Jewish Holidays and CAP Activities

[dogboy]

In the California Wing, activities are often scheduled on Jewish Holidays, making in difficult for Jewish members to participate.

Judaism is not monolithic and level of observance varies. Here's a list of holidays that Jews should not participate in CAP activities except emergency services.

Note there are other holidays on which some believe work should be avoided.

The Jewish calendar is lunar so the date of a holiday on the Gregorian Solar calendar will vary from year to year. Dates for 2009 shown

_________

Passover: No work permitted on April 9-11, 15-16. Work is permitted only on April 12-14 with certain restrictions. Sunset of April 8 through nightfall of April 16

Shavuot: Sunset of May 28 through nightfall of May 30

Rosh Hashanah: Sunset of September 18 through nightfall of September 20

Yom Kippur: Sunset of September 27 through nightfall of September 28

Sukkot: No work permitted on Oct. 3-4. Work is permitted on Oct. 5-9 with certain restrictions. Sunset of October 2 through sunset of October 9

Shemini Atzeret: Sunset of October 9 through nightfall of October 10

Simchat Torah: Nightfall of October 10 through nightfall of October 11

Chanukah: This is not a holiday on which work is forbidden. However it can be an important family holiday. Sunset of December 11 through December 19

_______________________
Of these holidays, virtually all Jews observe Passover, Rosh Hashanah, and Yom Kippur. Observance of other holidays varies.

I'm not a Rabbi. I'm trying to provide common-sense information about these holidays. If your opinion differs, please share it.

Here's a link to the dates of holidays for the next several years
http://www.jewfaq.org/holiday0.htm

[Eclipse]

If a CAP activity is scheduled on a day in which a respective religion prohibits work or requires attendance of a ceremony or service, then the member should simply not come to CAP.

With only 52 weeks in a year, if we start scheduling around every religion, we'll never do anything. 

[Flying Pig]

In my experience, some activities are scheduled around dates outside the control of CAP ie. an airshow, or the availability of the members teaching the course. Summertime = Encampment, long weekends may equal SLS/CLC.  Summertime for Mountain Flying Courses and SAREX's to guarantee good weather and crappy engine performance.   Dont know what to tell ya'.  I know several Jewish members who are very successful in CAWG.  Was this just intended as a public service announcement for the Jewish members, or are you trying to address an issue?

[Eclipse]

Separate, but related, is the assumption that just because its a holiday weekend or some "special" event is happening we should avoid those weekends too.

Superbowl Sunday, to me, is just another Sunday.

And just this last weekend we had a SAREX moved "...because it was Labor Day...". however it turns out most of those who would have participated were planning on doing so because it was Labor Day.

[jimmydeanno]

Many CAP activities already have flexibility for CAP members to be able to observe their religious preferences.  For example, many CAP encampments begin on A Saturday or Sunday.  For many Jews, travel is prohibited on Saturday. 

How ever will they participate in Encampment if they can't get there the first day?  Well, as long as they complete 80%, they're good.

Are you Muslim?  Need to take time to pray throughout the day?  Fine.  Complete 80% and your good.

CAP doesn't discriminate against people practicing there faiths.  You're more than welcome to.  You're a volunteer and if your volunteer time conflicts with your faith, then don't do the volunteer stuff.  Just sayin...

[MIKE]

If a CAP activity is scheduled on a day in which a respective religion prohibits work or requires attendance of a ceremony or service, then the member should simply not come to CAP.

Agreed... You shouldn't try to cater to everyone. That being said those Winter Encampments that get held starting on the 26th of December doesn't sit well with me either.  However; I've also been in a squadron where nearly all the "critical personnel" were Jewish, so no meetings on Jewish holidays.  Probably could have met, but I would have been the only senior available in most cases.

[Major Carrales]

The precarious subject of religion and CAP. 

While I support the religious beliefs of the membership, I must point out that Religion is one of the most personal and passionate of all human endeavors.  In that regard, our practicing it is sort of a "one on one" with our deity...despite the congregation's gathering.

This being said, I cannot impose my Religious beliefs on anyone and would not allow any given Feast Day, Holy Day of Obligation or major celebration of the Roman Catholic Church to cause a CAP activity to be canceled.   I would simply refrain from the CAP activity.

Because of this, it is my belief that others who practice religious worship calling for fasting or strict observance to the Sabbath (be it Saturday or Sunday) to do the same.  After all, it is the sacrifice of the individual to observe the day, not everyone else.   

By the way, as an interesting piece of trivia only slightly related to this thread, a student informed me  today that Doritos are not Kosher.  It seems certain pork products go into their production.

[DBlair]

A bit of a sidenote while on this topic, it reminds me of comments made by a potential member (an Orthodox Jew*) who was highly-qualified, but had difficulty with the issue that most training and events took place on the weekends. She ultimately did not join because of this as she realized that if she wanted to get involved beyond just weekly unit meetings and progress within the program (activities, SLS, ES training, etc), that weekends would be an issue.

Any suggestions of how to deal with this issue? The potential member was very interested and it was the Saturday thing that was the show-stopper.


Interesting Fact:
While Jewish Law requires total adherence to very detailed Shabbat (Sabbath) and Chagim (Holidays) laws and so forth, the reason why some may consider ES missions to be an exception is that Jewish Law allows someone to break these laws if it can be considered that it was an attempt to save a life. That being said, the use of a phone or any electrical device is not allowed, so I'm not sure how they would be notified of the mission in the first place, but the exception does indeed exist for them to participate. (Just thought I'd mention this as it was explained to us via a potential member.)

*Key to Jewish Denominations:
"Reform" = Does not see Jewish law as binding and thus is very lax in observance.
"Conservative" = Follows some of the laws, etc.
"Orthodox" = Sees all Jewish law as binding and believes in absolute adherence.

[Eclipse]

Any suggestions of how to deal with this issue? The potential member was very interested and it was the Saturday thing that was the show-stopper.

Not really - some things are what they are.

I just had a potential member call me and say he worked evenings and weekends, including the meeting nights of his local squadron.  Once you're invested its easier to be a remote presence, but in the first 6 months to a year, darn near impossible if you can't come to meetings and training.

[FW]

Most members who are observant will not participate on those holidays they consider holy.  Each individual must weigh the positives and negatives to membership.  I am not that religious however, there are some holidays I will be with family and, not at mission base for a sarex or the weekly meeting.  I do have priorities and, CAP comes in 2nd certain times.

This practice has not stopped me from "full" participation in CAP. 

[Spike]

^ Agreed!

Like what was said above, if we start catering to every religion, we will never get anything done.

I would rather make it policy that CAP units not meet on Federal Holidays.  Some do not, but others still do.  Since most FED Holidays fall on a Monday, it comes down to "should I go to CAP, or should I eat hot dogs with the family??"

[AirAux]

I have had similar problems with Seventh Day Adventists as their Sabbath is Saturday and that is always a big training day for CAP, SLS, CLC, almost everything.  It didn't work out in this case.  They just couldn't get the required training to stay active and participate.  Choices and priorities just gotta be made.

[arajca]

I've had Chaplains and other religiouns members tell me I can't hold training classes on Sunday. My typical response is they need to deconflict, not me. I have adjusted the schedule to allow for services, usually by moving the start time back an hour or two. At the same time, we have members attending who have a six+ hour drive after the training is over to consider as well.

My OPINION is that if religious folks have a problem with how a course is scheduled, they need to step up and direct one that meets their scheduling needs.

[Cecil DP]

Reminds me that several years ago, I was told by a former Region Commander that the National Boards used to be held in the fall, but that due to the many religious holidays during that period it was permenently moved to the August to avoid the conflict.

[dogboy]

Judaism is not monolithic and level of observance varies. Here's a list of holidays that Jews should not participate in CAP activities except emergency services.

Passover: No work permitted on April 9-11, 15-16. Work is permitted only on April 12-14 with certain restrictions. Sunset of April 8 through nightfall of April 16

Rosh Hashanah: Sunset of September 18 through nightfall of September 20

Yom Kippur: Sunset of September 27 through nightfall of September 28

_______________________

Of these holidays, virtually all Jews observe Passover, Rosh Hashanah, and Yom Kippur. Observance of other holidays varies.

As I explained Judism is not monlithic, and there is great variation in how holidays are celebrated. I indicated the three MOST important holidays: Passover, Rosh Hashanah, and Yom Kippur.

Activities on these days make it essentially impossible for Jew to attend. These are NINE days out of the whole year.

The California Wing conference is scheduled during Rosh Hashanah.

My suggestion would be that units with potentially a strong Jewish presence at least consider the calendar. Other units should at least honor these three holidays.

[dogboy]

Interesting Fact:
While Jewish Law requires total adherence to very detailed Shabbat (Sabbath) and Chagim (Holidays) laws and so forth, the reason why some may consider ES missions to be an exception is that Jewish Law allows someone to break these laws if it can be considered that it was an attempt to save a life. That being said, the use of a phone or any electrical device is not allowed, so I'm not sure how they would be notified of the mission in the first place, but the exception does indeed exist for them to participate.

As I said, Judaism is not monolithic and there are differences of opinion on Jewish laws. For example, in Brooklyn, very Orthodox Jews run an volunteer ambulance service that runs on the Sabbath and holidays. Their opinion is that electrical or mechanical devices can be used as part of the "save a life" exception.

[Spike]

The California Wing conference is scheduled during Rosh Hashanah.

My suggestion would be that units with potentially a strong Jewish presence at least consider the calendar. Other units should at least honor these three holidays.

Why??  We are supposed to leave religious teachings at the door.  We are not supposed to be the local church.  Canceling meetings due to Jewish Holidays is as much of a hit against a non-Jew as having a meeting during a Jewish Holiday is to a Jew. 

Lets all leave our religion out of CAP.  If you can't make a meeting due to Religion, all that is needed is a phone call or email to your Commander stating; "I can not make it to the meeting on ________".  PERIOD

If we started this, then We would never get any work done.

I feel for those that can not attend CAP due to religion, but you made a choice regarding your religion, and that choice was yours and only yours.  No one is stopping you from coming or going, and if they are.......that becomes an IG issue. 

As for those members who don't meet on a particular religious holiday (of which you are not affiliated), tell your Commander: "that practice MUST stop".  If he or she will not listen, Go to the next level in the chain of command.

Now....the only time CAP units should not meet.......FEDERAL Holidays. 

[notaNCO forever]

The California Wing conference is scheduled during Rosh Hashanah.

My suggestion would be that units with potentially a strong Jewish presence at least consider the calendar. Other units should at least honor these three holidays.

Why??  We are supposed to leave religious teachings at the door.  We are not supposed to be the local church.  Canceling meetings due to Jewish Holidays is as much of a hit against a non-Jew as having a meeting during a Jewish Holiday is to a Jew. 

Lets all leave our religion out of CAP.  If you can't make a meeting due to Religion, all that is needed is a phone call or email to your Commander stating; "I can not make it to the meeting on ________".  PERIOD

If we started this, then We would never get any work done.

I feel for those that can not attend CAP due to religion, but you made a choice regarding your religion, and that choice was yours and only yours.  No one is stopping you from coming or going, and if they are.......that becomes an IG issue. 

As for those members who don't meet on a particular religious holiday (of which you are not affiliated), tell your Commander: "that practice MUST stop".  If he or she will not listen, Go to the next level in the chain of command.

Now....the only time CAP units should not meet.......FEDERAL Holidays.

So your squadron has meetings on Christmas if your meeting night is that night?

[dogboy]

Been to any CAP activities on Good Friday, Easter, or Christmas lately?

Permit me to clarify. Nobody suggests that every CAP activity can avoid every Jewish holiday. Obviously meetings go on regardless of Jewish holidays.

But couldn't something as unique as a yearly Wing Conference be held some other time than the most Holy Days in the Jewish calendar?

As for leaving religion at the door, I'm afraid I must disagree. Many members of CAP, including myself, carry our religion with us everywhere. We don't press it on others, we don't refer to it, but it's always there.

[Spike]

Been to any CAP activities on Good Friday, Easter, or Christmas lately?

Permit me to clarify. Nobody suggests that every CAP activity can avoid every Jewish holiday. Obviously meetings go on regardless of Jewish holidays.

But couldn't something as unique as a yearly Wing Conference be held some other time than the most Holy Days in the Jewish calendar?

As for leaving religion at the door, I'm afraid I must disagree. Many members of CAP, including myself, carry our religion with us everywhere. We don't press it on others, we don't refer to it, but it's always there.

Thursday, January 1     New Year's Day
Monday, January 19    Birthday of Martin Luther King, Jr.
Monday, February 16*    Washington's Birthday
Monday, May 25    Memorial Day
Friday, July 3**    Independence Day
Monday, September 7    Labor Day
Monday, October 12    Columbus Day
Wednesday, November 11    Veterans Day
Thursday, November 26    Thanksgiving Day
Friday, December 25    Christmas Day

You will see that Almost all Federal Holidays in 2010, will fall on a Monday, and two fall on a Friday and 1 on a Thursday...... So, Christmas Day.....No CAP Meeting (Federal Holiday).  Easter and Good Friday are Catholic/ Christian Holidays, I would have a meeting, and plan to.  BUT isn't Easter always on a Sunday (so that's two of your examples, and lets talk about Good Friday.  Good Friday falls on April 2, 2010.  I have meetings on Mondays.  Most every other CAP unit have meetings on a day OTHER THAN FRIDAY!!!

So your examples are mute points at the least. 

As far as impressing your religion on other......that is exactly what you are doing when you DEMAND to have CAP activities canceled on JEWISH Holidays.