Dual Cool. Which one?

[Stonewall]

I'm putting together a new set of BDUs. My current set has jump wings over GTM badge.

For the new set I wanted to include observer wings, but over which badge?  Jump or GTM?

Thoughts?

FWIW I used to own 3 sets and they went like this:

Airborne over GTM
Observer over GTM
Observer over Airborne

Note: the badges in the pics are not seen down so I already know they are crooked for now.

[ol'fido]

I would go with Observer wings over Airborne. I like the dichotomy of CAP and Military.

[Eclipse]

Go with CAP. the jump wings don't tell CAP people what you can do.

[manfredvonrichthofen]

I mix them on mine, but they are Velcro... But I keep either CIB and GTM, or CIB and EMT... But I don't do AASLT and GTM, or GTM and EMT, idk why, I just don't. It looks better I think with a wider one over a smaller one.

[Eclipse]

Velcro?

[manfredvonrichthofen]

Yeah, it is nice to be able to take them off for laundering. They last a lot longer, and the white doesn't turn blue... Lots of reasons to go Velcro. Just be sure it is the industrial strength, the regular junk will have you loosing them by the end of the day.

[Stonewall]

I tend to agree with you, Eclipse.

Velcro?

Yeah, aformersoldiersayswut?

[Stonewall]

Yeah, it is nice to be able to take them off for laundering. They last a lot longer, and the white doesn't turn blue... Lots of reasons to go Velcro. Just be sure it is the industrial strength, the regular junk will have you loosing them by the end of the day.

Him, yeah dude, that is sort of not authorized.

I have been wearing a civil air patrol uniform for 25 years, that is 25 years of white on blue insignia. I have never had any of the white on the blue start to fade or turn blue. The only thing that has ever happened to me like that is the white on the badges turning brown from the iron being set too hot.

I think you should read think the Velcro situation, because it is not authorized and does not set a great example for the cadets.

[LGM30GMCC]

I know your pain. I have Spings, Jump Wings, Pilot, Observer, and GBD to wear above my ribbons  or similar location(my missile badge sits proudly on the pocket. In blue and white it REALLY stands out)

I actually agree with eclipse on this one. I prefer to wear Observer/GBD on my BDUs for uniforms I'm going to use in ES. My reasoning is that it helps with a wee bit of credibility when talking about both sides of the house to either side of the house for ES.

For my other set I usually choose two of the ones I didn't use on my ES set. (Though I stay away from spings. I think they are the second ugliest badge in the USAF, and I'm not a 13S anymore anyway!)

For blues I generally go for a different combo on my shirt than my jacket. (I don't really have any room left on my jacket and I only wear my CAP ribbons. It'd be nice if I could grow a little still. :-p)

[manfredvonrichthofen]

I tend to agree with you, Eclipse.

Velcro?

Yeah, aformersoldiersayswut?

Yeah, and aformersoldiersaysheckyeah...

I did it on my BDUs before we got ACUs as well.

I asked knowledge about it a few years back, and got an ok so long as they can still be placed in the correct spots, and Velcro doesn't protrude from the sides of the badge. All of my stuff is Velcro... Besides, we have argued this issue before, I got knowledgebase approval, I don't want to break out a dead horse gif 

[NIN]

Go with CAP. the jump wings don't tell CAP people what you can do.

Stonewall doesn't need his uniform to tell CAP people what he can do.  He just does it.

[ol'fido]

What I'd really like to see is a different GT badge. When it first came out, I really liked the fact that GT members got some recognition. Even so, I was never thrilled with the way it looked. I believe that Ground Team is as much an attitude as a qualification, but still if you are going to have a badge, have one that makes sense. I would like to see a badge that more reflects the attitude. I get the circle, triangle, and GT letters, but I have never been sure of the whats around it. It looks like it was vaguely modeled on Air Assault wings, but with ivy or some leafy looking plant in that shape. Ivy and the like is a traditional element in military cap badges but not so much in the Air Force and definitely not CAP. The one Stonewall posted above kink of looks like the beret badge of the Royal Marines. Good company, but they ain't us and we're not them. I did a Google search for "search and rescue logos" and there were a lot of neat badges but nothing that "popped" or looked like it would work for CAP.

[ol'fido]

Go with CAP. the jump wings don't tell CAP people what you can do.

Stonewall doesn't need his uniform to tell CAP people what he can do.  He just does it.

:clap: :clap:

[LGM30GMCC]

It looks like it was vaguely modeled on Air Assault wings, but with ivy or some leafy looking plant in that shape. Ivy and the like is a traditional element in military cap badges but not so much in the Air Force and definitely not CAP.

A wreath around a central design is precisely what the USAF uses these days. Check out page 42 of Airman: The Book 2011 Found Here

It's a little outdated graphic (Still has the old space badge, doesn't have the Missile with Ops Designator (which has a wreath) and doesn't have the cyber operations badge) but shows that at least 25 AF badges have the wreath on them.

[Stonewall]

I asked knowledge about it a few years back, and got an ok so long as they can still be placed in the correct spots, and Velcro doesn't protrude from the sides of the badge. All of my stuff is Velcro... Besides, we have argued this issue before, I got knowledgebase approval, I don't want to break out a dead horse gif 

Grrr. I think I remember that conversation . [darn], I wish they hadn't given the green light for the Velcro, I don't think it looks consistent with the standards. But if its authorized, it's authorized.

[Eclipse]

The KB can't give the green light to anything, they can only quote existing regulations.

Look around the room next time you are with other members wearing CAP uniformm, no one else
will be using velcro.  You won't find a single reference to velcro in regards to field uniforms in 39-1 or
any ICL.

Velcro has no place on the BDU's or field uniform.  No one changes any of the insignias on the uniform
often enough to warrant it, nor are any of the insignias made of leather or plastic.  There is no need to
"sanitize" your insignia as the likelihood of capture by Seas Cadets or the CGAux is very low, and they
prescribe to the Lake Geneva (WI) accords which prohibits the abuse of Prisoners of Starbucks.

Properly cared for, the cloth badges will not run or turn the thread blue.

[NIN]

Velcro has no place on the BDU's or field uniform.  No one changes any of the insignias on the uniform
often enough to warrant it, nor are any of the insignias made of leather or plastic.  There is no need to
"sanitize" your insignia as the likelihood of capture by Seas Cadets or the CGAux is very low, and they
prescribe to the Lake Geneva (WI) accords which prohibits the abuse of Prisoners of Starbucks.

Properly cared for, the cloth badges will not run or turn the thread blue.

I shot liquid out my nose regarding the Lake Geneva Accords.

But Bob basically hits it on the nose. You don't need velcro insignia.

Now, I will say I made up a set of BDUs once with velcro'd pockets.  Biggest.Waste.of.Time.Evah!  I don't use any of those pockets anyway. The next set I just snipped the buttons off and sewed the pocket flaps down. Problem solved.

But I never even considered velro'ing the insignia.

[Brad]

I'd go with GT insignia too, if for nothing else on the off chance that someone doesn't look closely enough at your jump wings and think's you're a basic rated Incident Commander.

[ol'fido]

It looks like it was vaguely modeled on Air Assault wings, but with ivy or some leafy looking plant in that shape. Ivy and the like is a traditional element in military cap badges but not so much in the Air Force and definitely not CAP.

A wreath around a central design is precisely what the USAF uses these days. Check out page 42 of Airman: The Book 2011 Found Here

It's a little outdated graphic (Still has the old space badge, doesn't have the Missile with Ops Designator (which has a wreath) and doesn't have the cyber operations badge) but shows that at least 25 AF badges have the wreath on them.

You are correct in that I had forgotten the occupational badges, but the original GT  badges didn't have the consistent shape that those do. At least not with the one shown which looks more round. I would like to see a better looking badge on the whole.

[Pylon]

Wings over wings (Observer over Lead Sleds)!