

Hi there everyone. I have recently run into some really mean people online over the past few weeks. Tell me if you guys have had similar experiences. When I tell them about CAP and what we do, I have had some people call it the "fake military" or "boyscouts in the air" I feel this is just really sad. We serve our country just as much as anyone else does. It just really hurts.

[sarflyer]

It is sad but that's how they make themselves feel better.  By putting us down.  My response has always been "it too bad you feel that way".   Works almost every time.

[RiverAux]

Either they really feel that way in which case you aren't going to change their mind, or more likely, they're just trying to make you mad because they're trolls.  Either way, the best course is to just ignore them.

[flyerthom]

Some people are just that way. I do see it getting worse because of cultural "me first, I'm special" attitude. I remember a case running volunteer EMS. My partner and I went into an all night diner and some drunk shouted "here come the heroes!" He's was just being mean. People like that are the first to scream when they have to wait and scream louder when the bill arrives. In the grand scheme of things they can only hurt us if we let them.


(FWIW - my partner and I were seated just a couple a tables away from the drunk who continued to be loud and obnoxious. We started swapping war stories sort of loudly. Inside of 10 minutes he was outside reversing the path of his meal. Maybe we should not have described the open fracture so ah distinctly) 

[Smithsonia]

If they are just being provocative and snarky let it go. BUT, perhaps they don't know better. Perhaps they are just repeating what some one else told them. Perhaps this can be a teaching moment.

If you think this is the case; then respond in a professional and courteous manner. "How many people have you helped today?" We helped dozens! "How many lives have you saved?" We've saved thousands. How many people did you train to save lives? How much does your country count on you in times of need? Just like the Red Cross and Salvation Army our country calls on us to help Law enforcement, Fire Service, the National Guard, Border Patrol, State Police, and even the Boy Scouts.
Additionally you might ask them --Have you set an example for young men and women today? Have you done anything more than just say, "I'm believe in the military folks in the field... then the person goes on to say something derogatory about what a few of them did badly.

"What better way to spend the money than have highly qualified volunteers do what you can not, will not, and don't appreciate. "That said, one day, if you need us, we'll gladly save you too!"

Boy Scouts of the Air? -- I was a boy scout, and eagle scout, an open water rescue lifeguard and I think it was all good training for CAP.

We're not perfect... no institution our size is. Even when we don't find a lost party we can quickly tell others where they ain't -- so in this way we support other Search and Rescue teams so they can hone in on an intelligent area of possibility. We qualify, train, lead, and help anywhere our country thinks best.
I'm sorry that you didn't know this (Mr. Snarky commentator) I think that was our only great failing today. BUT, in this I hope I've been helpful to you. Is there anything else I can do for you?
With regards;
ED OBRIEN

[Major Carrales]

Hi there everyone. I have recently run into some really mean people online over the past few weeks. Tell me if you guys have had similar experiences. When I tell them about CAP and what we do, I have had some people call it the "fake military" or "boyscouts in the air" I feel this is just really sad. We serve our country just as much as anyone else does. It just really hurts.

I cannot stand the mentality of those of which you write.  CAP is, and always will be, what it is... Citizen Volunteers working to preform Missions For America.  What we do has been in place since the 1940s and is one of the most pure forms of volunteerism around.

Those that choose to see us as the "fake military" or "boyscouts in the air" miss the point.  They likely have it out for the Salvation Army and the Red Cross Volunteers as well.

Simply put, when we do our job we are obligated to do it well.  When we do "do it well," then what these people write and say is pure drivel.

Be more proud of what we are than ashamed of what we are not...never allow yourself to be harmed by such talk.

By the way, I should like to get back into brass.  I took out a trumpet to do bugle calls for the cadets the other day and realized how out of shape I was.  20 years on a violin and trombone with limited practice on the trumpet or fluglehorn is showing through.  Any tips?  PM would probably make MIKE happy.

[JohnKachenmeister]

I very seldom get comments, because I look mean and perpetually angry.

But if I did, I'm afraid I would have to demonstrate how it is that I earned a Master of Arts degree in Smartassology.

Like the "Fake Military" comment... my answer would probably be:  "Fake military?  I wish!  I got drafted back in 1966, and nobody will tell me what form I need to fill out to go home!"

And the Boy Scouts of the Air comment...  "You got it wrong there, Buffalo Breath, Boy Scouts do GOOD deeds.  I'm just happy to be out of jail."

A few weeks ago, we stopped for pizza after a mission, and some mouthy jerk said to me "What's with you guys?  Couldn't you make it in the Real Air Force?"  I loudly said:  "Sure, I was making it just fine until that last incident.  I'm still not supposed to talk about it, but it was the one involving the bottle of Wesson Oil, the general's daughter, and a duck."

Mr. Bigmouth left the restaurant while everybody was laughing.  Not only the CAP guys but ALL the customers and staff.

[Turk]

Speaking for myself, I seldom encounter scorn about CAP... just mostly innocent ignorance. When asked about CAP, I try 'n win 'em over with words like "volunteers," "Katrina," and "nine-eleven." It generally works.

I also find that people who make remarks like "boy scouts of the air" (whether they're civilian or military) have never sat in the left seat. I still remember an F-15 hotshot who, far from sneering at me, said, "You're flying - I manage a weapons system." 

[2ltAlexD]

Yeah, alot of times it's ignorence. I was also told once that military Dress Blues look like bus driver's uniforms hahahaha! People just need to learn about what we do more.

[Turk]

Yeah, alot of times it's ignorence. I was also told once that military Dress Blues look like bus driver's uniforms hahahaha! People just need to learn about what we do more.

Bus drivah?!? You're a regular riot, Alice! 

[JohnKachenmeister]

Speaking for myself, I seldom encounter scorn about CAP... just mostly innocent ignorance. When asked about CAP, I try 'n win 'em over with words like "volunteers," "Katrina," and "nine-eleven." It generally works.

I also find that people who make remarks like "boy scouts of the air" (whether they're civilian or military) have never sat in the left seat. I still remember an F-15 hotshot who, far from sneering at me, said, "You're flying - I manage a weapons system." 

I had an Air Force recruiter say essentially the same thing.  We were at an Air Show, and the AF recruiting tent was across the ramp from our recruiting tent.  Some kid went up to the AF recruiter and said "Sign me up... I want to fly!"The AF sergeant said, "Then you better go across the way and join those guys, they do more flying than us, we're going to UAV's!"

[JohnKachenmeister]

Bus drivah?!? You're a regular riot, Alice! 

But... the guys who called the Air Force "Bus drivers" because of the look of their uniforms weren't ignorant civilians.  They were probably Marines or Army troopers.

[Smithsonia]

In my squadron we've got 12 military pilots. 6 or 7 flew in Vietnam... all over the North. One on the same mission that took down John McCain. Two of our military pilots have been to Iraq. One just got back. One flies Blackhawks and does National Guard Rescues. Two more of our pilots are seasoned Airline Captains. Two more did the same thing for a full airline career.

Boy Scouts of the Air... probably so... if the Boy Scouts were fire breathing armed and dangerous stone cold on target multiple tours over hostile territory under real life live fire and in a plane with no stealth, that now volunteer time to the country and fly all over Colorado's High Country in single engines and spent time looking for and helping with Steve Fosset/Katrina/Rita/Greensburgh, KS etc. in Cessnas... boy scouts. Yeah boy scouts. By the way, I'm not one of these guys. BUT, when they fly left seat I'm happy to climb on board as a scanner/observer/check pilot or paperwork assistant boy scout. I'll buy the pizza and beer after-hours just to listen to them talk, and I've got 3000 hours in Turbines and twins myself.

With regards;
ED OBRIEN

[SJFedor]

A few weeks ago, we stopped for pizza after a mission, and some mouthy jerk said to me "What's with you guys?  Couldn't you make it in the Real Air Force?"  I loudly said:  "Sure, I was making it just fine until that last incident.  I'm still not supposed to talk about it, but it was the one involving the bottle of Wesson Oil, the general's daughter, and a duck."

Mr. Bigmouth left the restaurant while everybody was laughing.  Not only the CAP guys but ALL the customers and staff.

OMG Kach, you just totally brightened up my day. I'm gonna hafta use that one at some point.

[Turk]

The Navy also calls the Coasties bus drivers. In the final analysis, it's really no big insult.

I'll say this - When in uniform I've had lots of strangers walk up and thank me.  I dunno if they know about CAP, and it really doesn't matter, either.  I also get polite nods from cops all the time, and even a salute now and then.

We serve.   

[♠SARKID♠]

Hi there everyone. I have recently run into some really mean people online over the past few weeks. Tell me if you guys have had similar experiences. When I tell them about CAP and what we do, I have had some people call it the "fake military" or "boyscouts in the air" I feel this is just really sad. We serve our country just as much as anyone else does. It just really hurts.

More than everybody else does

Fake Military - Its hard to say its fake when its an attachment of a military service.  If we weren't overseen by the AF, then yes they would have a valid insult.

Boy Scouts in the Air/Blue - We save somebody's life every three and a half days, provide relief for victims in the worst of disasters, and take millions of kilos drugs off the street that would otherwise ruin lives and communities.  Show me a Boy Scout that can say they that.

[lordmonar]

Who really care?

If the individuals don't like CAP....so fine....go away.

If the individual is someone we want to like us....say a County Sherrif, State OEM Director or someone we would want to/need to work with....then we need to find out why they don't like us and try to fix those issues.

Otherwise we will spend a lot of time and heart ache trying to make everyone to like us.....and that just ain't goinna happen.

Be professional.
Follow the rules.
Complete your assigned mission.

What Joe Blow and his freind at the local pub think of my organisation is no skin off my nose.

[wingnut]

When you are asked: " What is Civil Air Patrol?" I always begin with. . .

Our country was at WAR, the world was at War! and the good guys were loosing. Along came the volunteer Pilots, Mechanics, the Aviator Men and Women who flew against the German and Japanese (Yes Grass Hopper, Japanese). Men and Women who for the first days of WWII, flew their own planes, using their money for fuel, maintenance, food. CAP was born. The first Air Medals of WW2 then I morph into the 911 and who we are today, the Cadet Program, Homeland Security, etc, etc. Practice it ,I  can deliver it in a 3 minute lecture, and I mean Lecture. We are Moms Apple Pie, we are the American way, We are the Civil Air Patrol.

Excuse me while I stand up and salute!    :clap:

[cap235629]

More than everybody else does

Fake Military - Its hard to say its fake when its an attachment of a military service.  If we weren't overseen by the AF, then yes they would have a valid insult.

Be careful cadet when you make references to the attachment to the military.  CAP is NOT the military.  We are a CIVILIAN auxiliary to the United States Air Force.  Let's not assume an affiliation that is not there.  Outside of the cadet program most squadrons are at best "paramilitary" that is we are set up and organized along military lines but do not follow strict military protocol and regulations.  I am a 2LT GBD and on a SAR mission I would be the person in charge of the ground teams, not LTC Smith, Master pilot even though he "outranks" me.

I am also an honorably discharged active duty Army MP.  None of my CAP experiences even remotely compare to that experience.

Just a word of advice as to some of the factors that go into "How people treat us"

If we are looked upon in an unfavorable light, the first thing we must do is look in the mirror and be humble enough to acknowledge our own contributions to our image.  Walking around with an air of confidence is one thing, assuming the persona of a military member and equating our service to that of the armed forces of this great country is something else entirely.

I have a very good friend who I was in MCJROTC with while in high school.  VERY squared away cadet.  Top Gun of the rifle team, Captain of the Drill Team, Cadet Commander.  Went to Norwich and we thought he would be a general.  Reality, he dropped ROTC after sophomore year and never served a day in the military reserve or active duty.  He quickly realized that being a CADET was by no means close to the real thing.  I offer this to you as a teaching moment. 

How we present ourselves GREATLY impacts the perception people have of us.  Do not make the mistake of equating your experiences to that of our service members.  The public and more importantly VETERANS see right through it and it reflects horribly on our GREAT organization.



Flame away guys but I am only scratching the surface.

[♠SARKID♠]

Be careful cadet when you make references to the attachment to the military....Let's not assume an affiliation that is not there.

With all due respect sir, lets not flame other people's posts on frivolous semantics.