Cadets struggling with CPFT

[Cleaver]

I'm sure this has been asked before but reading a few pages back I didn't see anything.  I'm sure some our seasoned and saltier members will complain for me asking again but I really need to find a solution before a few cadets quit in frustration.   What can I do to help a few newer cadets pass the CPFT.  They are struggling to pass the CPFT and earn their curry achievement.  I have three of them who are fantastic cadets in all areas they are just having an awful time trying to pass the CPFT.  I know they are working on their physical fitness because they have improved tremendously on the sit ups, push ups and sit and reach and pass those now but the mile and the shuttle run are ruining them.  None of them have medical issues.

[Flying Pig]

If they have no medical issues and have been improving in the other areas, I would suggest someone teaching them how to run and how to cut time off of their runs.  Most cadets I see go out and pound their feet into the ground in their Vans tennies thinking it will take time off of their run.  Possibly talk to a local gym or trainer who might be willing to come and talk to the cadets.  Or perhaps a High School X-Country Coach, etc.  Really dropping time is an art.  I have found most cadets who are newer, 12-14 ish, dont have the knowledge to self train themselves.

[Eclipse]

They are struggling to pass the CPFT and earn their curry achievement.

Confiscate their X-box...

[Pylon]

Counseling.

I used a standard form at the squadron (attached) -- the Individual Physical Fitness Progression Plan.

Take a cadet who is struggling with PT (not passing, getting margial passes, etc.), plug in their target scores, and what they're getting now. 

Then sit down with the cadet to talk about what they're doing.  Any cadet-aged person who is regularly exercising and eating the right way (barring medical issues) should have no problems improving their PT scores.  Cadets (again, barring medical issues) who do not improve their PT are not improving for a lack of trying, motivation, or education.  We can fix the education part of it through counselling.  Help them understand what exercises and PT can be done in their off-time to improve their physical fitness and CPFT scores.  Help them understand what foods are healthy and what are not.  While cadets may not be able to tell mom and dad how to change the dinner menu, they do have opportunities to make choices all the time (drink water instead of soda, get a juice or water instead of a energy drink, get the apple slices instead of the bag of chips while out, etc.). 

One of the ways we help all of our cadets get better at this is a monthly session called "PT Facts".  On a rotating basis, cadets are assigned to research a topic related to health and wellness and make a 15 minute presentation at our monthly PT meeting.  This not only educates the whole squadron a little bit, but forces the researching cadet to delve into the subject matter and also hone their public speaking skills.  Great for new airmen.

On an aside, the really nice thing about SIMS is the historical data and the power of that.  By pulling up a cadet's "master record" in SIMS, and clicking the "testing history" tab, I can immediately see a list of all of their past CPFTs chronologically.  I can scan down the columns and see if, over time, a cadets mile time has gotten better, stagnated, or gotten worse.  I can see if their push-ups are increasing, stagnating, or actually decreasing.  The CPFT alone isn't any sort of physical fitness program -- it's simply an evaluative tool to determine if the cadet is doing the right things outside of CAP. 

If a cadet is failing to improve their PT scores after education and counseling, and they and the parents confirm there is no medical issue, it's likely time to begin applying corrective action because the cadet is clearly not holding up their end of the bargain.  Ultimately, if they want to stay in the program they commit to upholding certain certain and progressing regularly through the ranks.  If they don't want to keep up, CAP isn't for them.  We're not a save the whale sort of program.

[Spike]

Isn't attempting to pass enough to say the Cadet is "trying to progress to the best of his or her ability"? 

Since CAP does not have a real Physical Fitness Program (only a gauging test) we shouldn't expect Cadets to do anymore than show up for the test.

So a Kid is FAT, and attempts the PT test every month, only improves a little.  Do you want to kick him out.  I think that Cadet is showing a great deal of courage and mental fortitude in showing up to begin with.  The "skinny stick kids" that can run a mile in 5:00 from day one, are sure lucky they have a fast metabolism.  Must be great not to have ever been the "fat Kid"

[Eclipse]

What's your point?

Allow him to stay a slick sleeve until he's 21?

He can't do anything in CAP without Curry, certainly none of the sizzle we sell.

A cadet without legitimate medical issues who can't get to a Curry-level of fitness in 4-6 months is not making the
effort needed and should move on.   The mile run for a 12 year old is 10:22, 13 year old 9:23 - that's not much more than a brisk walk.

CAP is about meeting objective standards not everyone can get to - that's the point, and what makes the more advanced grades,  especially, have their real meaning.

Not everyone wins in the CP, and that might be the best lesson we can teach.

[Pylon]

Isn't attempting to pass enough to say the Cadet is "trying to progress to the best of his or her ability"? 

Since CAP does not have a real Physical Fitness Program (only a gauging test) we shouldn't expect Cadets to do anymore than show up for the test.

So a Kid is FAT, and attempts the PT test every month, only improves a little.  Do you want to kick him out.  I think that Cadet is showing a great deal of courage and mental fortitude in showing up to begin with.  The "skinny stick kids" that can run a mile in 5:00 from day one, are sure lucky they have a fast metabolism.  Must be great not to have ever been the "fat Kid"

Doing PT once a month for 30 or 60 minutes at a CAP meeting will produce 0 results, and actually puts the cadet at risk for injury. 

When cadets enter the program, they agree to abide by the regulations.  The regulations (52-16) and part of the cadet oath both insist cadets progress through the achievements regularly.  "Trying to progress" isn't sufficient.  To progress through the program, the CPFT standards will get harder as both the cadet gets older, and as they move up through the achievements.  It's gradually increased from a very lenient standard, but cadets must continually improve themselves to keep moving through the program.  That's just a fact of our program is structured.


Also, saying CAP doesn't have a real physical fitness program only highlights that CAP in the unit's your familiar with aren't implementing the program properly.  Holding a CPFT program once a month is not what CAP has in mind.  There is a whole portion of the physical fitness pamphlet about everything from group exercises and stretching, to PT education.  There's no mandatory minimum to the Aerospace Education CP program component, yet units usually manage to mention to involve AE more than 30 minutes a month in their schedules.  Doing any less for physical fitness -- a fully equal element of the cadet program to leadership, AE, character development, and activities -- is a disservice to the cadets.   Units ideally would be conducting both group exercise activities (working in new stretches and calisthenics so cadets can learn from them) as well as educational activities.   Again, doing just the CPFT once a month is, in my opinion, a disservice and a failure to the cadets.

In addition, even if you're claiming the CPFT (an evaluative test) is the only thing done for PT in your area, how is the CPFT different from the other evaluative tests we expect of cadets for progression (leadership and AE)?  We expect them to read their textbooks and study outside of CAP for those tests, so why shouldn't we expect that they prepare for the CPFT outside of CAP?   We shouldn't, because there's no difference.   We only have a few contact hours a week with these cadets, so a portion of what we do is set up structures (evaluative tests) that encourage them to do the right stuff when we're not at meetings.

Nobody is picking on the "fat kid" as you suggest here.  However, first of all, when a youth comes to your squadron for prospective membership, there should be a frank discussion with both the cadets and parents about what the obligations and expectations are of cadets.  What the standards are to move through promotions, what the PT standards he or she will be expected to meet for their Curry achievement and how that will toughen over time, obeying superiors, and all those other expectations.  I actually a full sheet called "Cadet Expectations" that goes with every potential cadet application packet.

There are only two scenarios I can think of for cadets having problems with PT (when they first join, or mid-way into the program):

If a cadet comes into the program, and needs more than 12+ months to pass the Curry-level CPFT requirements, then you've done him or her a disservice by failing to express the entry level requirements.  If you're accepting cadets into your program who are extremely obese, and then they find out after they've joined that they're stuck at Cadet Airman Basic because it will take them 12+ months to make the necessary improvements, then you've failed the cadet by not letting them know what they expectations were ahead of time.  Shame on you, in that case.

If a cadet is already progressing through the program (in other words, has passed at least the Curry standards at some point) and then hits a wall, that cadet is fully capable of overcoming that (again, this whole discussion is barring legitimate medical issues) within 12 months.  The requirements are gradually made more difficult.  From one phase to the next, and from one age to the next year, the requirements don't jump.  It's usually a 10-20% improvement.  If a cadet is at the minimum physical fitness of a curry cadet, they can -- with effort -- make it to the next level within 12 months.  I would bet my own money on it.    What realistically happens is that cadets hit a barrier and don't put any or enough effort into overcoming it.  The worst thing you can do is tell them that's okay or acceptable.

So if a cadet cannot pass PT, it is either because either:
a) the unit leadership isn't at fault for failing to be honest about standards and expectations to recruits
b) the cadet isn't trying, or
c) there's a legitimate medical issue (which we have waivers for).


To conclude, I've had cadets who have had issues with weight, and with some serious motivational pushing, I have watched cadets in my squadron shave 5+ minutes off their mile time.  But ultimately, it was because they tried and we encouraged them to try, and gave them the right education and tools to know how to try correctly.    I'm not saying don't push your cadets.  Quite the opposite, I'm saying push them hard to better themselves.  Find ways to motivate them more.

At our squadron, almost all of the senior members get out there and run with the cadets during the CPFT.  It's motivational for the cadets, and we have a little inter-SM rivalry going (my commander beat me by 2-seconds last time... I was pulling in a slow 6:37 mile).   I usually give the cadets a good-natured hard time about an old man passing them on the mile circut.  And we have senior members who stick behind and run with cadets who have the most difficulty with the run events.   Cadets stand on the sidelines and cheer each other on for other PT events, and we encourage cadets to well surpass the minimum needed to pass.  The last CPFT I recall, we had the whole squadron cheering on one of our cadets as he continued pass the 100 mark doing the 3-count pushups (the proper CAP way, no less).  It's a point of pride for the cadets to do well, but the cadets encourage their fellow cadets who aren't there yet.

It's not that we don't have cadets who fail their CPFT.  It's that we motivate them, and give them the education and tools to pass, and then tell them that we all expect them to pass.   If, in the long-term, they just consistently don't improve, they're not trying and CAP isn't for them.  I don't see how any of that is "hating on the fat kid".

[AirAux]

While some on the board would have you kill and eat the weak ones, I think some commander discretion may be in order.  I once had a cadet that could not pass the stretch and reach.  Could not.  He was about 5' 6" tall and all legs.  Very short from his waist to his neck.  Long legs and short arms.  However, the test is for flexibility.  This cadet could lay his head on his thighs he was so flexible.  We passed him and 3 years later he is a very successful cadet in Puerto Rico and is 6'2" tall and has no problems with any of the PT..  But according to some I should have thrown him out..This isn't rocket science or the real military..  This is a program to help children grow and learn and associate with a better grade of child than that at school..

[Spike]

Ok.  From now on, I will suggest that the Cadets get a Doctors note to move them into Category 3, so they do not have to do PT and only need to pass Aerospace and Leadership.

Seriously though, the heavier kids are at a bigger disadvantage coming into CAP (which is an equal opportunity and non discriminatory organization) than the kid that has a no body fat. 

Is being fat a protected group in regards to discrimination or EO?? 

[NC Hokie]

Also, saying CAP doesn't have a real physical fitness program only highlights that CAP in the unit's your familiar with aren't implementing the program properly.  Holding a CPFT program once a month is not what CAP has in mind.  There is a whole portion of the physical fitness pamphlet about everything from group exercises and stretching, to PT education.  There's no mandatory minimum to the Aerospace Education CP program component, yet units usually manage to mention to involve AE more than 30 minutes a month in their schedules.  Doing any less for physical fitness -- a fully equal element of the cadet program to leadership, AE, character development, and activities -- is a disservice to the cadets.   Units ideally would be conducting both group exercise activities (working in new stretches and calisthenics so cadets can learn from them) as well as educational activities.   Again, doing just the CPFT once a month is, in my opinion, a disservice and a failure to the cadets.

Would you care to share your schedule with the rest of us?  The CPFT alone takes a full hour in my squadron, and I simply do not see how I can devote ANOTHER 15-20 minutes per night to PT without taking time away from other required elements of the cadet program.

I actually have a full sheet called "Cadet Expectations" that goes with every potential cadet application packet.

Now THAT's a tool I could use. Share?

[Spike]

Pylon....where does the PT Pamphlet lay out a PT program to implement.  For Aerospace there are many details on how to construct a program.  The PT Pamphlet is just a piece of paper waste that was thrown together with existing information found on Google at the time it was written.  It does not detail any running, sit-up, push-up or sit and reach skills, plans, goals or objectives.

CAP does NOT have a PT program.  It is not even written into 52-16 other than the part about testing and how we should instill a healthy lifestyle into Cadets. 

All that is required (as written) is testing once a month at minimum. 

Now, please share how you conduct your "all-encompassing" Physical Fitness Program in your Squadron. 

[tsrup]

Pylon....where does the PT Pamphlet lay out a PT program to implement.  For Aerospace there are many details on how to construct a program.  The PT Pamphlet is just a piece of paper waste that was thrown together with existing information found on Google at the time it was written.  It does not detail any running, sit-up, push-up or sit and reach skills, plans, goals or objectives.

CAP does NOT have a PT program.  It is not even written into 52-16 other than the part about testing and how we should instill a healthy lifestyle into Cadets. 

All that is required (as written) is testing once a month at minimum. 

Now, please share how you conduct your "all-encompassing" Physical Fitness Program in your Squadron.

CAP does not have a PT program.  However CAP has PT Goals that are laid out very clearly for each cadet.  It is our jobs as CP guru's to help cadet's achieve these goals.  If this means we have to tailor make a pt plan for our squadron than so be it.  This also doesn't mean that we have to be the ones to do it.  Assign a cadet to do it, but be clear that this is not the time to show off how much more in shape he/she is to the other cadets.  It will ultimately be at your discretion as to whether the plan is safe and feasible. 

If a cadet has been given all the tools they need to succeed and they choose not to use them, then they have failed.

If a cadet has been allowed to flounder along because we couldn't do some out-of-the-box thinking, then we have failed them.

There is nothing wrong with implementing your own pt strategy as long as you apply some good 'ole Mk.1 common sense and some safety conciousness.


On the other side, I'm guessing that a spelt plan was never created by national because of the wide variety of situations we encounter.  One squadron may have a very young base, one could be all older highschool kids.  Geography is also a consideration, I cannot have my Cadets run outside during the late fall, winter, early spring as the temperatures are too low and the risk of an ice related injury is too high, we do have intermittent access to an indoor track, but what about other squadrons that aren't so fortunate. 
This is why we've been given goals to achieve.  We now get a chance to create our solution.  We should be happy that national has kept a little bit of faith in our problem solving abilities.

Or maybe it was just an oversite... as usual.

[davidsinn]

While some on the board would have you kill and eat the weak ones, I think some commander discretion may be in order.  I once had a cadet that could not pass the stretch and reach.  Could not.  He was about 5' 6" tall and all legs.  Very short from his waist to his neck.  Long legs and short arms.  However, the test is for flexibility.  This cadet could lay his head on his thighs he was so flexible.  We passed him and 3 years later he is a very successful cadet in Puerto Rico and is 6'2" tall and has no problems with any of the PT..  But according to some I should have thrown him out..This isn't rocket science or the real military..  This is a program to help children grow and learn and associate with a better grade of child than that at school..

You're not allowed to have discretion in CPFT. However a cadet only needs to pass two out of three plus one of the runs.

[Eclipse]

You're not allowed to have discretion in CPFT. However a cadet only needs to pass two out of three plus one of the runs.

An excellent point - CPFT is not subjective or "best effort".  They make it or they don't.

[AirAux]

Until CAP supplies my squadron with a measured 1 mile track, a measured shuttle run track, a proper chronometer, an objective way to measure sit ups and push-ups, there will be discretion involved and it will bend toward the cadets whenever possible.  Don't like it, fire me..

[tsrup]

Until CAP supplies my squadron with a measured 1 mile track, a measured shuttle run track, a proper chronometer, an objective way to measure sit ups and push-ups, there will be discretion involved and it will bend toward the cadets whenever possible.  Don't like it, fire me..

you're only cheating them.



and how hard is it to measure a shuttle run track... honestly.
There is no discretion involved with push up, their elbows either create a 90 degree angle or they don't, and the manual is pretty specific about what constitutes a complete sit up. 
As for the mile track problem, if you cant solve it with your car's odometer, then there are plenty of websites that utilize google earth to do that for you.  I'll leave the google fu up to you as apparently all of the above was to far above and beyond the manual..

[Pylon]

Until CAP supplies my squadron with a measured 1 mile track, a measured shuttle run track, a proper chronometer, an objective way to measure sit ups and push-ups, there will be discretion involved and it will bend toward the cadets whenever possible.  Don't like it, fire me..

With that attitude, I would actually.  $30 can buy you a measuring wheel from a hardware store.  You might even be able to borrow a measuring wheel from a construction company -- just ask around.  I borrowed one from my company's maintenance department and marked out exact 1-mile courses (and for pacing purposes marked each quarter mile point), as well as measured and marked out a shuttle run stretch.  Borrow or bought doesn't matter -- Walk the mile with a wheel and measure it out the inch.   It's not rocket science, but the regulations are clear.  You do it to the letter of the regulation, or you're cheating.

Saying "Oh, if NHQ doesn't provide me with all the tools necessary to run a squadron without any effort or creative thinking on my part, I get free license to skate around any rules I wish" won't win you any points, sympathy, or respect around here.  And it's certainly not setting a great example for your cadets, either.  They call it leadership for a reason.

All that is required (as written) is testing once a month at minimum. 

Good thing there aren't too many squadrons who only do the few things that are required once a month.  If there weren't squadrons who actually expanded on the bare minimums, there would be a lot more shorted cadets out there. 

[Pylon]

Would you care to share your schedule with the rest of us?  The CPFT alone takes a full hour in my squadron, and I simply do not see how I can devote ANOTHER 15-20 minutes per night to PT without taking time away from other required elements of the cadet program.

Sure, I will find some schedules.  I never found it hard to get it all in there.  We actually did physical fitness twice a month, and the second time a month was group exercise (calisthenics, group runs, etc.).  The group runs were very motivational.  A bunch of cadets out there with their squadron guidon, senior members also in formation, running at double-time for a few miles, having cadet NCOs take turns calling out jodies and leading the flight... it always pumped everybody up and built tons of motivation and esprit de corps.  One of my favorite activities was to fall in the back with a few of the other seniors and run with the cadets.

I actually have a full sheet called "Cadet Expectations" that goes with every potential cadet application packet.

Now THAT's a tool I could use. Share?

Attached.  It's just one document of our welcome packet.  Well, actually there are two welcome packet for potential cadets.  One for the cadet, and one for the parent.  The cadet packet has a letter from the DCC, some recruiting literature (the new cadet programs rack card from NHQ and a squadron flyer), a CAP Fact Sheet, the Cadet Expectations Sheet, and then our application packet -- a checklist of everything they need to join, the CAPF 15, a CAPF 60, Cadet Uniform Return Agreement, and another agreement the recruits sign with their parents stating they will adhere to our program requirements, understand the involvement level and expectations set forth, etc.

[Cleaver]

Thanks to you all.  Most of you had really useful comments and suggestions.  These cadets I am referring to are really outstanding cadets in the other areas so we really don't want to loose them.   I think if I intercede right away and find the root of the problem we should be able to help.  These cadets are not content to be airman they want to progress so I think they will put in the effort. 

Pylon--your attachments are great, thanks for sharing.  You have an awesome attitude.

Spike--Being overweight doesn't have to be permanent.  The cadets just need the right motivation to change it.  It's easier to do when they're young.

[Майор Хаткевич]

Another thing to consider. Before the age of 12-14 (Junior High-High School), how many kids EVER ran a mile?

I know we only did one or two while in 7-8th grades.

Endurance is the hardest thing, and cadets in that age group really do need someone who will help them get there.