Flight Officer rank for Flight Suit and TPU

[DNall]

You tell him there's a no more than a couple hundred 18-21yo SMs in the country, all spread between FO/TFO/SFO, so some insignia is not being made cause it'd cost an enormous amount to do it & that money is better spent on other things. You tell him those grades promote in as little as 3mos & no more than 18mos so insignia changes regularly, and it would be an isanely expensive proposition even if it were available. Then you tell him he's a young guy in CAP & our young adult members always get screwed over & over. It won't change when he's a 1Lt, it won't change when he's a Major in his late 20s & 50yos that've been a third of the time he has think he's an incompetent punk kid. You pay your dues, literally &figuratively, and do you job with the options you do have.

[Pylon]

Either way, there is no real need for our 18-21 seniors to wear what would obviously look like warrant rank.

No more or less real need for our 21-112 seniors to wear what would obviously look like officer rank.

[afgeo4]

You tell him there's a no more than a couple hundred 18-21yo SMs in the country, all spread between FO/TFO/SFO, so some insignia is not being made cause it'd cost an enormous amount to do it & that money is better spent on other things. You tell him those grades promote in as little as 3mos & no more than 18mos so insignia changes regularly, and it would be an isanely expensive proposition even if it were available. Then you tell him he's a young guy in CAP & our young adult members always get screwed over & over. It won't change when he's a 1Lt, it won't change when he's a Major in his late 20s & 50yos that've been a third of the time he has think he's an incompetent punk kid. You pay your dues, literally &figuratively, and do you job with the options you do have.

Umm DNall... I like how you said that to you, some members are more important than others... perhaps you should tell all the Colonels and above that they're not important and we should yank their rank insignia because there are VERY few of them too. This has got to be the stupidest explanation ever. Not to mention insulting to our members. Quit it! ALL members are important, no matter what age they are or how many of them there are. It isn't too expensive to create rank insignia for them. They were simply overlooked by our command staff. That's all. It's a shame. A real shame.

[Eeyore]

I completely understand where DNall is coming from there. As a 22 y/o CAP member it is very difficult to be taken seriously by any member over the age of 28 or so. They think that since I am "just a kid" I don't have any clue what I am doing and my opinions generally don't matter.

Funny thing is, my full time job doesn't see it that way at all and are willing to pay me for what I know. 

Usually I don't fight it and just sit back until they figure out that I am pretty capable, even more capable than a lot of them. Put in my dues doing little jobs and doing them well until I'm good enough to join the adults at the big boy table.

[afgeo4]

I completely understand where DNall is coming from there. As a 22 y/o CAP member it is very difficult to be taken seriously by any member over the age of 28 or so. They think that since I am "just a kid" I don't have any clue what I am doing and my opinions generally don't matter.

Funny thing is, my full time job doesn't see it that way at all and are willing to pay me for what I know. 

Usually I don't fight it and just sit back until they figure out that I am pretty capable, even more capable than a lot of them. Put in my dues doing little jobs and doing them well until I'm good enough to join the adults at the big boy table.

You, my friend, are exactly the reason why this way of thinking is wrong. Good people don't come in age brackets. Respect should be given to those who earn it, not those over a particular age range.

[Hawk200]

I completely understand where DNall is coming from there. As a 22 y/o CAP member it is very difficult to be taken seriously by any member over the age of 28 or so. They think that since I am "just a kid" I don't have any clue what I am doing and my opinions generally don't matter.

Funny thing is, my full time job doesn't see it that way at all and are willing to pay me for what I know. 

Usually I don't fight it and just sit back until they figure out that I am pretty capable, even more capable than a lot of them. Put in my dues doing little jobs and doing them well until I'm good enough to join the adults at the big boy table.

A very mature viewpoint. Sometimes it's easier to just let others see your capabilities than to demand they respect them.

You remind me of a cadet in a previous unit. He had an amazing ability when it came to DF. Many seniors insisted that since he was so young, he couldn't be all that good. I've watched him walk right up to a particular aircraft or even a practice ELT to turn them off. When a guy can go directly to a particular aircraft when there are a dozen on the airfield, and hit the right one every time, you know he has some talent. There were a few seniors that disliked him for it. I ignored them, and would usually pick his brain on the how he did it. Learned a few things, too.

In your case, I'm hoping that it doesn't take long for people to see your skills. I'd be proud to work with you.

[afgeo4]

I too agree with letting your light shine through. However, I am all for creating a culture of respect toward all members in CAP.

Somehow I don't see anyone saying that there aren't many C/Col out there and yet they have insignia made for them. How do we simply allow ourselves to just OMIT flight officers as if they don't exist, don't pay their dues and don't work as hard as everyone else?

After all, an FO working hard and impressing others still wont get him/her proper, uniform grade insignia.

[DNall]

Hey I started out in CAP as a lowly FO. I know very well what that's all about. It doesn't change a lot when you're a 21yo 1Lt or 30yo Maj. It sucks, let me tell ya.

I'm just stating facts that they don't make the stuff cause it isn't economical. There's about as many full Cols in CAP as there are FO/TFO/SFO combined. And, they are decision makers that force issues like this.

It's not my fault the org routinely forgets about folks like FOs, females, and cadets when it makes uniform decisions. I wish that weren't the case, but it is & we have to work around it as much as we're able to.

[afgeo4]

Hey I started out in CAP as a lowly FO. I know very well what that's all about. It doesn't change a lot when you're a 21yo 1Lt or 30yo Maj. It sucks, let me tell ya.

I'm just stating facts that they don't make the stuff cause it isn't economical. There's about as many full Cols in CAP as there are FO/TFO/SFO combined. And, they are decision makers that force issues like this.

It's not my fault the org routinely forgets about folks like FOs, females, and cadets when it makes uniform decisions. I wish that weren't the case, but it is & we have to work around it as much as we're able to.

If I was a good lawyer (I'm not even a bad one), I could probably make a case for age discrimination in this case (perhaps not an intentional though).