CAP Talk

General Discussion => The Lobby => Topic started by: etodd on May 15, 2018, 05:55:33 PM

Title: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: etodd on May 15, 2018, 05:55:33 PM
He had been on the base before with some CAP members ....

https://popularmilitary.com/fake-usaf-officer-records-base-near-f-16-fighter-jets-fbi-investigating/?utm_source=11+Bravos (https://popularmilitary.com/fake-usaf-officer-records-base-near-f-16-fighter-jets-fbi-investigating/?utm_source=11+Bravos)
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: Holding Pattern on May 15, 2018, 06:05:20 PM
He had been on the base before with some CAP members ....

https://popularmilitary.com/fake-usaf-officer-records-base-near-f-16-fighter-jets-fbi-investigating/?utm_source=11+Bravos (https://popularmilitary.com/fake-usaf-officer-records-base-near-f-16-fighter-jets-fbi-investigating/?utm_source=11+Bravos)

He got on base initially as an "escorted guest" for CAP, but no one in CAP could have upgraded that status to "unescorted."

"When asked how he got on the base on other instances, he told them he simply flashed his driverís license."
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: etodd on May 15, 2018, 06:09:52 PM
He had been on the base before with some CAP members ....

https://popularmilitary.com/fake-usaf-officer-records-base-near-f-16-fighter-jets-fbi-investigating/?utm_source=11+Bravos (https://popularmilitary.com/fake-usaf-officer-records-base-near-f-16-fighter-jets-fbi-investigating/?utm_source=11+Bravos)

He got on base initially as an "escorted guest" for CAP, but no one in CAP could have upgraded that status to "unescorted."

Yep. Its not a CAP issue at all. Wish the reporters were not telling that part of the story. He said all he had to do was flash his Drivers License.  Appears some base guards were just waving people on through the gate, as long as they looked military. Some heads will roll. Could have been a terrorist with explosives under his jacket , able to get near jets. Ouch!
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: abdsp51 on May 15, 2018, 06:14:34 PM
There is so much wrong here.  Given the established protocols if this story is in fact legit someone is going to get their butts handed to them.   
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: spree610 on May 15, 2018, 06:33:19 PM
He obviously didn't break the red line or he would have been face down in a heartbeat. Still there's usually SPs at the entrances to the flight line so that's sure to be drawn into question.

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: Spam on May 15, 2018, 07:02:33 PM
He obviously didn't break the red line or he would have been face down in a heartbeat. Still there's usually SPs at the entrances to the flight line so that's sure to be drawn into question.

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk


While personally I would like to comment similarly, I want to urge - STRONGLY urge - those of us who have base access and flight line access to not discuss our local base procedures and local safeguards on this CAP forum. Suggest that we keep it generic and nonspecific.


Respectfully submitted,
Spam



Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: PHall on May 15, 2018, 09:43:30 PM
As soon as I saw US Air Reserve on your Popular Military .com article, I stopped reading.
If they can't even get the name of branch of the service right, what else did they get wrong.
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: etodd on May 15, 2018, 10:40:44 PM
As soon as I saw US Air Reserve on your Popular Military .com article, I stopped reading.
If they can't even get the name of branch of the service right, what else did they get wrong.

Geez.

OK ... for the naysayers, here is the local TV station's story on it.

https://wsvn.com/news/special-reports/air-force-investigating-after-man-says-prank-got-him-kicked-off-south-florida-military-base/ (https://wsvn.com/news/special-reports/air-force-investigating-after-man-says-prank-got-him-kicked-off-south-florida-military-base/)

Watch the video.
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: lordmonar on May 16, 2018, 01:24:00 AM
He obviously didn't break the red line or he would have been face down in a heartbeat. Still there's usually SPs at the entrances to the flight line so that's sure to be drawn into question.

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
I don't know what flight line you are on....but no most of the flight line area is open access.    The SF guys on flight line duty usually sit in a truck where they can see most of their AOR usually near the designated ECP.  But having BTDT getting next to the jets is frighteningly easy.  (Nuke bases is supposed to be a different story).

As someone stated before.   Lots of people failed to do their job in one way or the other.

But other then this guy tried to join CAP at some point.....it's got nothing to do with CAP....other then it is going to make it just that much harder for us to get on base now.
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: THRAWN on May 16, 2018, 08:01:31 AM
He obviously didn't break the red line or he would have been face down in a heartbeat. Still there's usually SPs at the entrances to the flight line so that's sure to be drawn into question.

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

SPs? Don't you mean Air Police? Sheesh.
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: Live2Learn on May 16, 2018, 10:41:36 AM
https://popularmilitary.com/fake-usaf-officer-records-base-near-f-16-fighter-jets-fbi-investigating/?utm_source=11+Bravos (https://popularmilitary.com/fake-usaf-officer-records-base-near-f-16-fighter-jets-fbi-investigating/?utm_source=11+Bravos)

Diomonte Jean is a real piece of stuff.  Stolen pistol, illegal carry, prior intrusions, whatever.  It's sad he was granted escorted access by a CAP member onto the base in the first place.  This young man's history would be disqualifying for CAP membership.  He's got a serious case of 'wannabe hero' without the desire to earn the right to wear the garb.  I hope the escort and the squadron accept this incident as a 'teachable moment'.  Not all who profess interest in CAP deserve an open arms welcome.  Could it be that CAP's recruiting needs are incompatible with an on base, secure area meeting place? 
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: PHall on May 16, 2018, 11:25:37 AM
Still trying to figure out how a CAP member was allowed to escort someone on to the base.
Unless the CAP member was also a member of the Air Force Reserve unit there at the base and they were escorting them as an AFRC member.
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: lordmonar on May 16, 2018, 03:07:28 PM
Still trying to figure out how a CAP member was allowed to escort someone on to the base.
Unless the CAP member was also a member of the Air Force Reserve unit there at the base and they were escorting them as an AFRC member.
Probably the case.  Or that they cut some sort of deal.   We have that here at Nellis.  But we also have to get DBIB cards.
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: Eclipse on May 16, 2018, 03:09:48 PM
In the news piece he said all he did was show a DL and was granted access, which sounds
like the end of a job for someone at the gate, especially if they were civilian.

As to be escorted by a CAP member - I'd guess that was part of recruiting, etc.  Would be pretty
hard to get new members, especially cadets, if they couldn't do three meetings without being a member, etc.

He's also shown in various photos in ROTC regalia, so who knows how many times and how many ways he
found to get on.
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: J2H on May 16, 2018, 03:20:31 PM
We have AIE (DBIDS, but also an automated entry system), and RAPIDScan, which we can scan DLs for NCIC history... normally for CAP parents, we use the RAPIDS, for the cadets, unless they are over a certain age, we check CAPID cards.  But this only applies to CAP meeting nights, no other time of the week.
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: SarDragon on May 16, 2018, 10:26:07 PM
He obviously didn't break the red line or he would have been face down in a heartbeat. Still there's usually SPs at the entrances to the flight line so that's sure to be drawn into question.

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
I don't know what flight line you are on....but no most of the flight line area is open access.    The SF guys on flight line duty usually sit in a truck where they can see most of their AOR usually near the designated ECP.  But having BTDT getting next to the jets is frighteningly easy.  (Nuke bases is supposed to be a different story).

As someone stated before.   Lots of people failed to do their job in one way or the other.

But other then this guy tried to join CAP at some point.....it's got nothing to do with CAP....other then it is going to make it just that much harder for us to get on base now.

The last air base I spent a lot of time at (you've been there, too, after me) had open access to the hangars, but the aircraft ramp areas were red-lined. There were sentries walking around, waiting to catch the folks where they ought not be. I'm sure it's even more restrictive these days.
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: J2H on May 17, 2018, 07:33:01 PM
Coming from Active AF and as a Flightline SF troop... rarely posted up at the flightlines, but ours were keypad locked
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: sarmed1 on May 22, 2018, 11:56:21 AM
Many years ago I was part of a military team that did these kinds of things as part of our job (no it wasnt Red Cell, no I dont know Dick Marcinko)  One of the tenants I learned out of this bit of additional duty time is:  Most people see what they expect to see.  If you look like and act like you belong somewhere, that is exactly what most people take it as...aka face value.  Even during exercises where people should have been expecting "funny" business, we were able to talk our way into areas that for sure should have been secured, all by looking like we belonged. 

MK
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: PhoenixRisen on May 22, 2018, 12:13:42 PM
Many years ago I was part of a military team that did these kinds of things as part of our job (no it wasnt Red Cell, no I dont know Dick Marcinko)  One of the tenants I learned out of this bit of additional duty time is:  Most people see what they expect to see.  If you look like and act like you belong somewhere, that is exactly what most people take it as...aka face value.  Even during exercises where people should have been expecting "funny" business, we were able to talk our way into areas that for sure should have been secured, all by looking like we belonged. 

MK

I do similar things in my office job.  You'd be surprised (or not) the amount of people you've never met are willing to step away from their computers for a coffee break due to a quick "spot check" or "audit" of their system.  Holding a clipboard and acting a tad bit impatient works wonders!  :)
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: PHall on May 22, 2018, 08:16:46 PM
If you look like you belong there no one will question you. Truth!
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: chuckmilam on May 22, 2018, 10:24:19 PM
Social engineering is often the most effective tool in the box.
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: Live2Learn on May 22, 2018, 11:16:25 PM
Many years ago I was part of a military team that did these kinds of things as part of our job (no it wasnt Red Cell, no I dont know Dick Marcinko)  One of the tenants I learned out of this bit of additional duty time is:  Most people see what they expect to see.  If you look like and act like you belong somewhere, that is exactly what most people take it as...aka face value.  Even during exercises where people should have been expecting "funny" business, we were able to talk our way into areas that for sure should have been secured, all by looking like we belonged. 

MK

I do similar things in my office job.  You'd be surprised (or not) the amount of people you've never met are willing to step away from their computers for a coffee break due to a quick "spot check" or "audit" of their system.  Holding a clipboard and acting a tad bit impatient works wonders!  :)

You both seem to describe Edward Snowden's tactics to a "T". 
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: OldGuy on May 22, 2018, 11:53:47 PM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wasp_(novel)
Title: Re: Faking Your Way Onto a Military Base
Post by: PhoenixRisen on May 23, 2018, 12:09:35 AM
You both seem to describe Edward Snowden's tactics to a "T".

Edward Snowden was no computer espionage pioneer... thatís just standard social engineering 101.