New Army uniform

[PHall]

I always thought it was silly to see people on the same FOB in 5 different uniforms: ACU, ABU, MARPAT-Desert, NAVPAT-Desert, and BDU-Desert. 

There should be Theater specific camouflage and everyone in that Theater should be in it.

As to Garrison work uniforms, solid olive drab works for me and if the Sea Services want to use blue when afloat... no harm, no foul.

When you become the CG for the AOR you can make that decision. But until then...

[lordmonar]

I always thought it was silly to see people on the same FOB in 5 different uniforms: ACU, ABU, MARPAT-Desert, NAVPAT-Desert, and BDU-Desert. 

There should be Theater specific camouflage and everyone in that Theater should be in it.

As to Garrison work uniforms, solid olive drab works for me and if the Sea Services want to use blue when afloat... no harm, no foul.

Sounds good....now here are the unintentional consequences.

Cost.   Someone has got to pay for it......and unit's budgets are pretty tight these days.

Response Time.   Coast Guardsman Johnson gets tagged for a special TDY advising army pukes on how to do drug busts on a river in Ascrackastand....He's got to get the required theater specific uniform, get his name and rank sewn on and get to the airport to make his NLT date.

It sounds simple.....but it is not.....that was the whole idea for the original Army Universal Camouflage Pattern in the first place.   One uniform that works okay in all AORs.   

[antdetroitwallyball]

For the record, blue is a poor uniform color choice for working on the water. It makes you less visible if you fall overboard. Ironic that a service so hell bent on all its personnel wearing $2000 in bright orange survival PPE slathered in reflective tape would also wear a uniform that has a completely opposite effect.

[Eclipse]

I've heard this direct from POs and Chiefs - fall into the water in NWUs without something shiny on and they will never find you.

[SarDragon]

I've heard this direct from POs and Chiefs - fall into the water in NWUs without something shiny on and they will never find you.

Hear this from a PO1 with some sea time - if you fall into the water wearing the olde Navy working uniforms, you are equally difficult to see. The NWU doesn't make a big change in visibility in the water.

People working on the weather decks are generally outfitted in PPE anyway, so it's not as big an issue as everyone is making it out to be.

I think this horse has been beaten long enough, don'tcha think?

[AlphaSigOU]

I think this horse has been beaten long enough, don'tcha think?

It's a uniform thread... that equine cadaver hasn't been pulverized yet!

[blackrain]

Well if they approve Multi-Cam or a close derivative I still have my uniforms available...and I saved the patches/nametapes..... the real advantage if it is selected DOD wide will be the better availability for all. As uniforms go mine was pretty durable.

Right now I loathe paying any more on anything ACU.

[SARDOC]

I've heard this direct from POs and Chiefs - fall into the water in NWUs without something shiny on and they will never find you.

Hear this from a PO1 with some sea time - if you fall into the water wearing the olde Navy working uniforms, you are equally difficult to see. The NWU doesn't make a big change in visibility in the water.

People working on the weather decks are generally outfitted in PPE anyway, so it's not as big an issue as everyone is making it out to be.

I think this horse has been beaten long enough, don'tcha think?

I've spent many a day on the flight decks in a Aircrew survival vest or a float coat.

[Shuman 14]

I always thought it was silly to see people on the same FOB in 5 different uniforms: ACU, ABU, MARPAT-Desert, NAVPAT-Desert, and BDU-Desert. 

There should be Theater specific camouflage and everyone in that Theater should be in it.

As to Garrison work uniforms, solid olive drab works for me and if the Sea Services want to use blue when afloat... no harm, no foul.

When you become the CG for the AOR you can make that decision. But until then...

General Clune does have a nice ring to it... doesn't it?     

[Shuman 14]

I always thought it was silly to see people on the same FOB in 5 different uniforms: ACU, ABU, MARPAT-Desert, NAVPAT-Desert, and BDU-Desert. 

There should be Theater specific camouflage and everyone in that Theater should be in it.

As to Garrison work uniforms, solid olive drab works for me and if the Sea Services want to use blue when afloat... no harm, no foul.

Sounds good....now here are the unintentional consequences.

Cost.   Someone has got to pay for it......and unit's budgets are pretty tight these days.

Response Time.   Coast Guardsman Johnson gets tagged for a special TDY advising army pukes on how to do drug busts on a river in Ascrackastand....He's got to get the required theater specific uniform, get his name and rank sewn on and get to the airport to make his NLT date.

It sounds simple.....but it is not.....that was the whole idea for the original Army Universal Camouflage Pattern in the first place.   One uniform that works okay in all AORs.

But the problem is that "one" pattern really only works in the fertile crescent during the spring time.

You mention cost, I would submit to you that having one olive drab garrison/work uniform and one theater camo uniform will be cheaper in the long run. If you put a reasonable wear-out date on the current uniforms, no ones' clothing allowance is going to be over taxed.

Back in the BDU days, no one had desert BDUs ... until they deployed. It would be much the same. So Shipmate Johnson would go to a MOB site, and as part of his/her pre-deployment certification to go to Ascrackastan (that was funny BTW) would be being issued a theater specific camo uniform.

[Shuman 14]

Well if they approve Multi-Cam or a close derivative I still have my uniforms available...and I saved the patches/nametapes..... the real advantage if it is selected DOD wide will be the better availability for all. As uniforms go mine was pretty durable.

Right now I loathe paying any more on anything ACU.

I feel you. I had two footlockers full of BDUs (which I donated to a cadet squadron) I now only have the required four pairs of ACUs. They will fall apart before I buy anything else.

Hope they figure this "new" uniform out soon.

[lordmonar]

But the problem is that "one" pattern really only works in the fertile crescent during the spring time.

And then we are back to the whole argument about a UCP.    "Works" is a value laden term.   The ACU's do work.  Just not as good a desert multi-cam.

You mention cost, I would submit to you that having one olive drab garrison/work uniform and one theater camo uniform will be cheaper in the long run. If you put a reasonable wear-out date on the current uniforms, no ones' clothing allowance is going to be over taxed.

ONE theater?   We only going to fight in the desert for now on?   What about woodlands?  Arctic? Jungle?  Savanna?  That is the reason why the Army was so hot for the UCP for the ACUs.    When Desert Storm kicked off they had to buy complete new uniforms and FIELD GEAR....including chemical warfare suits!.....for their woodland BDU wearing solders.  It was the cost of wearhousing all those different equipment loads outs and uniforms that the Army was trying to save with the ACUs.

Back in the BDU days, no one had desert BDUs ... until they deployed. It would be much the same.

Yep....much the same very expensive.

So Shipmate Johnson would go to a MOB site, and as part of his/her pre-deployment certification to go to Ascrackastan (that was funny BTW) would be being issued a theater specific camo uniform.

Again....slowing his deployment....and raising the cost of getting him to the field.

[Panache]

The U.S. Army has altered its government-owned Scorpion camouflage pattern to look almost identical to MultiCam, the trademarked pattern the service has been using in Afghanistan since 2010.

"We don't want to pay for MultiCam, so we're 'altering' our Scorpion pattern in such a way that it looks just like MultiCam.  Pure coincidence.  Honest."

The guys in Army Legal can't honestly expect to get away with that.  It's so blatant.  It's almost as if they crunched the numbers and decided that getting sued, and loosing, is cheaper then just buying the rights.

[PHall]

The U.S. Army has altered its government-owned Scorpion camouflage pattern to look almost identical to MultiCam, the trademarked pattern the service has been using in Afghanistan since 2010.

"We don't want to pay for MultiCam, so we're 'altering' our Scorpion pattern in such a way that it looks just like MultiCam.  Pure coincidence.  Honest."

The guys in Army Legal can't honestly expect to get away with that.  It's so blatant.  It's almost as if they crunched the numbers and decided that getting sued, and loosing, is cheaper then just buying the rights.

But they can't buy the rights because Crye Precision, the developer and owner of the Multicam pattern, isn't selling.
They're willing to sell the government a license to use the pattern, but it won't be cheap.
And they're entirely within their legal rights to do so too.

[Devil Doc]

All I have heard Crye Precison do is CRY CRY CRY about the Scorpion Multicam Issue, New Flash, He created the Scorpion Pattern and sold it the DoD.

[PHall]

All I have heard Crye Precison do is CRY CRY CRY about the Scorpion Multicam Issue, New Flash, He created the Scorpion Pattern and sold it the DoD.

Did he? His lawyers say otherwise.

[Devil Doc]

Crye Created Scorpion for the DoD, when they decided not to use it, He went on and Created MultiCam. I think when it comes to designs/patens as long as one or two things are different is it not infringment. LV Purse or Fake LV Purse, who can tell the Difference?

[lordmonar]

The U.S. Army has altered its government-owned Scorpion camouflage pattern to look almost identical to MultiCam, the trademarked pattern the service has been using in Afghanistan since 2010.

"We don't want to pay for MultiCam, so we're 'altering' our Scorpion pattern in such a way that it looks just like MultiCam.  Pure coincidence.  Honest."

The guys in Army Legal can't honestly expect to get away with that.  It's so blatant.  It's almost as if they crunched the numbers and decided that getting sued, and loosing, is cheaper then just buying the rights.

Or maybe the Army Legal guys know exactly what they are doing.   Like you said....if it were wrong "It's so blatant." who would do such a thing?

[LSThiker]

A decent review of the selection

http://m.military.com/daily-news/2014/05/23/army-selects-new-camouflage-pattern.html

[Garibaldi]

The U.S. Army has altered its government-owned Scorpion camouflage pattern to look almost identical to MultiCam, the trademarked pattern the service has been using in Afghanistan since 2010.

"We don't want to pay for MultiCam, so we're 'altering' our Scorpion pattern in such a way that it looks just like MultiCam.  Pure coincidence.  Honest."

The guys in Army Legal can't honestly expect to get away with that.  It's so blatant.  It's almost as if they crunched the numbers and decided that getting sued, and loosing, is cheaper then just buying the rights.

But they can't buy the rights because Crye Precision, the developer and owner of the Multicam pattern, isn't selling.
They're willing to sell the government a license to use the pattern, but it won't be cheap.
And they're entirely within their legal rights to do so too.

And this is exactly what is wrong with government spending. It's out of hand, which is why we have serious problems paying our bills. We can't keep spending money we don't have!

*runs off to pay $600 in rent with $300 in the bank*