"If you go to church, then you can go to the CAP meeting"

Started by RiseAbove, February 25, 2008, 08:30:32 PM

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RiseAbove

Hi All,

If you'd let me introduce myself... I'm a 14 (nearly 15)-year old who's very interested in joining my local CAP squadron.  My mom is very against this, as she thinks it is too much like the USAF and somehow, CAP will find a way to force me to enlist.

Anyways,  I was talking to her today and she gave a me a deal.  I am an atheist, I believe all the typical beliefs of an atheist and she knows it.  She told me that if I go to church with her every other week, then I can submit a membership application.  I find this to be very manipulative, because I know that no matter how many sermons I hear, I am not going to change my beliefs until I have a personal epiphany, which can only happen inside myself, and it seems very unfair that in order to join a good-will (which is a part of the Catholic morals) organization like CAP, I have to waste my time each Sunday that I could spend studying CAP material or doing schoolwork.

I was wondering what you're opinion on the subject was, and if there is anything you could suggest that I say to her...

Thank You Very Much,
Zach Tucker
C/Tucker
Goddard Cadet Squadron
NER-MA-007

dwb

Maybe she could talk to the adult leaders at your local CAP unit...?

Although service is obviously important in CAP (it's one of our core values), it doesn't necessarily follow that cadets will join a military service.  The CAP cadet program isn't really like the Air Force at all.  Sure, we wear the same uniforms and there are some common moral themes, but it's definitely not an indoctrination of any kind.

Also, speaking of morals, mentioning the character development requirements, and having your mom talk to the adult(s) that lead the character development sessions in the unit, may help reassure her.

As a last ditch effort, you can always just tell her you'll pick up the $31 membership fee and to give it a year to see what she thinks.

Hawk200

Looks like you have two options. Go to church, and be able to join CAP, or don't.

As for what to say to your mother, there isn't much other than yes or no. It sounds like she is looking out for you. Let her, and be thankful she is. She is presently accountable for you in many different ways. Fighting that will only bring you a lot of hassles.

♠SARKID♠

Good to see your interest in joining CAP!

Have you taken her to a meeting yet?  That would be a good opportunity for her to talk to the senior members and sort her misconceptions out.  By the sound of things, you're fully aware that you won't be forced into the Air Force, or any branch of service for that matter.  Just remind her that you're a civilian, and will always be a civilian.  You'll learn pretty quickly that we don't actually have massive contact with the active duty AF (some squadrons more than others, depending on members and meeting places).  Believe me, if we were forcing people into the Air Force, we'd have a lot less people joining our organization.

Al Sayre

Be sure to introduce her to the Squadron Chaplain.  Even if you are not a religious person, they are generally pretty nice folks that you can talk to.  as for the deal with your mom, I am not a very religious person, but I always figured a little churchin' never hurt anyone.  You might learn something there about yourself or about others, and it will give you a chance to challenge your beliefs and either strengthen or modify them.
Lt Col Al Sayre
MS Wing Staff Dude
Admiral, Great Navy of the State of Nebraska
GRW #2787

Major Lord

Zach,

Welcome to CAP! One of the downsides of being a teenager and living at home is that you are subject to the parental-unit's rules. ( Besides, you were probably baptized a Catholic, so the only way to quit is to die or be excommunicated...) I think it is safe to say that most adults have to listen to something they don't agree with, or even violently object to, for at least once an hour once per week. ( Well, at least if they are married....) Tough it out. When you are no longer under mom's roof, you get to make the rules and face the consequences of your own actions. For the time being, you have a get out of jail free card-enjoy it while it lasts, the stark realities of adulthood will be on you soon enough.

I have always thought the problem with Atheism is that it requires so much faith! One little slip and you are at least technically an Agnostic...

Major Lord


"The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the iniquities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he, who in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of darkness, for he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who would attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know my name is the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon thee."

RiseAbove

Thank you very much for the support!  I've been talking to my Mom and, pending some research, it sounds as if she thinks that CAP's benefits outweigh the "risks" ;)

And you have a great point Major Lord, I would bet that most adults do have to and I would not be unhappy to sacrafice some of my time in order to keep my Mom happy in order to apply to my unit.

Thanks Again,
Zach Tucker
C/Tucker
Goddard Cadet Squadron
NER-MA-007

Major Lord

Zach,

That's great! By the way, I don't think the risk of your enlisting because of CAP is all that great. The vast majority of Cadets don't join the service. If you do, get a degree and get a commission. I think most of the Air Force enlisted people out there will tell you that there is a significant quality of life difference as an Officer. Tell your mom you want to be a pilot so you can help all those people in foreign lands get food when they have emergencies, and that the Air Force spends most of its time in good clean fun, singing KumBahYah, hanging out with the Catholic Chaplains ( Most of whom will NOT be like the priests you saw in civilian life)  and such.... (Ixnay on the Ocketsray, Uclearnay Ombays, and uisecray isslemays....)

What unit will you be joining?

Also, I was just joking about Athesim in  my post above, So I don't really need to get flamed by any more Atheists out there- I pray that god gives you a atheists a sense of humor...darn, I did it again....I will just stop right here!

Major Lord
(No relation to the creator of the universe)
"The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the iniquities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he, who in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of darkness, for he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who would attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know my name is the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon thee."

RiseAbove

Im thinking of joining the Worcester Comp. Squadron NER MA022

Thanks all again

EDIT- I, myself, am not worried about enlistment, I had done enough research and read enough stories to know not to think that.  The most involved I would get in the military in my life would be the USAF Reserves.
C/Tucker
Goddard Cadet Squadron
NER-MA-007

Al Sayre

Look, you can tell your mom you've been involved with CAP for less than a day and your already talking to the Lord online.      :D
Lt Col Al Sayre
MS Wing Staff Dude
Admiral, Great Navy of the State of Nebraska
GRW #2787

♠SARKID♠

Quote from: RiseAbove on February 25, 2008, 10:44:09 PM
Im thinking of joining the Worcester Comp. Squadron NER MA022

Thanks all again

EDIT- I, myself, am not worried about enlistment, I had done enough research and read enough stories to know not to think that.  The most involved I would get in the military in my life would be the USAF Reserves.

I just remembered - We had a new person join our squadron not two weeks ago and she was in the same boat as you.  Her mom thought she was being drafted and didn't want her daughter being shipped over seas to go fight the war.  A quick explanation of who we are and what we do cleared it right up and she's on track to being a great cadet!

MIKE

Quote from: RiseAbove on February 25, 2008, 10:44:09 PM
Im thinking of joining the Worcester Comp. Squadron NER MA022

Hey... my old unit!  Let me know if I can be of assistance getting you in touch with the squadron commander or other info on the squadron.  I was formerly a cadet in the unit back when it was a Cadet Squadron... Now that the unit has absorbed Goddard Composite Sq, you may have your choice of meeting locations/nights.
Mike Johnston

JohnKachenmeister

I wanted to be an Atheist once.

But I quit when I found out they don't have any holidays.
Another former CAP officer

RogueLeader

Quote from: JohnKachenmeister on February 26, 2008, 02:43:09 PM
I wanted to be an Atheist once.

But I quit when I found out they don't have any holidays.

Sure they do, its 1 April. >:D >:D >:D >:D
sorry, I couldn't it help it.  the Devil made me do it.  opps
WYWG DP

GRW 3340

LittleIronPilot

You sound like a squared away young man how is articulate and has some inkling of your own views and beliefs.

All I can say is that CAP would be glad to have such as you.

As for your mother....let me just bow out now, because I find forced religious dogma to be...well like I said, let me bow out.



Quote from: RiseAbove on February 25, 2008, 08:30:32 PM
Hi All,

If you'd let me introduce myself... I'm a 14 (nearly 15)-year old who's very interested in joining my local CAP squadron.  My mom is very against this, as she thinks it is too much like the USAF and somehow, CAP will find a way to force me to enlist.

Anyways,  I was talking to her today and she gave a me a deal.  I am an atheist, I believe all the typical beliefs of an atheist and she knows it.  She told me that if I go to church with her every other week, then I can submit a membership application.  I find this to be very manipulative, because I know that no matter how many sermons I hear, I am not going to change my beliefs until I have a personal epiphany, which can only happen inside myself, and it seems very unfair that in order to join a good-will (which is a part of the Catholic morals) organization like CAP, I have to waste my time each Sunday that I could spend studying CAP material or doing schoolwork.

I was wondering what you're opinion on the subject was, and if there is anything you could suggest that I say to her...

Thank You Very Much,
Zach Tucker

mynetdude

lol @ all those Atheism jokes :)

sorry a bit off topic, but being forced to go to church could cause some resentment but then again thats a silly thing to habor.

I like articulate young maturing teens/adults these are the kinds to have in CAP :)

Flying Pig

As a parent, I say do what your mother wants, your a kid.  Besides, if God doesn't exist, you have nothing to worry about by going.  It will be like going to the movies.

RiseAbove

Thank you for all your advice,

I (of course) had to accept my Mom's deal, and I got it cut down to once a month :).  I went to my first meeting last night, and although it was pretty light because of the snow falling, it was very interesting to come in and see how things are run.  I got to see a demonstration of an ELT and see how the MAWG net is run at night.

All in all, things are looking very good, and I think the meeting this sunday at the airport might seal the deal.

Thank You All,
Zach Tucker
C/Tucker
Goddard Cadet Squadron
NER-MA-007

SDF_Specialist

Well I'm not one to get involved in issues between cadets and their parents. However, I can understand where she is coming from, and going to. Your mother believes that church is a great thing, and to those who do believe in Jesus, it is a good thing. Since you do not believe in Jesus, I will not tell you to believe. That is your decision. I don't think it's a matter of your mother pushing her beliefs onto you, but rather she wants you to meet her half way. You want to be a CAP cadet, and that's great. She wants you to hear the things that give her comfort. It's more of a "meet me half way" type deal. I would say to grin and bear it. What's an hour or two one day a week?
SDF_Specialist

Major Lord

I can see where he could come into conflict with his Mom. She may insist for instance, that he recite the Creed, take communion, or commit acts that would be as offensive to the Churches law as it is to his own sense of ethics. Mom's wish notwithstanding, don't take a false oath, but go and keep your mom company. I think every lad is at some point forced into going to church, but you have reached the age where you had a duty and an obligation to form a right conscience, so your "soul" is your own now. I wonder how much mom's pressure contributed to your disdain for the church? I have found that Catholic schools generate more atheists than communism!

Go have fun! Take O-rides, go to activities, promote every 60 days, and run ES missions ( My son ditched his 8th grade graduation to go run a real mission with me-good times!)

Major Lord
"The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the iniquities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he, who in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of darkness, for he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who would attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know my name is the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon thee."