civil air patrol base access

[slimshady]

Hello everyone i saw an old post about someone claiming they were able to get a dbids card for being in cap so he could get base access and i was wondering if anyone knew how to do that because my old unit is on an airforce base and i am going to be transferring back to them but today i tried to go on and they said civil air patrol is not allowed on base cause they cant scan my id card and i need a cac card or dbids card.

[lordmonar]

The procedures differ from wing to wing and base to base.

I would contact your old unit on how to get base access.

[Holding Pattern]

Hello everyone i saw an old post about someone claiming they were able to get a dbids card for being in cap

No.

The most likely thing that happened is they were sponsored by someone, which was the reason they got an access card, NOT because they are in the CAP. That being said, your CAP base liaison will be able to solve the base access problem one way or another.

Many bothans died to bring you this information.

[slimshady]

So even though cap has just been made officially part of the airforce total force they still wont give us dbids or cac cards?

[Гугл переводчик]

So even though cap has just been made officially part of the airforce total force they still wont give us dbids or cac cards?

Depends on the base. The base we meet on has a list of all members, and we are able to get DBIDS cards of which one of the commanders of the base is the sponsor

[RogueLeader]

No.  While we are part of the Total Force (when acting as the Air Force Auxiliary- only while on an AFAM), we are still civilian volunteers.  While there maybe several bases that issue DBIDS cards to certain personnel, that by no means guarantees use unlimited access to any base that we want.

Rumor has it- so take it for what you paid for it- is that we MIGHT be getting them.  No I don't have a source for it, and I wouldn't go begging for them through your chain of command- or around it either.

At FE Warren AFB, my CAPID and Drivers License is good enough to get me on base when I need it.

[Holding Pattern]

So even though cap has just been made officially part of the airforce total force they still wont give us dbids or cac cards?

A base access has always been discretion of the base commander.

[slimshady]

It just seems like there is alot of people not talking to each other at this base macdill afb in tampa fl since there is a cap unit on the base but then they tell me cap is not allowed on the base.

[MSG Mac]

When I was stationed at MacDill from 2003-2006, there was a Squadron on the base. Not to mention the FLWG HQ. But MacD also has the tightest security of any base I've ever been on, probably because of the two four star commands (CENTCOM, and Special OPs) which are located on the base. 

[slimshady]

For years my cap id was good enough to get on but once in awhile i get denied its very strange.

[Holding Pattern]

It just seems like there is alot of people not talking to each other at this base macdill afb in tampa fl since there is a cap unit on the base but then they tell me cap is not allowed on the base.

Send a politely worded email to the on base CAP squadron commander asking if there is anything he can do to assist with base access. Don't go into details like DBIDS/CAC, just talk about base access.

[lordmonar]

It just seems like there is alot of people not talking to each other at this base macdill afb in tampa fl since there is a cap unit on the base but then they tell me cap is not allowed on the base.

Who exactly is "they"?   Like I said.  Contact the unit and work out your base access issues.  They will tell you what channels you need to go through.

As has been stated....each base does it differently.

At Nellis they issue DBIDS to those who need regular access.  Our squadron (that meets on base) is the POC for the whole wing.
Some bases just keep a list of names.
Some bases just use a CAPID card and a Driver's license.
Some bases have other procedures.

So...once again.   Contact the unit and ask them for assistance.

[slimshady]

It is so ridiculous we volunteer our time and are not paid, we should have all the same benefits as civilian employees do and contractors that are given cac cards, they claim we are officially part of the air force until it comes time to do anything for us. I understand obviously cadets shouldn't have cac cards but senior members definitely should.

[lordmonar]

It is so ridiculous we volunteer our time and are not paid, we should have all the same benefits as civilian employees do and contractors that are given cac cards, they claim we are officially part of the air force until it comes time to do anything for us. I understand obviously cadets shouldn't have cac cards but senior members definitely should.

Most civilan contractors don't have CACs......they have DBIBS.
As for why?   Well 90% of CAP members simply don't need that level of access.
We can and do get access when we have a valid need for....because the USAF does recognize that we are valued unpaid volunteer professionals.

Hence the reason why you ask the local unit on how you effect that access.

[slimshady]

That's like saying you have to have a valid need to shop at the Commissary or go to the gym, it should just be a benefit for serving in civil air patrol certainly if civilian employees can.

[lordmonar]

That's like saying you have to have a valid need to shop at the Commissary or go to the gym, it should just be a benefit for serving in civil air patrol certainly if civilian employees can.

When base security is at stake.......yes I can say that!

First off as far as I know civilian employees (contractors for sure) don't have access to the commissary or the gym.   So why should the run of the mill lowest common denominator CAP member?

We by regulation have access to AAFES clothing sales.  We have by regulation the ability to use base facilities to do CAP stuff.   

I think that is enough.

I do agree that CAP and USAF can and should work together to make it easier to access the base when needed....and to standardize those procedures across all bases.   But unlimited access to all the benefits that an employee or a dependent has.......I don't see the real need for that.

[goblin]

Hello everyone i saw an old post about someone claiming they were able to get a dbids card for being in cap so he could get base access and i was wondering if anyone knew how to do that because my old unit is on an airforce base and i am going to be transferring back to them but today i tried to go on and they said civil air patrol is not allowed on base cause they cant scan my id card and i need a cac card or dbids card.

They won't issue CACs until you start using periods.

[slimshady]

We go through an FBI background check so that takes care of security for senior members and most of the time they do let me on base with just my cap id and once your on you are good to go they let you shop at the commissary and go to the gym or whatever else you wanna do on there. and i don't think its a lot to ask for volunteering to help the USAF and even buying all of our own supplies and uniform items.

[slimshady]

ooh how fun a grammar nazi, ill frustrate myself over punctuation next time i take a english test.

[raivo]

most of the time they do let me on base with just my cap id and once your on you are good to go they let you shop at the commissary and go to the gym or whatever else you wanna do on there

If you think you're having trouble getting on base now, wait until they discover you're using base access to take advantage of privileges you don't have.

[THRAWN]

We go through an FBI background check so that takes care of security for senior members and most of the time they do let me on base with just my cap id and once your on you are good to go they let you shop at the commissary and go to the gym or whatever else you wanna do on there. and i don't think its a lot to ask for volunteering to help the USAF and even buying all of our own supplies and uniform items.

When you become and Air Base Wing commander, you can make that decision.

[THRAWN]

It is so ridiculous we volunteer our time and are not paid, we should have all the same benefits as civilian employees do and contractors that are given cac cards, they claim we are officially part of the air force until it comes time to do anything for us. I understand obviously cadets shouldn't have cac cards but senior members definitely should.

Conversations like this are the reason why the Air Force will never give CACs to SMs....

[slimshady]

They let me do it they asked my id card and i showed it to them and they didn't have a problem with it so obviously its at there discretion.

[raivo]

Or they didn't care, or didn't know any better.

Trust me on this one - just because somebody doesn't prevent you from doing something that you probably shouldn't be doing, doesn't mean you're actually allowed to do it.

[lordmonar]

We go through an FBI background check so that takes care of security for senior members and most of the time they do let me on base with just my cap id and once your on you are good to go they let you shop at the commissary and go to the gym or whatever else you wanna do on there. and i don't think its a lot to ask for volunteering to help the USAF and even buying all of our own supplies and uniform items.

So what's the problem?   Your base is violating AFIs, DOD regulations and Federal Law by allowing you to go to the commissary and the Gym or what ever else you want to do.   I thought you were saying we couldn't do that? 

Bottom Line.

The base commander is mandated with controlling who gets access to his/her base and how that access is managed.
You are advocating (If I'm not mistaken) that we should have the same access to base just because we paid $70 to NHQ and passed a very basic criminal record check.

I don't thing that is a good enough reason.   

YMMV

[THRAWN]

They let me do it they asked my id card and i showed it to them and they didn't have a problem with it so obviously its at there discretion.

Please quit before you get any further behind. Read this entire thread, especially the responses by abdsp51 and lordmonar.

[MSG Mac]

So even though cap has just been made officially part of the airforce total force they still wont give us dbids or cac cards?
[/quote/]

Retirees don't get CAC cards either

[slimshady]

Excuse me for recognizing the countless volunteer hours of civil air patrol members and hoping to get recognized for that someday with the same benefits they give to children just cause they are dependents.

[lordmonar]

They let me do it they asked my id card and i showed it to them and they didn't have a problem with it so obviously its at there discretion.

Well....not really.  They are just hirelings that don't know any better.
You as CAP officer should know better though.  There is a CAP regulation that covers it.

http://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/R147001_9603D70A69128.pdf

[THRAWN]

Is this guy for real?!!? Want the bennies? Enlist or marry a military member or get adopted by one. Lordmonar just explained the types of rules, laws and regulations that apply here. CAP ain't covered by them....

[slimshady]

FBI fingerprint background is not basic and its not just the membership fee idk how many hundreds ive spent over the years on uniform items and other things and its obviously not against federal law if they let me do it. And the problem is that the gate guards dont ever seem to know what the regulation is and sometimes don't let me in but most the time do.

[THRAWN]

This is demonstrating that you know as much about law enforcement as you do about DoD regs....good luck.

[slimshady]

Its amazing the disrespect even its own members show for civil air patrol you guys act like we are just some boy scout or 4H club.

[lordmonar]

Excuse me for recognizing the countless volunteer hours of civil air patrol members and hoping to get recognized for that someday with the same benefits they give to children just cause they are dependents.

As an Air Force Brat, Retired USAF SNCO and a member of CAP.     Most CAP members....even the very busy valuable ones.....have not sacrifices nearly as much as most USAF families.....so you are urinating up a rope on that one.

The USAF does recognize our contributions to their mission.   They give us access to their bases to do CAP business, they allow us to wear their uniform, they fund us yearly to the tune $24M yearly (IIRC).

This is whining that because CAP does a lot for the USAF then YOU and every other LCD member should have full access and privileges to USAF bases.     And that is just not right.

[goblin]

Successful troll is successful

[slimshady]

They don't let us wear there uniform we have to wear the outdated bdu and even for the blues we have many differences that set us apart. and we sacrificed our time and money so its not much to ask for and i will spend my whole cap career to fight for that and i know you will all laugh and think we don't deserve cause you all seem to not take cap seriously at all.

[lordmonar]

FBI fingerprint background is not basic

Yes....it is.

and its not just the membership fee idk how many hundreds ive spent over the years on uniform items and other things

So......you spend hundreds over they years....but a cadet sponsor member does not even have to buy a polo shirt or the full dues.

and its obviously not against federal law if they let me do it.

Like every clerk and cashier AAFES, MWR and the Commissary is fully versed in all the laws and regulations that apply.   You don't even know the contents of a single page CAPR that says you should not do it.   Ergo your argument is invalid.

And the problem is that the gate guards dont ever seem to know what the regulation is and sometimes don't let me in but most the time do.

Well.....you know Security Forces are not usually taken from the deep end of the pool.  (sorry could not help myself).   Seriously....like I said, sometimes they just don't know, sometimes they don't care and sometimes the base commander has authorized.

Bottom line.....by CAP regulations you should not be using any base facilities (other then uniform sales) unless you are actually have a valid MSA, or authorization by the base commander.

[THRAWN]

Lordmonar is one of the most involved members that I've ever run across. His work at all levels and in all fields is beyond compare. I would put in 60+ hours a week on top of my regular job. I know I wasn't alone. To say that we don't take CAP seriously is beyond off base.

BLUF: this is a fight that you will lose. Use your energy where it can do some good. If you want to wear the regular uni, enlist. We're the auxiliary of the Air Force and we're attired appropriately.

[lordmonar]

They don't let us wear there uniform we have to wear the outdated bdu and even for the blues we have many differences that set us apart. and we sacrificed our time and money so its not much to ask for and i will spend my whole cap career to fight for that and i know you will all laugh and think we don't deserve cause you all seem to not take cap seriously at all.

I laugh at you because you are funny.  Because I do take seriously.  And whining and stamping your feet over going to the gym and using the commissary is not very professional.

A nice white paper listing out the benefits CAP brings to the USAF and how expanding our use of base facilities could enhance those benefits would be more effective.

YMMV.

And with that....I'm out.

[lordmonar]

Lordmonar is one of the most involved members that I've ever run across. His work at all levels and in all fields is beyond compare.

Suck up.

[THRAWN]

Lordmonar is one of the most involved members that I've ever run across. His work at all levels and in all fields is beyond compare.

Suck up.

Aw c'mon...I'm not even trying yet....wait til the balloon bouquet arrives....

[slimshady]

If you did take it seriously you wouldn't be so against CAP members being given some benefits, the world wouldn't end if we were fully accepted by the USAF.

[lordmonar]

Lordmonar is one of the most involved members that I've ever run across. His work at all levels and in all fields is beyond compare.

Suck up.

Aw c'mon...I'm not even trying yet....wait til the balloon bouquet arrives....

Was that from you!?   I thought I had secret admirer! 

[lordmonar]

If you did take it seriously you wouldn't be so against CAP members being given some benefits, the world wouldn't end if we were fully accepted by the USAF.

You got SOME benefits.  Sure the world would not end if CAP were given more....but it is not gonna end if we don't.
And if you want to be fully accepted......don't come across as some spoiled entitled child.

Sorry....I know I just said I was done....but anyways.....good night.

[slimshady]

I'm not coming across like a child I'm coming across like someone who wants civil air patrol members to be appreciated and given the respect we deserve even if fellow members like yourself are so against it for whatever reason.

[Pace]

This is going nowhere.
*lock*