Joining

[ryecarrac]

Does anyone know if it is possible to join CAP with an other than honorable discharge. This was an old buddy of mine who is interested but not sure of the procedure. I think this is waiverable. He was a kid, 30 years ago. Has family, productive life. No trouble since then. Does anyone have any experience with this? Is it a difficult procedure? Thanks.

[vmstan]

Discharge from the military, or from CAP?

[Eclipse]

Yes - the key is to be honest on the app so the background check doesn't pop up a "surprise" or worse a lie.

[a2capt]

^^ What he says. Lay it all out, when the BG check jives I would say the chances are very good in ones favor.

[davidsinn]

A nice letter from the gaining commander probably couldn't hurt either.

[Cecil DP]

According to CAPR 39-2, Chap 3-2, you must have an Honorable Discharge, but a waiver by the National Commander or Executive Director can be granted. I would suggest having a letter asking for the waiver and explaining that there has been no adverse actions since. Also route the CAPF 12 through Wing HQ so that endorsements can be signed by the Chain of Command. 

[arajca]

What type of discharge did he have? General under Honorable Conditions, Medical, Entry Level, General under other than Honorable Conditions, Dishonorable? If one of the last two, I don't see a waiver being granted.

[SarDragon]

You left out the Big Chicken Dinner (BCD).

[BradM]

Hello, I just joined this forum and I'm thinking of joining CAP. I'm 47 years old. When I was in my mid 20s I had long hair and played bass in a heavy metal band during the hair metal days on the Sunset strip in Los Angeles. Luckily I didnt follow my band mates and get tattoos all over my arms and chest   But I did have a few wild times. In 1990 I got a DUI, did all I needed to do and satisfy it and went to the school required. I thought I learned from the that school what you could drink and still be legal. Well in 1994 or 1995 after having 4 ales in an evening at a pool bar I got another DUI I satisfied everything I needed to do for that and ever since both tickets have dropped off my record. I think the only other ticket I got since 1995 was a no seat belt ticket. Maybe one speeding ticket too. Now I work as an accountant for a retirement home. Would these two DUIs prevent me from joining CAP being that they are 20 and 15 years ago? Thank you.

[jimmydeanno]

Hello, I just joined this forum and I'm thinking of joining CAP. I'm 47 years old. When I was in my mid 20s I had long hair and played bass in a heavy metal band during the hair metal days on the Sunset strip in Los Angeles. Luckily I didnt follow my band mates and get tattoos all over my arms and chest   But I did have a few wild times. In 1990 I got a DUI, did all I needed to do and satisfy it and went to the school required. I thought I learned from the that school what you could drink and still be legal. Well in 1994 or 1995 after having 4 ales in an evening at a pool bar I got another DUI I satisfied everything I needed to do for that and ever since both tickets have dropped off my record. I think the only other ticket I got since 1995 was a no seat belt ticket. Maybe one speeding ticket too. Now I work as an accountant for a retirement home. Would these two DUIs prevent me from joining CAP being that they are 20 and 15 years ago? Thank you.

No, they shouldn't have any effect at all, unless they are a felony and are on your criminal record.  Even then, you can still probably be a member.  Visit the local unit, fill out the paperwork and answer the questions truthfully.  It never hurts to disclose the information to your squadron commander and let them guide you through the process.


EDIT:

Here's the applicable requirements: http://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/R039_002_A74FDA9552C2D.pdf (the criteria start on page 9)

3-2. Requirements for Membership. All applicants for senior membership in CAP must be accepted by the unit and higher headquarters and must meet the following criteria:
a.
General. Possess the desire, willingness, and capability to promote the objectives and purposes of CAP.
b.
Age. Be at least 18 years of age or be a member of the Armed Forces on active duty at any age.
c.
Citizenship. Be a citizen of the United States of America or an alien lawfully admitted for permanent residence to the United States of America and its territories and possessions or any lawfully admitted non-citizen residing in the United States specifically approved by the National Commander's designee (NHQ CAP/LMM).
1)
Those persons in "admitted for permanent residence" status must possess and present a current Alien Registration Receipt Card (Form I-151 or I-551) when making application for CAP membership. If an alien's status changes from "admitted for permanent residence" other then by reason of acquiring citizenship, the alien is no longer eligible for membership.
2)
Requests for waiver of the citizenship criteria for lawfully admitted non-citizens residing in the United States who were not admitted for permanent residence will be submitted through the wing and region commander along with a copy of the membership application to NHQ CAP/LMM. The waiver, if approved, will be only for the period of residence within the United States.
d.
Suitability. Subject to being waived by the Executive Director or National Commander, any one of the following may be the basis for rejection of membership.
1) Conviction of a felony by any court of record whether federal, state or military.
2) A pattern of arrests and/or convictions including but not limited to sex offenses, child abuse, DUIs, dishonesty and violence.
3) Discharge from the armed services under other than honorable conditions.
4) Falsification of information on the membership application.
5) Previously terminated or non renewed for cause from membership in CAP.
6) Any other unfavorable information brought to the attention of CAP officials at any level.

[BradM]

Thank you for answering me so quickly. Neither of the two were felonies. Working for a non-profit retirement home I had to go through a background check in 1997 and passed and was hired I've been at this job since Oct of 1997.

[BradM]

I just turned in my membership application and dues last night. Fingerprinting will be done next Monday

[Майор Хаткевич]

Congrats. Hopefully all will be ok on the app.

[BradM]

Congrats. Hopefully all will be ok on the app.

Thank you!

[Spaceman3750]

Congrats. Hopefully all will be ok on the app.

Don't worry, if not he'll get it back three months later simply marked "See regulations" :angel:

[BradM]

According to the below website CAP ribbon builder. One can be awarded the Air Medal. Is this possible? I only thought this version of the Air Medal was for active duty military personnel?

http://dafab.no-ip.info/CAPCode/BuildRackGIF.htm

[HGjunkie]

According to the below website CAP ribbon builder. One can be awarded the Air Medal. Is this possible? I only thought this version of the Air Medal was for active duty military personnel?

http://dafab.no-ip.info/CAPCode/BuildRackGIF.htm

Back in WWII, CAP personnel were authorized to be awarded the Air Medal.

[BradM]

Ah! I see thank you!

[HGjunkie]

Ah! I see thank you!

No problem! 

[Pylon]

According to the below website CAP ribbon builder. One can be awarded the Air Medal. Is this possible? I only thought this version of the Air Medal was for active duty military personnel?

http://dafab.no-ip.info/CAPCode/BuildRackGIF.htm

Back in WWII, CAP personnel were authorized to be awarded the Air Medal.

More accurately:  The Air Medal is one of the decorations that the DoD can technically award to civilians, even through to today.  However, the last common time that happened was when CAP members earned them in WWII.

[BradM]

What is the document name has based upon your schooling and profession what rank you are allowed to have upon first joining CAP? Thanks!

[Al Sayre]

I think CAPR35-5: http://members.gocivilairpatrol.com/media/cms/R035_005_489E25C089E93.pdf  is what you are looking for...

[Майор Хаткевич]

I think CAPR35-5: http://members.gocivilairpatrol.com/media/cms/R035_005_489E25C089E93.pdf  is what you are looking for...

You would think they could call it something like: http://members.gocivilairpatrol.com/media/cms/CAPR35-5.pdf

[a2capt]

That lame @$$ CMS they use just sucks. .. and they have way too dang many web sites. Click on the Join and you get bounced between three before you can do anything.

At least they have the document name incorporated into the whack job title now. It didn't used to be that way..

[Майор Хаткевич]

That lame @$$ CMS they use just sucks. .. and they have way too dang many web sites. Click on the Join and you get bounced between three before you can do anything.

At least they have the document name incorporated into the whack job title now. It didn't used to be that way..

Yea, but this is still....lame.

[BradM]

Thank you!

[SarDragon]

The file for viewing has the whacked file name. The file inside the ZIP file for download has the doc name. Strange, but that's how they are doing it.

When they first started putting regs online, their file naming was inconsistent at best. I suggested that they pick one style and stay with it, offered choices, based on ones they had already used, and made a specific suggestion that would, IMHO, offer best ease of use. That system (e.g. M039_001.pdf) is still being used today.

[a2capt]

They pass the blame buck and call it a CMS problem.

I'd say it's a weakness.. and for things I've come across, CAP NHQ must be the ones to fall sucker to getting this foisted on them, 'cause I've never run into whacked and jacked up file names like this.

[Al Sayre]

Thank you!

You're welcome.  See what you started

[BradM]

Thank you!

You're welcome.  See what you started

I just wanted to see after I complete Level I if I could skip 2nd Lt and be either a 1st Lt or a Captain. I do accounting for a retirement home in Los Angeles since 1997. Before that from 1993 to 1997 I worked at a tax office. Before that I was an office manager and accountant for a medical equipment company. Too bad I didnt finish my B.A. but I do have an A.A. So it looks like as a Finance Officer I can start as a 1st Lt. Thats what I wanted to know. Now I kick myself for not finishing my 4 yr degree. I could have been a Capt right off the bat!!

[RVT]

I just wanted to see after I complete Level I if I could skip 2nd Lt and be either a 1st Lt or a Captain. I do accounting for a retirement home in Los Angeles since 1997. Before that from 1993 to 1997 I worked at a tax office. Before that I was an office manager and accountant for a medical equipment company. Too bad I didnt finish my B.A. but I do have an A.A. So it looks like as a Finance Officer I can start as a 1st Lt. Thats what I wanted to know. Now I kick myself for not finishing my 4 yr degree. I could have been a Capt right off the bat!!

f. Finance Officers. Upon successful completion of Level I, the unit commander may initiate a CAPF 2 on qualified finance officers, recommending appointment to an appropriate grade, as outlined below.
(1) First Lieutenant. A financial professional with an associate's degree in accounting and 2 years verified work experience in the accounting profession or a high school diploma and 5 years of verified work experience in the accounting profession.
(2) Captain. A financial professional with a bachelor's degree in accounting and 2 years verified work experience in the accounting profession or a master's degree in accounting, certified public accountant (CPA) or certified management accountant (CMA).
(3) Major. A financial professional with a master's degree in accounting, certified public accountant (CPA) or certified management accountant (CMA) that has served 1 year time-in-grade as a captain may be appointed to the grade of major.

[EMT-83]

I would be very careful how you express your desire for instant promotion to your squadron commander. "Here's my application, where's my promotion" isn't likely to be very well received.

Understand that promotions aren't automatic and are at the discretion of the commander.

[Майор Хаткевич]

I would be very careful how you express your desire for instant promotion to your squadron commander. "Here's my application, where's my promotion" isn't likely to be very well received.

Understand that promotions aren't automatic and are at the discretion of the commander.

A lot of folks will also usually expect you to perform in the capability offered.

[Camas]

I just wanted to see after I complete Level I if I could skip 2nd Lt and be either a 1st Lt or a Captain.

I would be very careful how you express your desire for instant promotion to your squadron commander. "Here's my application, where's my promotion" isn't likely to be very well received. Understand that promotions aren't automatic and are at the discretion of the commander.

Before we worry about skipping grades I'd be looking for a team player who can fit in and make a significant contribution to the success of your unit. Those going up for promotions to captain and higher other than duty promotions should be carefully scrutinized as to how their skills and qualifications add to the strength of their unit and not because they feel they're entitled to a promotion. Do you truly have something noteworthy to contribute? This is a question that both your commander and your group or wing promotion board should be asking. For the record I am a member of my wing awards and promotions committee.

[BradM]

All of your comments are very good advice! I didnt even know about this until last Monday night when another new member applicant who is in the army reserve (I think) as a legal officer asked me what rank I was going to start with. I just thought it would be a 2nd Lt. after being a Senior member for 6 months and he told me he was going to be a Captain because he will be the Legal Officer and he knew my main specialty track would be a Finance Officer. Also, the Squadron I am joining doesnt have a Finance Officer right now. I will ask this gentleman how he broached the subject with the Sqdrn Commander before I bring it up myself.

[Майор Хаткевич]

A thing to remember, is that we're not the military, so the grade really doesn't matter in the long run.

Most folks come in at SMWOG, and hit 2d Lt in 6 months.

Some like me get a bump based on cadet achievement, in my case to 1st Lt (upon turning 21), but it could range from 2d Lt to Capt.

There's quite a few Majors walking around who haven't even hit 30.

In CAP I've noticed the grade will mean little to others, at least initially. If I'm active when turning 21 and becoming a 1st Lt, I'll still be considered "a kid" by most of the other officers, even those at the same grade. What changes people's opinion will be my actions and maturity, not the cloth on my shoulders.

[BradM]

I noticed that the Nation Headquarters processed my dues check so I logged on to eServices and I was able to get my username, CAPID, and log in

[Майор Хаткевич]

I noticed that the Nation Headquarters processed my dues check so I logged on to eServices and I was able to get my username, CAPID, and log in

In that case, congratulations, my fellow Senior Member Without Grade (SMWOG)!

[SarDragon]

All of you new folks are SMs, not SMWOG. NOWHERE in any CAP reg is that abbreviation used. NOWHERE. The spelled out text is used a couple of times to specify the group of adult members who haven't been promoted, since the term Senior Member applied to all adult members, but that's it. Your official designation is SM.

[Майор Хаткевич]

That is true, I should have specified.

SMWOG is just a fast way to identify that you are a SM in CAP, but hold no Grade.

Don't use it to sign into the meetings or anything, simply write SM.

[BradM]

I looked on another new members page in my squadron on eServices to see what he is completing. He joined 4 months earlier than I. I have already done the OPS-OPSEC and the EO. I see he has "Foundations". What is this?

And, for the cadet protection, I can do this online then bring the test results in to the squadron commander to review? Will doing this online test automatically have it updated to my profile like the EO did? or does that happen after I go over it with the commander?

Thank you!

[a2capt]

"Foundations" means that Level 1, CPPT and OPSEC have been completed. Once all of your prerequisites are recorded, your training record will reflect "Foundations" as well.


..and yes, once your CPPT is ratified by the CC, you'll get that credit as well.

[spacecommand]

Foundations Course and CPPT are done at the unit level.
Once completed your unit commander/PD officer etc will review CPPT with you and discuss various scenarios (eg "what would you do in this situation?") and answer any questions you would have.  Once completed, they will file a CAPF 11 with NHQ stating your completion of CPPT and Foundations course.

All covered here:
http://www.capmembers.com/cap_university/level_i_foundations.cfm

[EMT-83]

Why do squadrons make things so difficult for new members?

How about a "Welcome to CAP" package that explains all this stuff and how to get it done?

[SarDragon]

A couple of things here:

Level I is an umbrella title that covers:
Foundations Course
CPPT
OPSEC
EO training

@EMT-83 - the Great Start Handbook pretty well covers all of that.

[EMT-83]

Both Great Start and Fast Start have good information for new members, but neither explain how to complete the training required for Level 1 or even where to find the information.

[Short Field]

Level I is completed and recorded in eServices when the Summary Conversation has been conducted and the Fm 11 submitted to National.  You need to be talking to your Professional Development Officer and Squadron Commander.

[BradM]

Why do squadrons make things so difficult for new members?

How about a "Welcome to CAP" package that explains all this stuff and how to get it done?

This morning I received this email 10 days after my dues checked was cashed. So CAP NHQ does send something

"Welcome to CAP! Your CAP membership materials were shipped today via Media mail. If you have not received them within two weeks, please contact us at mailroom@capnhq.gov . Thank you."

[Майор Хаткевич]

Why do squadrons make things so difficult for new members?

How about a "Welcome to CAP" package that explains all this stuff and how to get it done?

This morning I received this email 10 days after my dues checked was cashed. So CAP NHQ does send something

"Welcome to CAP! Your CAP membership materials were shipped today via Media mail. If you have not received them within two weeks, please contact us at mailroom@capnhq.gov . Thank you."

I'd be all up for:

Digital Delivery.
Priority Mail - Add $5 to the membership...

Media Mail is so slow, its ridiculous.

[SarDragon]

Most of the stuff I've sent and received via Media Mail in the last few years has taken a week or less to get delivered.

Size matters; larger packages take longer.

[Майор Хаткевич]

Most of the stuff I've sent and received via Media Mail in the last few years has taken a week or less to get delivered.

Size matters; larger packages take longer.

One book (like on Amazon from 3rd party sellers), will be fine. Sending anything larger than a 3/4" thick envelope can take 2+ weeks.

[BradM]

I'm thinking I will get some CAP pamphlets and the CAP binder that zips up.

[vmstan]

You are correct. As well as your CAP library card.

[BradM]

I rec'd my Getting Started materials yesterday   How long does it take to get your plastic membership card? Will Air Force bases allow you to come on base to purchase a uniform with the temporary paper ID card? Or must I have the permanent plastic ID card? Thanks.

[Short Field]

It is a CAP membership card - not a Identification Card.  You will need a picture ID card (drivers license) plus your membership card to get on base.  You should be able to get on with the  temporary membership card.  Some gate guards mistake the CAP picture membership card as a ID card and will allow you on base.

[Fubar]

I rec'd my Getting Started materials yesterday   How long does it take to get your plastic membership card? Will Air Force bases allow you to come on base to purchase a uniform with the temporary paper ID card? Or must I have the permanent plastic ID card? Thanks.

Depends on the base. Some bases require you to pre-arrange your visit through your chain of command so that you're name will be on a list at the guard gate. Other bases will simply accept your CAP ID and your driver's license.

[spacecommand]

The best thing to do is check if your local base has a CAP squadron and ask them,  if not, contact the base and ask them about the procedures to use the shop.  Each base is different on how CAP members get on.

[BradM]

Anyone in So. Calif. ever go to March Air Reserve Base in Riverside?

[BradM]

After looking at my new materials I rec'd yesterday. I was thinking the Cadet Officers shoulder boards look better than the Senior epaulets Too bad we Seniors cant use the Cadet Officer shoulder boards with metal Air Force officer insignia

[spacecommand]

After looking at my new materials I rec'd yesterday. I was thinking the Cadet Officers shoulder boards look better than the Senior epaulets Too bad we Seniors cant use the Cadet Officer shoulder boards with metal Air Force officer insignia

Regular epaulets, <$8 , shoulder boards >$29.

[BradM]

Regular epaulets, <$8 , shoulder boards >$29.

The price doesnt phase me if it was optional I'd prefer the cadet officer shoulder boards with metal officer insignia.

[peter rabbit]

Why do squadrons make things so difficult for new members?
How about a "Welcome to CAP" package that explains all this stuff and how to get it done?

we developed a word document with links to all the steps for level one and beyond, and email it to all new members. we took a document from PD best practices and enhanced it.

[DakRadz]

After looking at my new materials I rec'd yesterday. I was thinking the Cadet Officers shoulder boards look better than the Senior epaulets Too bad we Seniors cant use the Cadet Officer shoulder boards with metal Air Force officer insignia

Careful sir...

[BradM]

After looking at my new materials I rec'd yesterday. I was thinking the Cadet Officers shoulder boards look better than the Senior epaulets Too bad we Seniors cant use the Cadet Officer shoulder boards with metal Air Force officer insignia

Careful sir...

why do you say that? do you think by me putting it out there it may come true?

[DakRadz]

  :clap:
Oh, this will cause a uniform thread.
Made me chuckle.

I was warning you about the reactions of SMs on here.

Several of them are going to spit coffee upon the screen.

[BradM]

:clap:
Oh, this will cause a uniform thread.
Made me chuckle.

I was warning you about the reactions of SMs on here.

Several of them are going to spit coffee upon the screen.

Oh I see. When I joined I had a goatee but I wanted to wear the U.S. Air Force blues uniform as well. So I now have a mustache. Part of sacrificing my goatee I wouldnt mind paying the extra few bucks for these cadet officer shoulder boards. It would make the uniform look a little better in my opinion.