Good Morning several members of our squadron have purchased the black fleece. After repeated washing and drying the jacket is still leaving black lint over everything. Did anyone else experience this problem?
Thank you.
Yes. It is much like house breaking a pet:
"Bad fleece! BAAAAAD fleece! Back in the wash for you".
The thing that really sucks is when your spouse drives the car after you and gets out with black fleece droppings in a vertical bar down their white shirt (and doesn't notice until after their amused coworkers). You'll hear about it for days. The seat belt is a major fleece remover.
V/r
Spam
Yes, The Rothco Fleece is crap and no amount of washing will ever stop the shedding. Need to find a a good Polar Black Fleece if you don't want to be embarrassed.
Along the same lines, I had my knit dark blue polo go through the wash with some soft baby clothes. I'll likely never get the fine white lint off it.
So far, I haven't had too much trouble with the black fleece, but I've been babying it so it doesn't have to be washed too often. It helps that I'm a Wisconsin-grown boy now living in Kentucky, so I pretty much wear short sleeves year-round.
I bought a Rothco fleece (only because it was the only thing I could afford, it's also super soft) and I haven't had this problem. I have, however, had problems with holes opening along the seams.
I turn my Vanguard fleece inside out when washing. It helps with the shedding, but it's only resulted in about a 50% reduction.
Thank you for all your replies. Problem solved Vanguard sent me a return packing slip and will issue a refund. So far they do not have a replacement vendor for a new jacket. Vanguard did acknowledge that this is a known problem with the jacket.
I have two civilian black fleece jackets - one from Weatherproof Garment Company, and the other from Port Authority. Neither of them have any shedding problems.
The Black Fleece I was issued by the Air Force was made by Peckham.
100% Polyester Synthetic Fleece.
So if a fleece is 'Small R', is it made to fit over 'Small R' ABU's, or is it sized like a 'Small R' ABU blouse? Basically, if I wear a 'Small R' ABU blouse, should I get a 'Small R' fleece, or a 'Med R' fleece?
I would go with the medium, especially if you order the fleece from VG.
I wear a foliage Green Rothco and never had shedding problems.
Quote from: CAPSOC_0pur8ur on December 12, 2017, 03:31:08 AM
So if a fleece is 'Small R', is it made to fit over 'Small R' ABU's, or is it sized like a 'Small R' ABU blouse? Basically, if I wear a 'Small R' ABU blouse, should I get a 'Small R' fleece, or a 'Med R' fleece?
Negative.
It is not made to be worn that way, we're wearing it in a manner for which it was not designed.
The lighter-weight fleece was never meant to be worn over the ACU/ABU.
ECWS is a nested system of layers, cotton BDU/ABU isn't designed to be in the mix.
An oversized Polartec 300-weight Series ECWCS Cold Weather Fleece Jacket can be worn nicely over the ABU/ACU.
The lighter-weight one, not so much. Arm holes are smaller, etc.
Quote from: CAPLTC on February 02, 2018, 09:34:19 PM
Quote from: CAPSOC_0pur8ur on December 12, 2017, 03:31:08 AM
So if a fleece is 'Small R', is it made to fit over 'Small R' ABU's, or is it sized like a 'Small R' ABU blouse? Basically, if I wear a 'Small R' ABU blouse, should I get a 'Small R' fleece, or a 'Med R' fleece?
Negative.
It is not made to be worn that way, we're wearing it in a manner for which it was not designed.
The lighter-weight fleece was never meant to be worn over the ACU/ABU.
ECWS is a nested system of layers, cotton BDU/ABU isn't designed to be in the mix.
An oversized Polartec 300-weight Series ECWCS Cold Weather Fleece Jacket can be worn nicely over the ABU/ACU.
The lighter-weight one, not so much. Arm holes are smaller, etc.
Uh, standard wear in the AF/Army is wearing the fleece over the blouse. I wear a medium/X-long fleece over chest size 36 ABUs for reference.
Quote from: CAPLTC on February 02, 2018, 09:34:19 PM
Quote from: CAPSOC_0pur8ur on December 12, 2017, 03:31:08 AM
So if a fleece is 'Small R', is it made to fit over 'Small R' ABU's, or is it sized like a 'Small R' ABU blouse? Basically, if I wear a 'Small R' ABU blouse, should I get a 'Small R' fleece, or a 'Med R' fleece?
Negative.
It is not made to be worn that way, we're wearing it in a manner for which it was not designed.
The lighter-weight fleece was never meant to be worn over the ACU/ABU.
ECWS is a nested system of layers, cotton BDU/ABU isn't designed to be in the mix.
An oversized Polartec 300-weight Series ECWCS Cold Weather Fleece Jacket can be worn nicely over the ABU/ACU.
The lighter-weight one, not so much. Arm holes are smaller, etc.
The fleece is most certainly made to be worn over the ABU/BDU. That is why it has name tapes and rank.
Quote from: kwe1009 on February 05, 2018, 08:13:05 PM
The fleece is most certainly made to be worn over the ABU/BDU. That is why it has name tapes and rank.
Incorrect.
That is not how ECWCS was designed (Google it).
We beta'd that stuff for PEO-Soldier in 01/02.
Quote from: kwe1009 on February 05, 2018, 08:13:05 PM
The fleece is most certainly made to be worn over the ABU/BDU. That is why it has name tapes and rank.
100% incorrect.
That is not how ECWCS was designed nor how it's supposed to be used. (
Google it).
Quote from: CAPLTC on February 05, 2018, 10:23:11 PM
Quote from: kwe1009 on February 05, 2018, 08:13:05 PM
The fleece is most certainly made to be worn over the ABU/BDU. That is why it has name tapes and rank.
100% incorrect.
That is not how ECWCS was designed nor how it's supposed to be used. (Google it).
That may be the use for which it was designed, but the practical reality is that it isn't used that way. AFI 36-2903 states that it will be worn only as an outer garment. TM 10-8415-236-10 (Army TM for the ECWCS) says that it can be worn nested within other layers of the ECWCS, or as an outer garment for utility uniforms. We may be wearing it in a manner for which it was not designed, but so are the Army and the Air Force.
Quote from: CAPLTC on February 05, 2018, 10:23:11 PM
Quote from: kwe1009 on February 05, 2018, 08:13:05 PM
The fleece is most certainly made to be worn over the ABU/BDU. That is why it has name tapes and rank.
100% incorrect.
That is not how ECWCS was designed nor how it's supposed to be used. (Google it).
Can you provide a CAP or USAF reference to back up your statement?
The fleece is listed as an outer garment in CAPM 39-1, AFI 36-2903, and the CAP ABU Wear Guidance memo. I am also a SNCO in the Air Force and have never seen anyone wear the fleece under their ABU shirt. It doesn't make sense that it goes under the ABU since it has rank and name on it. No undergarment has mandated rank and name on it.
So is the former AF Chief of Staff wearing it wrong in this picture:
(http://soldiersystems.net/blog1/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/CSAF-in-ABU.jpg)
Both the AFI and CAPR says it's an outer-garment. What is/was done in other branches is a moot point and irrelevant.
Yeah roger, I am familiar with USAF and Army regs.
That's not what I said.
The point was that the GEN-III Level III Fleece Jacket referenced does indeed fit funny/oddly because the lighter-weight fleece was never designed to be worn over a BDU/ABU/ACU/OCP jacket.
There were 2 different styles of fleece jacket:
- One was designed to go over bulkier under-layers, it's 300-weight Polartec. It has armpit vents/zippers.
- The one in question was designed as an under-layer or stand-alone, it's 200-weight Polartec Thermal Pro with even lighter side panels. Does not have armpit vents/zippers.
But whatever, you're right, it's moot.
That's an irrelevantly pedantic point to argue about. It's an outer garment, plain and simple.
Held my breath and put mine through the wash this weekend. It survived with minimal shedding. Whew. We'll see how it makes it through the next/end-of-season wash.
Quote from: chuckmilam on February 12, 2018, 01:41:58 AM
Held my breath and put mine through the wash this weekend. It survived with minimal shedding. Whew. We'll see how it makes it through the next/end-of-season wash.
Good luck,
I've have mine about three years, numerous washings, and several lint rollers later, it still turns the grey upholstery of my truck seat black. I don't even bother wearing it in the truck anymore.
Good Morning regarding the shedding. If you recently bought the fleece from VG and after several washings it still sheds VG will return your money. They are aware of the problem, so I do not understand why they continue to sell defective merchandise.
I refused to pay Vanguard for a subpar Rothco jacket that sheds! I found this jacket online for around $30 (I got mine for $24 with free shipping from Galls.com). This jacket is polar fleece, but also has an inner liner to make the jacket more water-resistant. I guess the only downside I see for this jacket is you need to have the hook and loop sewn on (it's included, but not sewn on). Anyways; Here's the link for anyone interested >>> https://www.galls.com/tru-spec-polar-fleece-jacket?PMSRCE=GAPLA&gclid=CjwKCAiA-9rTBRBNEiwAt0Znw-UCNXwn6s7MO4Lm3vyQzx8JMyc35INwbLTYhhI83-ZIygaVCv3tghoClTIQAvD_BwE
That fleece looks unauthorized, the shoulders are supposed to be non-fleece (not sure exactly what the material it is. Nylon?). See this picture, posted before:
(http://soldiersystems.net/blog1/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/CSAF-in-ABU.jpg)
Quote from: hamburgee on February 14, 2018, 10:30:20 PM
That fleece looks unauthorized, the shoulders are supposed to be non-fleece (not sure exactly what the material it is. Nylon?). See this picture, posted before:
(http://soldiersystems.net/blog1/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/CSAF-in-ABU.jpg)
39-1 disagrees
6.1.12.2. Fleece will be acquired commercially, and will be similar in design and construction to
the USAF-style Sage Green Fleece. Members will wear fleeces that only have a very small or no
manufacturer's emblem that is externally visible.
Quote from: abdsp51 on February 14, 2018, 10:53:23 PM
Quote from: hamburgee on February 14, 2018, 10:30:20 PM
That fleece looks unauthorized, the shoulders are supposed to be non-fleece (not sure exactly what the material it is. Nylon?). See this picture, posted before:
(http://soldiersystems.net/blog1/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/CSAF-in-ABU.jpg)
39-1 disagrees
6.1.12.2. Fleece will be acquired commercially, and will be similar in design and construction to
the USAF-style Sage Green Fleece. Members will wear fleeces that only have a very small or no
manufacturer's emblem that is externally visible.
When it comes to the BLACK fleece for corporate uniforms the jacket I posted appears to be correct with the limited guidelines listed in 39-1. The black fleece has been around for several years and pre-dates the roll-out of the ABU for CAP. When it comes to the ABU Foilage Green fleece the product I posted WOULD NOT be allowed (but plenty of those styles can be found surplus rather than Vanguard). I wear both Corporate and USAF Style, although I tend to wear ABUs/Blues more often than not so I didn't want to spend crazy money on a black fleece; otherwise, I would've bought this one I also found! >>> https://www.drto.com/products/ujf-b04f107-warmor-fleece-ecwcs-jacket <<< This one is pretty much an exact copy of the Foliage Fleece but looks to be a much higher quality than Vanguard's current black fleece.
I've heard that the VG fleece sheds a lot from quite a few people, does anyone know if this one would?
https://uspatriottactical.com/ecwcs-gen-iii-level-3-usaf-fleece-jacket-foliage/ (https://uspatriottactical.com/ecwcs-gen-iii-level-3-usaf-fleece-jacket-foliage/)
From what I heard and seen only the fleece jackets made by the company Rothco (both green and black) have the shedding issue. I found a surplus, military issued foilage green fleece on eBay brand new/in the package for $27 & free shipping! That seems to be the best way to go in my opinion!
I have the Rothco fleece, and I haven't had any shedding problems. It's been through at least 10 washes and still holds up great. Maybe Vanguard gets even cheaper fleeces from Rothco?
Quote from: hamburgee on February 14, 2018, 10:30:20 PM
That fleece looks unauthorized, the shoulders are supposed to be non-fleece (not sure exactly what the material it is. Nylon?).
I think he's wearing an Army issued Fleece, looks like the one I got from CIF.
Quote from: shuman14 on February 15, 2018, 11:54:08 PM
Quote from: hamburgee on February 14, 2018, 10:30:20 PM
That fleece looks unauthorized, the shoulders are supposed to be non-fleece (not sure exactly what the material it is. Nylon?).
I think he's wearing an Army issued Fleece, looks like the one I got from CIF.
As long as it's black he's good to go and authorized
Quote from: abdsp51 on February 16, 2018, 01:14:03 AM
As long as it's black he's good to go and authorized
Well clearly in the picture it's green. ???
Quote from: shuman14 on February 16, 2018, 03:31:57 AM
Quote from: abdsp51 on February 16, 2018, 01:14:03 AM
As long as it's black he's good to go and authorized
Well clearly in the picture it's green. ???
You wear the green fleece with the ABU and the black fleece with the Blue BDU's.
The gentlemen in the picture are Active Duty Air Force wearing ABU's.
Yup, we're done.
Click.