Minimum Age Increase

[Eclipse]

I'd have no issue with a 12 or 5th grade, the problem is the homeschoolers who somehow are "different" in the way the grades work
and that's where we used to wind up with the most issues. 

Perhaps a hard 12 for homeschoolers and "12 or 5th" for those enrolled in normal schools, but good luck with the
helicopters there.

[Peeka]

I'd have no issue with a 12 or 5th grade, the problem is the homeschoolers who somehow are "different" in the way the grades work
and that's where we used to wind up with the most issues.

...you mean having a 10 year old kid who is in 7th grade?

[Eclipse]

I'd have no issue with a 12 or 5th grade, the problem is the homeschoolers who somehow are "different" in the way the grades work
and that's where we used to wind up with the most issues.

...you mean having a 10 year old kid who is 7th grade?

Yes.

[Archer]

We've touched on encampments, now let's hear some thoughts on having 12 year olds in other facets of CAP.

[Eclipse]

We've touched on encampments, now let's hear some thoughts on having 12 year olds in other facets of CAP.

OK Mr. Cronkite, is there a question here?

12 year olds are currently allowed to join, in most cases they are prepared for the expectations.  Less then 12 generally aren't.
By 13, especially with a year of CAP behind them there are rarely issues with age, however on the flipside,
we also get older kids who join at 14-15 and are disciplinary issues because they have never been held to the structure CAP
expects.

10 is far too young, 11 is iffy.  11.5 is probably OK in most cases, as is 12.

[Archer]

May I ask why you believe what you do about those particular ages?





And that's the way it is.

[NIN]

Honestly, I think 12 is just about right.

My son just turned 12. He's disillusioned with Scouting (as am I), and I rejoined CAP this past spring so that I could help square away the squadron for his arrival if he decides in the fall to join.

Have I seen 12 year olds cause problems at encampments?

Yep.

Have I see 15 year olds have issues at encampments?

Yep.

One of the bigger arguments against broadening the age range is the appropriateness of the program for younger cadets.

Our training materials are aimed at the 13-17 year old comprehension level  (more or less).

Our CPP speaks about age-separation, and you only have so much ability to "divide" your barracks.

Not specifically encampment related, I still think you have a more difficult time with 10 year olds. They've still not really "crossed that threshold".

I joined at 14. Wish I'd joined earlier.  But could I have handled encampment at 12? Probably not.

[lordmonar]

I'd have no issue with a 12 or 5th grade, the problem is the homeschoolers who somehow are "different" in the way the grades work
and that's where we used to wind up with the most issues.

...you mean having a 10 year old kid who is 7th grade?

Yes.

Don't matter....it would 12 or 11 and in the 7th grade
So the youngest we would ever get would be 11.....even if he was Doogie Howser and working on his Phd.

The idea is to be recruiting the typical "7th grader" who is normally 12....but some of their peers may be 11 or so...depending on where they hit the cut date or if they were advanced a year.   Allowing for the "11 and" allows you to recruit all of them at once instead of telling little Dooogie.....you need to see us in January when you turn 12.

I myself was in this situation.  I started a year early because I started school overseas, my birthday is November 1, so I should have started school at in 1971...instead I started I started in 70.

I  know that this is not really a big problem....but I do think it could streamline and improve our recruiting efforts by basing them on school year age groups instead of just age.

[CAPAPRN]

By the time my son was 13 he was over 6 foot tall, 180 pds and almost seemed out of place as a new cadet. While I am not sure about lowering the age to join, I am certainly against raising it. You aren't just "competing" with BSA (and by the way, we also have female cadets) you are "competing" with every sport, every after school activity, private club teams etc for a commitment. There is a point in a child's life when they decide to make a commitment to one or more things. It has been my experience that this has happened by age 13.  And yes, donations of food and very large/long shoes, boots and pants are always appreciated.

[Майор Хаткевич]

I joined 2 months after 13. CAP became my only activity.

[RiverAux]

While certainly not comparable to being in CAP, I wonder if there is anyone that has worked with the CAP program for kids younger than cadet age that has some thoughts on younger cadets? 

[PA Guy]

I would be comfortable with a hard 12 or in my perfect world a hard 13.  Ten or eleven is just too early for them to grasp the academics, drill, socialization and regimentation required in the cadet program.

[lordmonar]

I would be comfortable with a hard 12 or in my perfect world a hard 13.  Ten or eleven is just too early for them to grasp the academics, drill, socialization and regimentation required in the cadet program.

If we moved it to a hard 13.....you would loose them to school, sport.  Also you will see a dramatic drop in our already dismal numbers.

[Eclipse]

The typical 7th grader is 13 not twelve.  6th grade is generally for 12 year olds unless you're red shirted on purpose or because of a late birthday.

[PHall]

I would be comfortable with a hard 12 or in my perfect world a hard 13.  Ten or eleven is just too early for them to grasp the academics, drill, socialization and regimentation required in the cadet program.

If we moved it to a hard 13.....you would loose them to school, sport.  Also you will see a dramatic drop in our already dismal numbers.

The minimum age was 13 for a large number of years. As in from the 1950's through 2000 or so.

Didn't seem to hurt us....

[BillB]

When I joined CAP as a cadet, the minimum age was 14. But the Wing Commander had the authority to waive that if the prospective cadet requested it. I applied for membership at age 12 with a birthday a month away. And the Wing CC approved my membership.

[jimmydeanno]

I would be comfortable with a hard 12 or in my perfect world a hard 13.  Ten or eleven is just too early for them to grasp the academics, drill, socialization and regimentation required in the cadet program.

If we moved it to a hard 13.....you would loose them to school, sport.  Also you will see a dramatic drop in our already dismal numbers.

The minimum age was 13 for a large number of years. As in from the 1950's through 2000 or so.

Didn't seem to hurt us....

When I joined in '97, it was 12 or in the 6th grade.  I was 15 at the time, so it didn't matter.  However it certainly lowered the potential age to about 10, if there was a homeschool kid in
6th grade.  Youngest I saw join was 11.

[SarDragon]

The typical 7th grader is 13 not twelve.  6th grade is generally for 12 year olds unless you're red shirted on purpose or because of a late birthday.

Maybe in your part of the world. I started 7th grade at 11, and finished at 12, having started a year early. That would make the "normal" start at 12, and finish at 12 or 13, depending on when the birthday is. (Mine is in Feb.)

[lordmonar]

I would be comfortable with a hard 12 or in my perfect world a hard 13.  Ten or eleven is just too early for them to grasp the academics, drill, socialization and regimentation required in the cadet program.

If we moved it to a hard 13.....you would loose them to school, sport.  Also you will see a dramatic drop in our already dismal numbers.

The minimum age was 13 for a large number of years. As in from the 1950's through 2000 or so.

Didn't seem to hurt us....

When I joined in '97, it was 12 or in the 6th grade.  I was 15 at the time, so it didn't matter.  However it certainly lowered the potential age to about 10, if there was a homeschool kid in
6th grade.  Youngest I saw join was 11.

Ah...yes....there 12 or the 6th grade era....and IIRC the youngest was something like 10.....IIRC we had a 13 year old Spaatz cadet...which generated a lot of angsts on the CP and CT.

[Eclipse]

The typical 7th grader is 13 not twelve.  6th grade is generally for 12 year olds unless you're red shirted on purpose or because of a late birthday.

Maybe in your part of the world. I started 7th grade at 11, and finished at 12, having started a year early. That would make the "normal" start at 12, and finish at 12 or 13, depending on when the birthday is. (Mine is in Feb.)

You said it yourself, you started a year early.  Not something easily accomplished any more in the public school system.  Depending on your
kid's birthday, you can red shirt them, but few, if any, schools are going to accept a kid early.

I understand the reasoning behind an "#" or "Grade" system, but the simple fact is that much of a cadet's success is dependent on their maturity level
and the first 3 months of their membership.  Drop them in too early and you lose them forever, not to mention you've also impacted the experience
of the other cadets who have to deal with a kid who isn't ready.

I don't know if it's just the kids running on my lawn, but it seems to me that while the media and marketing machine are trying to
make kids feel more mature then they are, in reality they are actually less mature and capable of independence at adolescence then they were
20-30 years ago (i.e. being "worldly" at 8 doesn't mean you are "mature").

I've met a few surprises - the youngest / smallest cadet who struggles but sticks it out and becomes a top-tier leader, but for every one of those,
there are 5 that join too soon and quit because they are told to stand quietly for 10 minutes (or more likely have to figure out where to stand without
mom holding their hand).