Does PD help.

[Dragoon]

This is a question for commanders and deputy commanders for seniors.

After you've had a member complete ECI-13, or come back from SLS or CLC, have they show any immediate improvement in their squadron jobs?

Do our schools actually make our officers any more effective in running the squadron.  If so, how? What do they come back doing better than they did the day before?

[IceNine]

PD as it currently stands is most effective for members that are new to the program and have not become set in their ways.  You will most likely not see a vast change in your unit as these courses are more designed to teach the basics of running a unit. 

AND, a lot of the information passed on through these courses is already going to be in place as there should be a number of members already in the unit with this information

[JC004]

We've had decent feedback on recent SLSs/CLCs on how it helped members at the unit level.  We haven't run the new curriculum yet, but I don't know if those new courses will impact the individual members better or worse than the current materials.

[JohnKachenmeister]

CAP is actually pretty good at producing senior officers through its PD program.  We need more intensity in the early stages of the program, but overall, the PD program works.

You just have to give it time.

[mikeylikey]

No.  As it stands now, the PD is just something to do while you wait for promotion.  We need more reading, more online and more reinforcement at the SQD level.  Did I dream it or was there a rumor that CLC/ SLS may make it online? 

[JC004]

No.  As it stands now, the PD is just something to do while you wait for promotion.  We need more reading, more online and more reinforcement at the SQD level.  Did I dream it or was there a rumor that CLC/ SLS may make it online? 

They talked about that briefly yesterday

[mikeylikey]

^  And.......let me guess, tabled so they could vote on what?  Which donut to get for this mornings breakfast? 

[JC004]

^  And.......let me guess, tabled so they could vote on what?  Which donut to get for this mornings breakfast? 

mostly said it's an ongoing effort and then they began daydreaming of the Cessna reception

[mikeylikey]

mmmmmmmm....................CESSNA!   

[dwb]

I don't agree with putting SLS or CLC online.  80% of what makes those courses worthwhile is getting to exchange ideas and meet people from other squadrons.

PD is worthwhile if the person running it puts on a good show.  If you get a bunch of 100-year-old s'members reading directly off the PowerPoint slides, then it's not all that useful.

[mikeylikey]

Ah.......I have walked out of many CAP presentations/ classes because the instructor had no idea what tey were teaching and they read off ENDLESS Powerpoint slides. 

[JC004]

I don't agree with putting SLS or CLC online.  80% of what makes those courses worthwhile is getting to exchange ideas and meet people from other squadrons.

PD is worthwhile if the person running it puts on a good show.  If you get a bunch of 100-year-old s'members reading directly off the PowerPoint slides, then it's not all that useful.

I get this feeling too.  One of the most important elements of our recent run of SLS/CLC was best practices, and the human element.  For instance, the course director for our last CLC put this stuff together for the students.  I think it really added value:  http://www.pawingcap.com/clc2007.php

[ddelaney103]

Most PD is marginal at best.  If you get a good instructor who presents well and has personal experience that he can layer into the material, the students will come away with good stuff.  The material, however, doesn't stand on its own and a poor instructor can make you wish for the sweet, sweet release of death.

Disclaimer: I can't speak to RSC or NSC - this is about the local stuff.

[DogCollar]

Most PD is marginal at best.  If you get a good instructor who presents well and has personal experience that he can layer into the material, the students will come away with good stuff.  The material, however, doesn't stand on its own and a poor instructor can make you wish for the sweet, sweet release of death.

Disclaimer: I can't speak to RSC or NSC - this is about the local stuff.

I would want a presenter for any PD program for seniors to understand at least the basics of adult learning theory.  Adults need two basic components to any quality learning experience.  1.  The learning must be experiential and 2. it must have a component for the learner to integrate the information into their own context.  In other words, lots of role playing...small group process...etc.   Secondly, time to think about how this might work with the particular and peculiar personalities of individual units.

A Power Point can be an "introduction" to the information, but good presenters will rely heavily on student involvement.

[Dragoon]

To keep this on topic,

I'm asking CAP leaders to weigh in on the benefits they see in the training to improve performance in their subordinates.

Anyone have any specific success stories to share?  So far we've got zero.

[Skyray]

ddelaney said:

Disclaimer: I can't speak to RSC or NSC - this is about the local stuff.

My experience is quite old, but both of those courses were as professionally presented as anything I have seen in the corporate or military world.  Looks like the further up you go, the better it gets.  My recommendation is to bite the bullet, take the time off from work, and attend these schools.

[RiverAux]

I haven't had any experience with the new versions of these courses, but don't recall really ever seeing any significant improvement based on the old ones.  In many cases a member had already been in 1-2 years before taking SLS and had already picked up most of what was in the course.   

[SarDragon]

The new SLS works to tie things that have already been learned together. Then it provides more depth on some subjects than has been previously presented.

[SAR-EMT1]

Speaking for myself, I'd been in as a Senior for about a year (and a cadet for many years) before I went to SLS. Not because I was lazy, but because of work and school conflicts in years past.
For me it was a complete bore. Nothing learned, although I could think of several ways to better deliver some of the lessons.

HOWEVER, right next ot me was a brand new SMWOG who had mailed in her application 3 days before the course. - During check- in she was wearing a business suit. The first day she went to MCSS over lunch and came back sporting a set of blues complete to nametag and 'CAP' pins.
She soaked up the class like a sponge.

End result; it really matters on how soon you go after joining.
For anyone who has been in CAP for more then 1 year it is probably not worth much from a learning aspect. HOWEVER the SOCIAL aspect and the ability to interact with folks from other units is always a good thing.

[NEBoom]

I would want a presenter for any PD program for seniors to understand at least the basics of adult learning theory.  Adults need two basic components to any quality learning experience.  1.  The learning must be experiential and 2. it must have a component for the learner to integrate the information into their own context.  In other words, lots of role playing...small group process...etc.   Secondly, time to think about how this might work with the particular and peculiar personalities of individual units.

A Power Point can be an "introduction" to the information, but good presenters will rely heavily on student involvement.

Sorry for continuing the topic drift here, but I think you hit on something pretty important.  Was anything further said at the NB about the Instructor Training program NHQ is developing?  It's something we sorely need.  We've been tempted to start working on such training here, but have held off waiting for what comes out of NHQ.  No sense in putting the effort in if they are already working it.

Further, what do you all do to make sure your instructors are "qualified?"  We have a handful of people who are experienced and seem to come by instructor abilities naturally, so we try to get them to teach as often as possible.  But that's not addressing the long-term issue of how do we make more instructors for the future?

Thoughts?